How Much Usable Energy Do you Have?

[Fortunate]

For me, one of the biggest upsides to TRT has been better energy. However, I sometimes wonder if I should be content with the energy I have?

I am currently 49. I get up pretty early - usually 5-6AM every day. I drink a decent amount of coffee, but am done by around 8AM. I use Natesto three times a day: typically around 7:30AM, Noon and 5PM. It's not the 6-8 hour window that is recommended, but is simply easier for me to stay on a convenient pattern.

With the above, I generally have decent energy (not Superman, but decent). But, I usually get super lame in the early evening. Some time around 8-9PM every night, I start to feel the need to hit the sack, and I am generally in bed 9-10PM. I recall when I was in my late 30's being able to stay up late at night and work on side projects. I remember John Crisler saying something along the lines of: "A guy's most productive hours can be after 10PM" and TRT helps him keep that.

Side note: years ago, I struggled with sleep and it was a major fuel for migraines that I have suffered from since I was young. So, I have been on Trazadone and low dose Doxepin to help induce and maintain sleep. Not ideal, but it seems to work.

While my sleep requirements are not unreasonable (I feel best on roughly 8 hours), I wonder if I should feel so tired so early in the evening? Like many others here, I have bounced around on various forms and protocols of TRT. When on injections such as Xyosted, I probably have more overall energy compared with being on Natesto. However, too much of a good thing can be bad, as it has also disrupted sleep for me. While I think I have a reasonable amount of useful energy, I also feel a bit like an old man when I am out with my wife and friends past 8:30PM. I am curious how others perceive their energy levels, both on and off TRT?

 

[DS3]

For me, one of the biggest upsides to TRT has been better energy. However, I sometimes wonder if I should be content with the energy I have?

I am currently 49. I get up pretty early - usually 5-6AM every day. I drink a decent amount of coffee, but am done by around 8AM. I use Natesto three times a day: typically around 7:30AM, Noon and 5PM. It's not the 6-8 hour window that is recommended, but is simply easier for me to stay on a convenient pattern.

With the above, I generally have decent energy (not Superman, but decent). But, I usually get super lame in the early evening. Some time around 8-9PM every night, I start to feel the need to hit the sack, and I am generally in bed 9-10PM. I recall when I was in my late 30's being able to stay up late at night and work on side projects. I remember John Crisler saying something along the lines of: "A guy's most productive hours can be after 10PM" and TRT helps him keep that.

Side note: years ago, I struggled with sleep and it was a major fuel for migraines that I have suffered from since I was young. So, I have been on Trazadone and low dose Doxepin to help induce and maintain sleep. Not ideal, but it seems to work.

While my sleep requirements are not unreasonable (I feel best on roughly 8 hours), I wonder if I should feel so tired so early in the evening? Like many others here, I have bounced around on various forms and protocols of TRT. When on injections such as Xyosted, I probably have more overall energy compared with being on Natesto. However, too much of a good thing can be bad, as it has also disrupted sleep for me. While I think I have a reasonable amount of useful energy, I also feel a bit like an old man when I am out with my wife and friends past 8:30PM. I am curious how others perceive their energy levels, both on and off TRT?

When I take low dose TRT, 50-70 mg injectable testosterone alongside HCG, mental clarity may be slightly better and overall energy for me may be slightly better. However, similar to what you are finding, I would also feel very tired around 7:30-8:00 pm, falling asleep in my chair around 8:30. I also had very low energy for the gym, which was quite troublesome.

There are some benefits of low dose TRT, and yet feeling like an old man when I am only 30 years old is not a trade off I am willing to make.

 

[Fortunate]

When I take low dose TRT, 50-70 mg injectable testosterone alongside HCG, mental clarity may be slightly better and overall energy for me may be slightly better. However, similar to what you are finding, I would also feel very tired around 7:30-8:00 pm, falling asleep in my chair around 8:30. I also had very low energy for the gym, which was quite troublesome.

There are some benefits of low dose TRT, and yet feeling like an old man when I am only 30 years old is not a trade off I am willing to make.

Interesting. Are thinking that TRT actually contributed to your feeling tired or that it’s just not enough benefit?

Happy New Year, Everyone!

 

[DS3]

Interesting. Are thinking that TRT actually contributed to your feeling tired or that it’s just not enough benefit?

Happy New Year, Everyone!

Using too low of a dosage contributed to me feeling lowered energy, yes. Too high of a dosage also contributes to lower energy for me.

 

[Fortunate]

Using too low of a dosage contributed to me feeling lowered energy, yes. Too high of a dosage also contributes to lower energy for me.

Bummer. So where are you now with things?

I am currently on Natesto. Supposedly, levels swing high and then drop down low, multiple times a day. For some reason, I don’t really seem to feel it. At least not enough to be aware of. However, part of the reason for this thread is that I’m wondering if I’d have more consistent energy levels if I tried to go back on some type of ideal injection protocol. I’m considering trying it to compare closely to my energy levels on Natesto.

Sometimes when I was on injections, I would feel great for a few hours and then feel a crash later on. Not sure if it’s from aromatization? I for sure felt this way on creams. Tons of energy early on, and then a horrible crash feeling about 10 to 12 hours later. It was awful.

 

[xcpatr922]

I feel pretty much the same with you, daily 8-10mg T-Cy, by 8:30 I always in the bed and wake up mostly 6pm. I feel really good in the morning and 9-10 hours sleep cycle.

 

[Charliebizz]

For me, one of the biggest upsides to TRT has been better energy. However, I sometimes wonder if I should be content with the energy I have?

I am currently 49. I get up pretty early - usually 5-6AM every day. I drink a decent amount of coffee, but am done by around 8AM. I use Natesto three times a day: typically around 7:30AM, Noon and 5PM. It's not the 6-8 hour window that is recommended, but is simply easier for me to stay on a convenient pattern.

With the above, I generally have decent energy (not Superman, but decent). But, I usually get super lame in the early evening. Some time around 8-9PM every night, I start to feel the need to hit the sack, and I am generally in bed 9-10PM. I recall when I was in my late 30's being able to stay up late at night and work on side projects. I remember John Crisler saying something along the lines of: "A guy's most productive hours can be after 10PM" and TRT helps him keep that.

Side note: years ago, I struggled with sleep and it was a major fuel for migraines that I have suffered from since I was young. So, I have been on Trazadone and low dose Doxepin to help induce and maintain sleep. Not ideal, but it seems to work.

While my sleep requirements are not unreasonable (I feel best on roughly 8 hours), I wonder if I should feel so tired so early in the evening? Like many others here, I have bounced around on various forms and protocols of TRT. When on injections such as Xyosted, I probably have more overall energy compared with being on Natesto. However, too much of a good thing can be bad, as it has also disrupted sleep for me. While I think I have a reasonable amount of useful energy, I also feel a bit like an old man when I am out with my wife and friends past 8:30PM. I am curious how others perceive their energy levels, both on and off TRT?

One of my biggest hurdles is low energy. You sound to be doing pretty damn good. I’m 10 years younger then you and say I’m pretty much tired 24/7. Thankfully I’m still a pretty driven person and when I get into something I can push throug ( trt def helps with that). But shit if I sit down I could fall asleep any time of the day lol

 

[Systemlord]

I'm currently on Jatenzo 237mg twice daily and my superman energy is insane, I don't want my energy lower. I naturally have an insane energy level, walk as fast as some people jog.

I don't get tired throughout the day and am fully awake until bed time.

I'm turning 50 years old in March.

 

[Fortunate]

I'm currently on Jatenzo 237mg twice daily and my superman energy is insane, I don't want my energy lower. I naturally have an insane energy level, walk as fast as some people jog.

That’s awesome. I’ve seen some of your comments about Jatenzo. Happy with it? Downsides?

 

[DS3]

I'm currently on Jatenzo 237mg twice daily and my superman energy is insane, I don't want my energy lower. I naturally have an insane energy level, walk as fast as some people jog.

I don't get tired throughout the day and am fully awake until bed time.

I'm turning 50 years old in March.

Are you still happy with Jatenzo? I know you were posting about your T levels dropping after 2 months. Do you feel better on it than injections?

 

[Systemlord]

Happy with it?

My glucose levels are currently 96, I'm happy about that. 5-6 months ago my peak glucose was in the 400-500's and fasting glucose 300's.

A1C was 12.

Downsides?

I don't have a women in my life yet.

 

[Systemlord]

Are you still happy with Jatenzo?

Yes, very happy with Jatenzo.

I know you were posting about your T levels dropping after 2 months. Do you feel better on it than injections?

The testosterone numbers declining on Jatenzo had to do with a potassium deficiency, poor gut absorption do to GI cramping upon eating and add to the fact a higher Jatenzo dosage increased the demand for potassium further crushing my potassium levels.

I just messaged my doctor about wanting a dosage decrease, after fixing my low potassium and digestive issues as a direct result of low potassium, I'm now absorpting Jatenzo much better and I feel the need to reduce the dosage.

My hematocrit on the 237mg dosage is 57% and hemoglobin 19.2. When I was at the 198mg dosage, hematocrit was 55% and hemoglobin 18.0.

The injections was.nightmare, way too many side effects and symptoms. It took 4 years to learn my body doesn't like hormone therapies with a longer half-life.

 

[Fortunate]

Yes, very happy with Jatenzo.

The testosterone numbers declining on Jatenzo had to do with a potassium deficiency, poor gut absorption do to GI cramping upon eating and add to the fact a higher Jatenzo dosage increased the demand for potassium further crushing my potassium levels.

I just messaged my doctor about wanting a dosage decrease, after fixing my low potassium and digestive issues as a direct result of low potassium, I'm now absorpting Jatenzo much better and I feel the need to reduce the dosage.

My hematocrit on the 237mg dosage is 57% and hemoglobin 19.2. When I was at the 198mg dosage, hematocrit was 55% and hemoglobin 18.0.

The injections was.nightmare, way too many side effects and symptoms. It took 4 years to learn my body doesn't like hormone therapies with a longer half-life.

I am with you on injections. I can’t seem to find a way to tolerate them for very long. My fallback has been Natesto. Ever consider it?

 

[Charliebizz]

I am with you on injections. I can’t seem to find a way to tolerate them for very long. My fallback has been Natesto. Ever consider it?

Do you have any ideas why that might be.

I am with you on injections. I can’t seem to find a way to tolerate them for very long. My fallback has been Natesto. Ever consider it?

Have you ever tested cortisol levels. If so have you done it on your different trt protocols?

 

[Fortunate]

Have you ever tested cortisol levels. If so have you done it on your different trt protocols?

Once, while on one protocol. Wasn't sure what to make of it.

Do you have any ideas why that might be.

I wish I did. It could be: esterified T vs. non-esterified (Natesto is not esterified); the oil; the preservatives and/or alcohol; the pharmacokinetics of T and E2.

In general, but not always, I tolerate Xyosted better than other forms of enanthate. This would suggest preservatives and/or alcohol play a role. But, I sometimes get the same bad feeling on Xyosted. I have tried various oils. I could probably test this out more. Esterfied vs. not may make sense, but I also don't tolerate creams at all, so not sure that's the issue.

At the end of the day, I suspect it's related to fluctuations in and relative levels of T and/or E2 and I just haven't found the right dosing and interval yet.

One thing I owe more attention to is low dose, frequent injections. I have done a few short trials, but maybe not long enough.

In any case, glad Jatenzo works for you.

 

[Charliebizz]

Once, while on one protocol. Wasn't sure what to make of it.


I wish I did. It could be: esterified T vs. non-esterified (Natesto is not esterified); the oil; the preservatives and/or alcohol; the pharmacokinetics of T and E2.

In general, but not always, I tolerate Xyosted better than other forms of enanthate. This would suggest preservatives and/or alcohol play a role. But, I sometimes get the same bad feeling on Xyosted. I have tried various oils. I could probably test this out more. Esterfied vs. not may make sense, but I also don't tolerate creams at all, so not sure that's the issue.

At the end of the day, I suspect it's related to fluctuations in and relative levels of T and/or E2 and I just haven't found the right dosing and interval yet.

One thing I owe more attention to is low dose, frequent injections. I have done a few short trials, but maybe not long enough.

In any case, glad Jatenzo works for you.

Can you share what the levels were ?

I also have trouble on injections. And can’t tolerate cream for too long. But I don’t think natesto would be a long term solution for me for compliance reasons. I’m sure if I felt amazing I could make it work. But tough to make the jump. Plus my libido is actually great on injections.
I do have low shbg so I don’t get all the benefits from trt like muscle building and energy. But I’m better over all with it then not.

 

[Systemlord]

Ever consider it?

Spraying myself in the nose three times a day doesn't seem practical unless you have no other choice.

 

[Bremster]

For me, one of the biggest upsides to TRT has been better energy. However, I sometimes wonder if I should be content with the energy I have?

I am currently 49. I get up pretty early - usually 5-6AM every day. I drink a decent amount of coffee, but am done by around 8AM. I use Natesto three times a day: typically around 7:30AM, Noon and 5PM. It's not the 6-8 hour window that is recommended, but is simply easier for me to stay on a convenient pattern.

With the above, I generally have decent energy (not Superman, but decent). But, I usually get super lame in the early evening. Some time around 8-9PM every night, I start to feel the need to hit the sack, and I am generally in bed 9-10PM. I recall when I was in my late 30's being able to stay up late at night and work on side projects. I remember John Crisler saying something along the lines of: "A guy's most productive hours can be after 10PM" and TRT helps him keep that.

Side note: years ago, I struggled with sleep and it was a major fuel for migraines that I have suffered from since I was young. So, I have been on Trazadone and low dose Doxepin to help induce and maintain sleep. Not ideal, but it seems to work.

While my sleep requirements are not unreasonable (I feel best on roughly 8 hours), I wonder if I should feel so tired so early in the evening? Like many others here, I have bounced around on various forms and protocols of TRT. When on injections such as Xyosted, I probably have more overall energy compared with being on Natesto. However, too much of a good thing can be bad, as it has also disrupted sleep for me. While I think I have a reasonable amount of useful energy, I also feel a bit like an old man when I am out with my wife and friends past 8:30PM. I am curious how others perceive their energy levels, both on and off TRT?

 

[Bremster]

For me, one of the biggest upsides to TRT has been better energy. However, I sometimes wonder if I should be content with the energy I have?

I am currently 49. I get up pretty early - usually 5-6AM every day. I drink a decent amount of coffee, but am done by around 8AM. I use Natesto three times a day: typically around 7:30AM, Noon and 5PM. It's not the 6-8 hour window that is recommended, but is simply easier for me to stay on a convenient pattern.

With the above, I generally have decent energy (not Superman, but decent). But, I usually get super lame in the early evening. Some time around 8-9PM every night, I start to feel the need to hit the sack, and I am generally in bed 9-10PM. I recall when I was in my late 30's being able to stay up late at night and work on side projects. I remember John Crisler saying something along the lines of: "A guy's most productive hours can be after 10PM" and TRT helps him keep that.

Side note: years ago, I struggled with sleep and it was a major fuel for migraines that I have suffered from since I was young. So, I have been on Trazadone and low dose Doxepin to help induce and maintain sleep. Not ideal, but it seems to work.

While my sleep requirements are not unreasonable (I feel best on roughly 8 hours), I wonder if I should feel so tired so early in the evening? Like many others here, I have bounced around on various forms and protocols of TRT. When on injections such as Xyosted, I probably have more overall energy compared with being on Natesto. However, too much of a good thing can be bad, as it has also disrupted sleep for me. While I think I have a reasonable amount of useful energy, I also feel a bit like an old man when I am out with my wife and friends past 8:30PM. I am curious how others perceive their energy levels, both on and off TRT?

My routine is very similar, I have been on TRT for years and I work out every day, and I tend to crash around 8 or 9 in the evening. Recently, within the past couple of weeks, I have decided to increase my protein intake, get it up to at least 65 grams per day, what a difference it has made. It is probably a little premature, but so far it looks good. The other problem I was having was feeling tired in the morning, it would seem to work itself out as the day went on, after couple of cups of coffee. I am like you if I can get 8 hours sleep, the tiredness and other issues tend to go away, but I don't always get 8 hours, I wake up at around one AM, then I read, and there goes my 8 hours. I am hoping the higher protein intake might help the sleep issue too. The other thing I noticed about the higher protein intake is nocturnal erections, they are simply off the chart. By the way I am twice your age, I will be 90 in a few days.

 

[Fortunate]

My routine is very similar, I have been on TRT for years and I work out every day, and I tend to crash around 8 or 9 in the evening. Recently, within the past couple of weeks, I have decided to increase my protein intake, get it up to at least 65 grams per day, what a difference it has made. It is probably a little premature, but so far it looks good. The other problem I was having was feeling tired in the morning, it would seem to work itself out as the day went on, after couple of cups of coffee. I am like you if I can get 8 hours sleep, the tiredness and other issues tend to go away, but I don't always get 8 hours, I wake up at around one AM, then I read, and there goes my 8 hours. I am hoping the higher protein intake might help the sleep issue too. The other thing I noticed about the higher protein intake is nocturnal erections, they are simply off the chart. By the way I am twice your age, I will be 90 in a few days.

Holy smokes - great for you!! Can I ask what your TRT protocol is? I assume that over the years, you have learned a lot of lessons. Do you mind sharing your wisdom?