"TRT/HRT/Nutrition/Cognition/Wellness/LT student of the game"

[Belekas]

It takes a few days for the PPI effect to turn on, so you won't feel any side effects from it in the first few days. That's why the eradication protocols have to be 2 weeks, the first few days are wasted without stomach acid suppression.

When you took your Antibiotics 4x day you had in mind 4x day after you wake up and not every 6hours, or every 6hours on the clock?

 

[Belekas]

Little update:

Decided to stay on 100mg Test-E E5D so thats 140mg/week FWIW. Easier for me to inject 0.5ml but thats already 125mg and pinning that E5Ds gets me to the total of 175mg per week which is a huge jump from my original 100mg/week split E3.5D FWIW. So will have 2 shots from 1 vial and save the remaining 50mg. Then once every 2 shots I will use 2 saved 50mg syringes and just pin them both separately to meet 100mg requirement. No pain no gain right? lol Nah, its all good for now but if I get fed up then will return to pinning 125mg. 2 shots from the vial and be done with it. I'm nearly 2 months and weeks in this new E5D protocol and only had 4 shots of the 125mg FWIW. No biggie.

Currently undergoing #3 round of H-Pylori Antibiotic treatment on day #4 of the 14 days regiment. Added Bismuth Subcitrate 4x/day 120mg from today. Waiting for probiotic arriving today and will start as well.

No training for the last 5-7 days as cought a flu or something and been coughing like a madman feeling crap af. Anyway won't be training at all during these 2 weeks of Antibiotics treatment regiment and will go out just for a light walk. Good time to stretch and foam roll then so will do a bit of that.

Some supps coming in today so will update when and what I get.

Have a great weekend brothers...More health...More love...More joy...More life!

Best regards,
Bel

 

[sammmy]

When you took your Antibiotics 4x day you had in mind 4x day after you wake up and not every 6hours, or every 6hours on the clock?

I tried to stick to every 6 hours. My sleep medication Temazepam gives me about 6 hours of sleep so that was not a problem. This may not be possible for someone else.

 

[FunkOdyssey]

When you took your Antibiotics 4x day you had in mind 4x day after you wake up and not every 6hours, or every 6hours on the clock?

The way I'm doing it is roughly 6:45 am when I wake up, noon, 5:30 pm, and 10:45 pm at bedtime. Just trying to space the 4 doses as far apart and as equally apart as possible. I use alarms on my phone for the two doses that are in the middle of the day and bring a little am/pm pill box to work.

 

[Belekas]

The way I'm doing it is roughly 6:45 am when I wake up, noon, 5:30 pm, and 10:45 pm at bedtime. Just trying to space the 4 doses as far apart and as equally apart as possible. I use alarms on my phone for the two doses that are in the middle of the day and bring a little am/pm pill box to work.

Fair enough and sounds good to me. I just had my portion at 7pm so will go every 6hrs from now on. I was doing the normal way every 4hrs or so after I wake up. Not the correct way to do it as we want maximum acid suppression around the clock thus taking PPIs every 6hrs. Got my S. Boulardii today as well and take 1 cap with meal 4x/day. Everything else stays the same. Day #4 about to end in 3hrs.

 

[Belekas]

Stopped my H Pylori treatment after 5 days. Have a different plan in place. Attacking the bacteria now naturally for 4 weeks from a lot of different angles and only then once my body is primed, biofilms hopefully damaged, will nuke them with heavy dose of Antibiotics, because theres a high probability that this #3rd round would have failed as well, because my case is severe and unique af, so taking no prisoners and gonna do all that I can before taking meds.

How you doing @FunkOdyssey and how you feeling?

 

[FunkOdyssey]

Stopped my H Pylori treatment after 5 days. Have a different plan in place. Attacking the bacteria now naturally for 4 weeks from a lot of different angles and only then once my body is primed, biofilms hopefully damaged, will nuke them with heavy dose of Antibiotics, because theres a high probability that this #3rd round would have failed as well, because my case is severe and unique af, so taking no prisoners and gonna do all that I can before taking meds.

How you doing @FunkOdyssey and how you feeling?

Hey pretty good. I was actually feeling really good on just the PPI and amoxicillin for the first 4 days. Then I added 500 mg tinidazole (close cousin of metronidazole) 4x a day, and after 3 days of that I started feeling like hot garbage, with worsened reflux and overall malaise and ill feeling. I couldn't continue feeling like that with my responsibilities, so I swapped the tinidazole out for minocycline, which I'm planning to continue for the last 7 days. That seems pretty tolerable so far. I tried adding bismuth subcitrate but a single tablet flared up my gastritis, which was not too surprising as that happened previously with bismuth.

5 days seems like an odd point to stop the treatment. 7 or 10 day protocols have pretty good success rates, so I think I would have pushed at least to one of those milestones. If you've never taken the high dose dual therapy before, I know you think you have a very resistant case, but you might be surprised that it's gone.

 

[Belekas]

Hey pretty good. I was actually feeling really good on just the PPI and amoxicillin for the first 4 days. Then I added 500 mg tinidazole (close cousin of metronidazole) 4x a day, and after 3 days of that I started feeling like hot garbage, with worsened reflux and overall malaise and ill feeling. I couldn't continue feeling like that with my responsibilities, so I swapped the tinidazole out for minocycline, which I'm planning to continue for the last 7 days. That seems pretty tolerable so far. I tried adding bismuth subcitrate but a single tablet flared up my gastritis, which was not too surprising as that happened previously with bismuth.

5 days seems like an odd point to stop the treatment. 7 or 10 day protocols have pretty good success rates, so I think I would have pushed at least to one of those milestones. If you've never taken the high dose dual therapy before, I know you think you have a very resistant case, but you might be surprised that it's gone.

Like I said I stopped because I have a new and better plan how to attack this and don't stress about those 5 days. I had a choice to continue but canceled it because I want to do maximum so my body is primed for this treatment. My treatment will be 14 days total but after 4 weeks. In these 4 weeks I will be doing a lot more stuff but natural so that my body can use the Antibiotics and nuke the bug. There is so much more then just popping high-dose Antibiotics especially for someone like me with issues and pain that not even one doctor has seen. There are studies on that as well, I can link them but they in my phone and I'm busy with other things atm. I'm not leaving any stones unturned and will attack this bitch with maximum effort. Take no prisoners.

Yeah also I had Bismuth added and I think it made my pain worse. Basically was having pain every damn day since starting on the Antibiotics fwiw. Right now I have minimal pain and beggining my natural treatment which involves doing many things for the next 4 weeks going forward. Also about 4 days in on the Antibiotics I started to feel slow, fatigued and dizzy as well. Think thats the Metronidazole as well but IIWII and I will still use that going forward. Well most likely unless I decide to do big dose Amoxicillin and PPI with added Tetracycline. But since I only have like 7 days supply of Tetracycline, I'll add it in the middle of the regiment after 7 days in with or without Metronidazole.

Good luck and hope we succeed!

 

[FunkOdyssey]

Like I said I stopped because I have a new and better plan how to attack this and don't stress about those 5 days. I had a choice to continue but canceled it because I want to do maximum so my body is primed for this treatment. My treatment will be 14 days total but after 4 weeks. In these 4 weeks I will be doing a lot more stuff but natural so that my body can use the Antibiotics and nuke the bug. There is so much more then just popping high-dose Antibiotics especially for someone like me with issues and pain that not even one doctor has seen. There are studies on that as well, I can link them but they in my phone and I'm busy with other things atm. I'm not leaving any stones unturned and will attack this bitch with maximum effort. Take no prisoners.

Ok, well it sounds like you have a good plan. I did something a little bit similar, where I took mastic gum, pylopass, and lactoferrin for a few weeks leading up to to this antibiotic treatment while I waited for the drugs to arrive. Maybe that "softened up" the h. pylori a little.

Yeah also I had Bismuth added and I think it made my pain worse. Basically was having pain every damn day since starting on the Antibiotics fwiw. Right now I have minimal pain and beggining my natural treatment which involves doing many things for the next 4 weeks going forward. Also about 4 days in on the Antibiotics I started to feel slow, fatigued and dizzy as well. Think thats the Metronidazole as well but IIWII and I will still use that going forward. Well most likely unless I decide to do big dose Amoxicillin and PPI with added Tetracycline. But since I only have like 7 days supply of Tetracycline, I'll add it in the middle of the regiment after 7 days in with or without Metronidazole.

This reminds me of that saying about exercise, "the best exercise is the one you'll actually do." I think that applies here as well: the best h. pylori protocol is the one you can tolerate well enough to complete it! You may notice the per-protocol eradication rates are always significantly higher than intention-to-treat, and part of that is people skipping doses and even stopping early because they are feeling like such garbage.

So, I think it is worth thinking not just about what drugs are effective but which are best tolerated, and that is the beauty of HDDT. I don't feel too bad that I only lasted a few days on tinidazole because that was just for extra credit. Minocycline usually makes people dizzy but I learned a hack for that from a study I found in pubmed: if you give Vitamin B6 together with minocycline it prevents the dizziness. Seems to work so far.

Tetracycline might be problematic due to the HCl potentially hurting your stomach. Tetracycline and its derivatives like doxycycline and minocycline always come as an HCl salt. The small dose of minocycline makes this less of an issue compared to the larger doses you need of tetracycline. Hopefully that is not a problem for you but just something to be aware of.

Good luck and hope we succeed!

Yes same to you!

 

[Belekas]

Main interests - Brain health and cognitive functions and gut health. Should have labeled as a sticky and probably need to edit first post to make it loud and clear what my focus on is.

Was just reading this thread and found it intereting:

Anabolic steroid use, brain health and dependence

Anabolic steroid use has been found to have negative effects on brain health, cognitive function, and mental health, particularly in long-term users and those who develop dependence. Highlights Anabolic steroids can lead to smaller brain volumes, reduced cortical thickness, and structural...

www.excelmale.com

All material is welcome especially on brain health and cognitive functions which are also heavily related to the gut.

 

[Belekas]

Recently titrated down to 75mg of TE E5D which is 105mg/week. Also took some AI some days ago to see how I feel and to offset the long-term E2 effect as it effects bile flow, which we are currently treating as well. So 2 more weeks of natural remedies and then will drop the nuke (antibiotics) for 2 weeks.

Current diet pretty much eggs, beef and rice, with lots of different added fats. Some bread here and there if I fancy some as well.

Resumed training after nearly 3 weeks off being sick. So training 3-4x week, not pushing the envelope, light, just to get back into the groove. Cardio post workout 40min strairmaster again. Started at 20 mins and now back to doing 40min as always. Training EOD. On non-training days trying to stay active and walk 5-10km to mitigate chronic pshychological stress that won't change till life gets better for me and mine.

Being sick and barely able to function has fucked up my BP so working again on getting that back in good healthy range as before. Also my BP always elevates when I have a lot of fats in my diet so after the healing phase is done I will reduce the fat intake and feel better right out the gate.

So thats pretty much it. Fingers crossed and moving forward. This year been tough af but IIWII and gotta do what needs to be done. Big plans for next year so need clear, sharp and great working brain and cognitive functions. With TRT or without TRT we will see when time comes.

Peace.

 

[FunkOdyssey]

Recently titrated down to 75mg of TE E5D which is 105mg/week. Also took some AI some days ago to see how I feel and to offset the long-term E2 effect as it effects bile flow, which we are currently treating as well.

I wasn't aware E2 could affect bile flow. I looked into it and it does seem like high estrogen can have some nasty effects on the liver:

The Pathological Mechanisms of Estrogen-Induced Cholestasis: Current Perspectives

Estrogens are steroid hormones with a wide range of biological activities. The excess of estrogens can lead to decreased bile flow, toxic bile acid (BA) accumulation, subsequently causing intrahepatic cholestasis. Estrogen-induced cholestasis (EIC) may ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Coffee is one of the more effective and readily available ways to support bile flow. One of the few certain benefits of coffee is a significantly reduced risk of gallstones. It also has beneficial effects on liver health.

 

[Belekas]

I wasn't aware E2 could affect bile flow. I looked into it and it does seem like high estrogen can have some nasty effects on the liver:

The Pathological Mechanisms of Estrogen-Induced Cholestasis: Current Perspectives

Estrogens are steroid hormones with a wide range of biological activities. The excess of estrogens can lead to decreased bile flow, toxic bile acid (BA) accumulation, subsequently causing intrahepatic cholestasis. Estrogen-induced cholestasis (EIC) may ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Coffee is one of the more effective and readily available ways to support bile flow. One of the few certain benefits of coffee is a significantly reduced risk of gallstones. It also has beneficial effects on liver health.

You learn something new every day and there is so much more about E2. You should study Taeians Clarks FB group as he has a lot of out-of-the-box information spanned in 10+years of postings. Really awesome information and a mountain of knowledge with studies to back it up.

I've drank coffee for +20 years but had to let it go due to my severe gastro issues. Also it used to he hit and miss. Some days it was aight and some days it would fuck me up for all day feeling like a crackhead, wired, hot and anxious af. Considering how severe my issues is I don't fuck with it anymore. I'm using a lot of different fats and UDCA every day with 3 of my main meals and a lot more. I probably should add a tried and tested OX BILE supplement but it's expensive, as I spent a fortune already on all the stuff I'm taking and plan to take, so doing everything without it. Eating pizza and feeling great is all about lots of fats. To help digest fats we have bile which is a natural bodies antiseptic and laxative which cleans the intestines, etc and prepares for final stage digestion. Thats why when I eat fat I feel great and without fat I have massive pain, due to too much stomach acid. Add fat and it neutralises the stomach acid. And on top of that there is chronic psychological stress factor that just fucks everything up and makes a lot harder to cure and possible never cure at all, unless its mitigated. And some things in life can't be taken away just like that.

How was your medication treatment BTW?

 

[FunkOdyssey]

You learn something new every day and there is so much more about E2. You should study Taeians Clarks FB group as he has a lot of out-of-the-box information spanned in 10+years of postings. Really awesome information and a mountain of knowledge with studies to back it up.

Thanks for the tip. I just checked out his website, youtube, and FB and he seems to have a very unconventional approach. Interesting stuff.

It's also interesting that you have more stomach pain without fat. Typically people with gastritis will have more trouble with fatty food. That seems like an important clue to your particular troubles.

How was your medication treatment BTW?

The core of my protocol was the 20 mg esomeprazole 4x daily, 1000 mg amoxicillin 4x daily, 300 mg lactoferrin 2x daily, and 3 billion CFU S. boulardii 2x daily. I felt totally fine on that protocol and ran that for 14 days continuously. During that time, I also had a 3 day stint of tindazole 500 mg 4x daily, followed by a 4 day period of minocycline 100 2x daily. Both of those drugs made me feel quite fucked up in various ways which is why I terminated both of them early. Still, I think even with the shortened courses of the additional antibiotics, it was a very bad time to be an h. pylori bacterium in my gut.

After stopping everything on day 14, I had a couple days of heartburn from the rebound effects of abrupt PPI discontinuation. Since then, I've felt pretty normal. I'm not sure if my digestive symptoms are any different from before I started the treatment, but I have heard it can take quite some time for full recovery after eradicating h. pylori. I do seem to have an improved appetite, but I have also restarted TRT and been lifting weights and doing cardio on the peloton bike so that might be playing a role.

I will recheck for h. pylori with a stool test in a few weeks to see if I successfully eradicated it. Assuming I have, I'm cautiously optimistic that I will see some digestive improvements over time as my gut recovers.

 

[sammmy]

The stool test to confirm H. Pylori eradication is typically done at least a month after taking antibiotics or bismuth, to give it time to proliferate and get detectable if it's not eradicated.

I rechecked mine recently and the test was negative but I still have intolerance to acidic fruits and vit C supplements, which means the atrophic gastritis aftermath from years of H. Pylori hasn't healed. I am running 100mg Rebamipide 3x daily now.

 

[FunkOdyssey]

I rechecked mine recently and the test was negative but I still have intolerance to acidic fruits and vit C supplements, which means the atrophic gastritis aftermath from years of H. Pylori hasn't healed. I am running 100mg Rebamipide 3x daily now.

That is probably a really good idea to use rebamipide for this post-treatment healing stage. I had some in my basement pharmacy that I forgot about and started taking it this morning. Thanks for the reminder.

 

[Belekas]

Hey guys, hope ya'll doing good.

Finally got my girls blood test done. It was a fasted test done around 9.30am in the morning. She is 48 years young and has all low T/Low androgen symptoms for the last 15 or so years. Her libido is non-existant and never was. And all the other classic ones like fatigue, brain fog, memory issues, concentration issues, sex drive issues, loss of joy, motivation, hair thinning, etc and so on and so forth.

Her last period was 6 months ago and from what I see here she has entered menopause. I've calculated her FT and it's 2x below the reference range low FWIW. Low E2 and low FAI and above range high SHBG. Also I'm considered about her 2x Prolactin, but I hope it spiked after sex, as I completely forgot and I think we had it on the previous day, plus she takes some medication as she had an accident fall at work and hurt her but cheek.

Shes fit, good weight, eats good and always been in shape her entire life. Active. Hardly gains any fat at all and can eat whatever she wants but eats properly. Now considered all this crap theres no surprise how fucked up shes been feeling all those years.

I want to start her on Test-E but probably should also start a low dose of Cabergoline to see if she feels better and retest. Basically should just retest and see if Prolactin goes back into normal range but shes sufferring badly and its been a long time coming so we want to start ASAP but obviously want to make all the required steps.

Her calculated FT results:

0.00786nmol/L = 0.558% or 0.2267ng/dL
Female HRT group suggests FT range 0.5-5ng/dL....

Also they suggest E2 100-500pg/mL and hers is 16.9965pg/mL....that looks terrible IMHO...no surprise shes struggling AF...

Any comments from you experienced guys are more then welcome?

Thank you in advance!

Regards,
Bel

 

[FunkOdyssey]

Hey guys, hope ya'll doing good.

Finally got my girls blood test done. It was a fasted test done around 9.30am in the morning. She is 48 years young and has all low T/Low androgen symptoms for the last 15 or so years. Her libido is non-existant and never was. And all the other classic ones like fatigue, brain fog, memory issues, concentration issues, sex drive issues, loss of joy, motivation, hair thinning, etc and so on and so forth.

Her last period was 6 months ago and from what I see here she has entered menopause. I've calculated her FT and it's 2x below the reference range low FWIW. Low E2 and low FAI and above range high SHBG. Also I'm considered about her 2x Prolactin, but I hope it spiked after sex, as I completely forgot and I think we had it on the previous day, plus she takes some medication as she had an accident fall at work and hurt her but cheek.

Shes fit, good weight, eats good and always been in shape her entire life. Active. Hardly gains any fat at all and can eat whatever she wants but eats properly. Now considered all this crap theres no surprise how fucked up shes been feeling all those years.

I want to start her on Test-E but probably should also start a low dose of Cabergoline to see if she feels better and retest. Basically should just retest and see if Prolactin goes back into normal range but shes sufferring badly and its been a long time coming so we want to start ASAP but obviously want to make all the required steps.

Her calculated FT results:

0.00786nmol/L = 0.558% or 0.2267ng/dL
Female HRT group suggests FT range 0.5-5ng/dL....

Also they suggest E2 100-500pg/mL and hers is 16.9965pg/mL....that looks terrible IMHO...no surprise shes struggling AF...

Any comments from you experienced guys are more then welcome?

Thank you in advance!

Regards,
Bel

View attachment 39136

View attachment 39137

You want to check progesterone also because most likely she's going to need to replace all three.

There's an urgency to this situation because women's brains start atrophying and become prone to dementia without estradiol. This damage occurs in the first few years of menopause and is not reversible with later estradiol treatment . If you want to preserve her cognition, you need to act quickly.

 

[Belekas]

You want to check progesterone also because most likely she's going to need to replace all three.

There's an urgency to this situation because women's brains start atrophying and become prone to dementia without estradiol. This damage occurs in the first few years of menopause and is not reversible with later estradiol treatment . If you want to preserve her cognition, you need to act quickly.

What E2 would you suggest getting the same we discussed in PMs? I have T ready, getting 0.3ml insulin syringes today. She is feeling very very bad and we will start ASAP. I fucking hate the medical system and all these fucking doctors which she has seen plenty and not one agreed to run hormonal panel. I'm so mad at this point, you wouldnt believe it.

 

[FunkOdyssey]

What E2 would you suggest getting the same we discussed in PMs? I have T ready, getting 0.3ml insulin syringes today. She is feeling very very bad and we will start ASAP. I fucking hate the medical system and all these fucking doctors which she has seen plenty and not one agreed to run hormonal panel. I'm so mad at this point, you wouldnt believe it.

The pills will certainly work and are infinitely better than no treatment. They might not be the most optimal form compared to transdermal or injectable though: Transdermal or Oral - Which is better for hormone administration?