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Mathostx

New Member
Hi guys,
I'll cut to the chase, I know everyone's time is valuable but I need help figuring out something and it's driving me crazy.

Im 41m , workout 3 times a week heavy lifting. Jiujitsu 4 times a week sometimes 2x a day.
Experienced slow recovery and other related symptoms of low T. Lab results showed low Free and Total Test so Urologist started me on Test C / 100mg a week / 2 injections of 50mg each (Monday - Thursday)
--
First 2 weeks were amazing, felt incredible, recovery was ideal. Then I started feeling like shit (currently week 6).
On week 4 I called and told them I needed labs due to feeling really lethargic, heavy arms, no motivation and really really bad heartburn. (acid reflux). It gets so bad my voice is hoarse.
I did notice this on my SECOND day after my first shot. This and extreme hunger.

Labs results:
These are the values:
E2 - 13 ( range 15-30) pg/ml
Test - 822
Free Androgen Index - 75
SHBG - 38 nmoL/L

A close friend (NP) told me that my e2 tanked. The ranges are 10-32.

I feel better with motivation and energy now, but the heartburn or acid reflux hasn't subsided.
I read that it's either low estradiol causing this OR a jump in testosterone causing the release of some peptides like Ghrelin (and others) that could be increasing stomach acid production. (Still does not make much sense since stomach acid is there anyway, emptying or digesting food).
Could it be bile increase, being bile reflux and not acid?
Are my levels balancing out with time?

Should I continue?
My next labs are in 4 weeks and I should be seeing the doc then.
Any advise or similar stories? Anyone knowledgeable enough with this issue?

I need desperate help..

Thanks!
 
Defy Medical TRT clinic doctor

Cataceous

Super Moderator
A couple things: The testosterone dose may be too high for you. If that serum measurement is a trough value then your peak could be as high as 1,200 ng/dL. That's approaching double the average for healthy young men. Reduced intratesticular aromatization may be contributing to your low estradiol. If so then hCG is a possible treatment; it is commonly added to TRT in low doses. Would your urologist be willing to prescribe this?
 

CanadaJim

Member
I would be very interested in hearing thoughts on this as well, as I experienced pretty much the same sides when on self-prescribed test (at the same dose). Radiating chest pain (which after numerous cardiac tests and bloodwork doc said was most likely GERD which I have never had in my life), weak heavy arms, digestive issues. I am also active and fit as well - hit the gym 4-5 times a week (weights and circuit). I was also prescribed a PPI (pantoloc) and sent for numerous tests. The honeymoon period was great, but as honeymoons do, did not last. My estrogen was indicating high and my SHBG was also indicting high. So this could be the differing factor with regards to your experience.
 

Mathostx

New Member
A couple things: The testosterone dose may be too high for you. If that serum measurement is a trough value then your peak could be as high as 1,200 ng/dL. That's approaching double the average for healthy young men. Reduced intratesticular aromatization may be contributing to your low estradiol. If so then hCG is a possible treatment; it is commonly added to TRT in low doses. Would your urologist be willing to prescribe this?
Yeah but I don't know in other states but HCG here in Texas is crazy expensive. My prescribed dose is only 100mg a week which averages to normal male production correct?

So it could be that my T is high and causing me all these symptoms rather than low e2?
 

Mathostx

New Member
I would be very interested in hearing thoughts on this as well, as I experienced pretty much the same sides when on self-prescribed test (at the same dose). Radiating chest pain (which after numerous cardiac tests and bloodwork doc said was most likely GERD which I have never had in my life), weak heavy arms, digestive issues. I am also active and fit as well - hit the gym 4-5 times a week (weights and circuit). I was also prescribed a PPI (pantoloc) and sent for numerous tests. The honeymoon period was great, but as honeymoons do, did not last. My estrogen was indicating high and my SHBG was also indicting high. So this could be the differing factor with regards to your experience.
So then what did you do? What changed in your protocol?
 

Nelson Vergel

Founder, ExcelMale.com
I would check for H. Pylori infection via an urea breath test. I would also look into getting an upper GI endoscopy.

I would also try to minimize caffeine, chocolate, spicy foods, alcohol, and eating late.
 

Cataceous

Super Moderator
Yeah but I don't know in other states but HCG here in Texas is crazy expensive. My prescribed dose is only 100mg a week which averages to normal male production correct?

So it could be that my T is high and causing me all these symptoms rather than low e2?
I'm seeing GoodRx hCG prices of around $110 for Texas. That's for 10,000 IU. Not totally cheap, but not ridiculous. The Pregnyl brand is about ten dollars more than no-name. If you want cheaper then you can order from AllDayChemist. Guys on this forum have had success with that.

In fact 100 mg per week of testosterone cypionate is on the high side compared to natural production. This is averaging 10 mg pure testosterone per day, whereas the natural average for healthy young men is more like 6-7 mg. The normal range is about 3-9 mg. There's some theoretical justification for using a little more exogenous testosterone, because a long ester such as cypionate is not providing much daily variation in serum testosterone—unlike natural levels. However, the extra needed would be less than 20%.

It is possible to have various symptoms from high testosterone, low estradiol, or even a high testosterone-to-estradiol ratio. Because most of us do not know in advance what our optimal hormone levels are, I believe it's prudent to start no higher than the averages for healthy young men. It's also important to be patient once this is achieved. It can take months for things to settle down after starting TRT. If symptoms of hypogonadism linger then the dose may slowly be increased.
 

SkyWarn

Active Member
I'm seeing GoodRx hCG prices of around $110 for Texas. That's for 10,000 IU. Not totally cheap, but not ridiculous. The Pregnyl brand is about ten dollars more than no-name. If you want cheaper then you can order from AllDayChemist. Guys on this forum have had success with that.

In fact 100 mg per week of testosterone cypionate is on the high side compared to natural production. This is averaging 10 mg pure testosterone per day, whereas the natural average for healthy young men is more like 6-7 mg. The normal range is about 3-9 mg. There's some theoretical justification for using a little more exogenous testosterone, because a long ester such as cypionate is not providing much daily variation in serum testosterone—unlike natural levels. However, the extra needed would be less than 20%.

It is possible to have various symptoms from high testosterone, low estradiol, or even a high testosterone-to-estradiol ratio. Because most of us do not know in advance what our optimal hormone levels are, I believe it's prudent to start no higher than the averages for healthy young men. It's also important to be patient once this is achieved. It can take months for things to settle down after starting TRT. If symptoms of hypogonadism linger then the dose may slowly be increas
I'm seeing GoodRx hCG prices of around $110 for Texas. That's for 10,000 IU. Not totally cheap, but not ridiculous. The Pregnyl brand is about ten dollars more than no-name. If you want cheaper then you can order from AllDayChemist. Guys on this forum have had success with that.

In fact 100 mg per week of testosterone cypionate is on the high side compared to natural production. This is averaging 10 mg pure testosterone per day, whereas the natural average for healthy young men is more like 6-7 mg. The normal range is about 3-9 mg. There's some theoretical justification for using a little more exogenous testosterone, because a long ester such as cypionate is not providing much daily variation in serum testosterone—unlike natural levels. However, the extra needed would be less than 20%.

It is possible to have various symptoms from high testosterone, low estradiol, or even a high testosterone-to-estradiol ratio. Because most of us do not know in advance what our optimal hormone levels are, I believe it's prudent to start no higher than the averages for healthy young men. It's also important to be patient once this is achieved. It can take months for things to settle down after starting TRT. If symptoms of hypogonadism linger then the dose may slowly be increased.
I am on Dexilant for GERD and it works very well. You probably should get scoped.
 

Mathostx

New Member
Ive been. Im prone to gerd but it was controlled. Nothing has been found. I even did the impedance test and my LES wasnt weak. Dr suspected bile reflux and put me on carafate. Everything was excellent until I started TRT.

Thanks for your replies.
 

Dicky

Member
If you want cheaper then you can order from AllDayChemist. Guys on this forum have had success with that.
Can you do me a favor and check AllDayChemist again. I am not seeing HCG on their site anywhere. I will not rule out user error here. But I am not seeing it.

Scratch that. I did a better job of searching. They have something called Foligraf that looks to be HCG, but they are sold out.
 

Cataceous

Super Moderator
Can you do me a favor and check AllDayChemist again. I am not seeing HCG on their site anywhere. I will not rule out user error here. But I am not seeing it.

Scratch that. I did a better job of searching. They have something called Foligraf that looks to be HCG, but they are sold out.
Foligraf is FSH. HCG does seem to be off of that site at the moment. However, their sister site, ReliableRx, still seems to have it:
I dont see it either.. whats that website all about??
Do they need prescription?? I didn't see Test C either.
These sites only sell legal medications. However, although they ask for prescription information, you can leave that blank and still order the drugs.
 
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