Upper limit for estrogen?

TorontoTRT · Nov 7, 2019

Guys, is there an upper limit for estrogen aromatization? Do receptors get saturated at some point and level off with testosterone still climbing? What I'm asking is can we beat high estrogen by supraphysiological levels of testosterone and maintaining a good ratio? If my E2 is 72 with test levels of of 930 what would happen with test levels of 2000? 3000? I can't imagine E2 levels climbimg to over 230, or can they? Wouldn't DHT be so high at a certain point to completely prevent further aromatization?

Cataceous · Nov 8, 2019

There is a finite amount of the aromatase enzyme, so it does get saturated. As I recall from a paper on the subject, the effect becomes prominent at the higher serum testosterone levels you mention, 2,000-3,000 ng/dL. It does create a de facto upper limit for estradiol. The same principle applies to DHT creation and the 5α-reductase enzymes.

Vince Carter · Nov 8, 2019

I don't believe in the ratio, when I followed the 14-20 i was a mess with terrible E sides. The relation of E to X hormone I think is not a place to work to be. I aromatase, A LOT so I too don't believe there is some finite number of enzymes that is pretty laughable.
Working your Estrogen relative to your SHBG and ignoring everything else is where I found much more success, not 100% but a lot of my problems resolved when my trough E2 mirrors my SHBG value (~12). But that's a very clear cut case of everyone being different.

Vince · Nov 8, 2019

Estrogen really affects everyone differently. When I had my E2 in single digits, I never felt anything. I believe using the sensitive test, the highest I was able to get my estrogen, was 34.

Cataceous · Nov 8, 2019

Vince Carter said:
.... I aromatase, A LOT so I too don't believe there is some finite number of enzymes that is pretty laughable. ...

I have more faith in this published research with N>50 than in your opinion.

"... In all cases, the combined data exhibited curvilinear relationships that were well described by a rectangular hyperbolae, Y = A X/ (B + X), consistent with a saturable conversion of testosterone to metabolite governed by Michaelis-Menten kinetics. ..."