For those that have known me over the years know that in the past, I definitely had my struggles with TRT and I’ve tried pretty much everything there is to try. I have now been on TRT the better part of 16 years and for the last several years, I’ve been using 60 mg once per week of testosterone cypionate. This has been via the intramuscular route. This normally puts my seven day low point somewhere between 700–750ng. Even if it’s overdose, I still have the phenomenon a feeling sort of bad the day after the injection and always feeling the best to wear the end of the week. This has been something no matter what the dose that has transpired I’ve tried splitting the dose over the years, but even Doing 30 mg twice per week, My lowest point is still well over 1100ng. I do not feel good with levels as high in any regard whether it’s topical or injectable. I’ve been contemplating lately trying an even lower dose, such as 15 to 20 mg twice per week and see if NFL will even further even things out. I have also contemplated just staying with once weekly and lowering it even further to 40-50 mg per week. I would be curious if others have ever dealt with this and if you have found a better solution to get a more even feeling throughout the week for whatever reason in the past, when I have split the dose it seems like my levels keep climbing. As I said, even at 60 mg per week divided into two injections, My levels were very high.
Seagal
Well-Known Member
", I still have the phenomenon a feeling sort of bad the day after the injection and always feeling the best to wear the end of the week. "
Yes, it makes sense to me to split and to reduce your dose.
And you could try testosterone undecanoate. Once per week injections give very stable levels.
Yes, it makes sense to me to split and to reduce your dose.
And you could try testosterone undecanoate. Once per week injections give very stable levels.
madman
Super Moderator
I have now been on TRT the better part of 16 years and for the last several years, I’ve been using 60 mg once per week of testosterone cypionate. This has been via the intramuscular route. This normally puts my seven day low point somewhere between 700–750ng. Even if it’s overdose, I still have the phenomenon a feeling sort of bad the day after the injection and always feeling the best to wear the end of the week.
All these years you have been on the forum and you are still caught up on TT!
You should very well know that although TT is important to know FT is what truly matters.
Just because you are hitting a robust trough TT 700-750 ng/dL 7 days post-injection in no way is it a given you are overdosed as one can still have a not so stellar FT if they have high SHBG.
Chances are if you are hitting a robust TT 700s 7 days post-injection on 60 mg T/week you have high SHBG and from what I remember from your posts on here you stated you have high SHBG.
You need to know where your trough FT truly sits so you would need to have it tested using an accurate assay which would be the gold standard Equilibrium Dialysis.
Again even if you are still hitting a robust TT 700s with high SHBG your trough FT would not be high!
With a trough TT 700 ng/dL and SHBG 50-60 nmol/L it would have your trough cFTV 10-12 ng/dL which is far from high!
Your peak TT and more importantly FT would be much higher but nothing to fret over!
You are going to be running around in circles here fixating on TT!
madman
Super Moderator
Would not even waste your time tweaking your protocol (dose T/injection frequency) until you know where your trough (7 days post-injection) FT truly sits!
TT in no way paints the full picture here!
madman
Super Moderator
As usual Nelson's house is where it's at!
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madman
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I have had it measured with LMSC assay in the past and at the current dose it was 18ng day Seven. I measured it several times using this method and it never changed so at this point I don’t see why it would have changed now. As I said for now I do feel well most of the time and libido is far better at the lower dose. The only gripe I have is feeling fatigued the day after my shot and feeling better the closer I get to my shot.
Really my only reason for answering that way is, I have did labs over the years to the point of nauseam and they never change, ever. I don’t feel any different than when I started this lower dose several years ago and I’ve always had slight fatigue the day after my injection and I’ve always felt better as the week went on closer to my injection. So what I’m getting at is nothing has transpired or changed. It’s just still perplexing to me if I split the dose, my levels skyrocket as much as 1200 ng at the lowest point on the same dose that makes no sense to me no matter how hard I try to figure it out. That’s the reason at this point I am weary of attempting to do that again because I truly don’t even know what those I would use if I did attempt to split the dose. I mean someone that responds as well as I do to, might only need 15 mg twice a week or something crazy low like that. I guess the only way to know if it would work is to try it, but I do know that the same weekly dose I am on split into 2 Injections, Drives my levels sky high, and it has every single time that I’ve attempted it.
Seagal
Well-Known Member
Did you feel any different with twice per week injections?
Phil Goodman
Well-Known Member
It’s not drastically changing your levels, it’s just that your lowest point isn’t as low because more frequent injections lower your peak and raise your trough(which is what you’re testing at).
That does give insight into how high you’re running though, so lowering the dose sounds like a good idea. As well as more frequent injections
Far worse, especially fatigue but my levels were also very high. The only thing that's changed in the last several years since going to 60mg per week is, I started a Statin which is 5mg Crestor 4 days per week. I have read that it can affect SHBG but not sure if that's true or even if the amount would be significant. I mean 60mg once per week has been by far the best protocol I have been on but I do wish I could figure out the fatigue day2 and why everything seems better toward the end of the week
That's sorta what I was thinking and maybe doing 40mg using 20mg Monday and Thursday. At one point I did 200mg every other week and still had t levels of nearly 900NG day 14 but felt like hell the first week,
Seagal
Well-Known Member
Would then only change one variable, i.e. reduction of the dose from 60 to 50.
madman
Super Moderator
I have had it measured with LMSC assay in the past and at the current dose it was 18ng day Seven. I measured it several times using this method and it never changed so at this point I don’t see why it would have changed now.
Make sure you post it next time as there is nothing to chew on when you keep getting caught up on your TT.
You are hitting a healthy trough FT 18 ng/dL.
If you are hitting a trough FT 18 ng/dL then your peak FT/during the first 2-3 days is going to be high as it is expected for one to have a big difference between peak--->trough let alone blood levels will not be as stable throughout the week.
Some men prefer the big swings in peak---> trough whereas others fare better injecting more frequently which would clip the peak/trough and result in more stable blood levels throughout the week.
So do you think it would be worthwhile lowering the total dose and splitting it or lowering the once weekly dose to 50mg and then get new labs? I would of course wait 6 weeks or so to see where things land and again the only thing that has changed in the last several years is the low dose statin.
madman
Super Moderator
It’s just still perplexing to me if I split the dose, my levels skyrocket as much as 1200 ng at the lowest point on the same dose that makes no sense to me no matter how hard I try to figure it out. That’s the reason at this point I am weary of attempting to do that again because I truly don’t even know what those I would use if I did attempt to split the dose. I
This would be expected when splitting the weekly dose and injecting more frequently as it will clip the peak--->trough as the peak would be lower and your trough would be higher as you are now hitting a true trough 3.5 days (84 hrs) post-injection instead of 7 days (168 hrs) post-injection.
madman
Super Moderator
If you decide to stick with once weekly and lower your dose slightly it will bring down your peak/trough but keep in mind you do not want to end up with too low a trough.
If it were me I would want to keep trough around 15 ng/dL if you want to hit a healthy trough FT.
Could you bring it down lower.....sure but only time would tell how you will fare!
I would prefer splitting the weekly dose to clip the peak--->trough but again you need to decide on what trough FT you are willing to settle on as your weekly dose will dictate such!
madman
Super Moderator
What lab did you use when you had your blood work done?
Post a screenshot of your most recent labs which shows the assay/reference ranges used for TT, FT and SHBG.
Throw estradiol in there too!
Where does your RBCs, hemoglobin, hematocrit, iron/ferritin sit?
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