Naturally High Levels of DHEAs

[StepbyStep]

Does anyone else here have high DHEAs levels?

I'm 30yrs old, and have been on TRT more or less since 2017. I do not, and have not ever taken a DHEA supplement. My DHEA has been well above the reference range every single time I've tested for it. The last time it was:

760 with a reference range of 138-475 ug/dL.

I'm curious to know if there is any significance to this or not. I've been told by a few doctors not to worry about it, but offer no explanation as to the why.

Edit to update DHEAs numbers:

Tests numbers dating back to 2018
-811
-764
-704 Natural, not on TRT
-785
-684
-760

ref. range of 138-475 ug/dL

 

[JA Battle]

Does anyone else here have high DHEAs levels?

I'm 30yrs old, and have been on TRT more or less since 2017. I do not, and have not ever taken a DHEA supplement. My DHEA has been well above the reference range every single time I've tested for it. The last time it was:

760 with a reference range of 138-475 ug/dL.

I'm curious to know if there is any significance to this or not. I've been told by a few doctors not to worry about it, but offer no explanation as to the why.

We have been contemplating this same thing with our guy @Gman86

 

[Gman86]

Does anyone else here have high DHEAs levels?

I'm 30yrs old, and have been on TRT more or less since 2017. I do not, and have not ever taken a DHEA supplement. My DHEA has been well above the reference range every single time I've tested for it. The last time it was:

760 with a reference range of 138-475 ug/dL.

I'm curious to know if there is any significance to this or not. I've been told by a few doctors not to worry about it, but offer no explanation as to the why.

Ya I think I’m the only other person on the forum with naturally high DHEA-S levels. My gut tells me it’s not a good thing. It just doesn’t seem normal.

Do u suffer from any brain fog?

 

[StepbyStep]

Ya I think I’m the only other person on the forum with naturally high DHEA-S levels. My gut tells me it’s not a good thing. It just doesn’t seem normal.

Do u suffer from any brain fog?

What're you levels like? I agree it doesn't seem normal. I often wonder if it might be the key to get me feeling 100% again...even though it's hard to remember what normal truly feels like or if it ever existed for me.

Brain Fog? Yes. I suffered with it horribly until my current protocol that's in my signature. I've been on this protocol since 2019. I still get minor brain fog from time to time, and bouts of fatigue.

 

[Vince]

DHEA Sulfate Test: MedlinePlus Medical Test

This test measures the level of DHEA sulfate (DHEAS) in the blood. DHEAS is a male sex hormone found in both men and women. It is mostly made in the adrenal glands. Abnormal DHEAS levels may mean there is a problem with your adrenal glands or sex organs (testicles or ovaries). Learn more.

medlineplus.gov

 

[StepbyStep]

DHEA Sulfate Test: MedlinePlus Medical Test

This test measures the level of DHEA sulfate (DHEAS) in the blood. DHEAS is a male sex hormone found in both men and women. It is mostly made in the adrenal glands. Abnormal DHEAS levels may mean there is a problem with your adrenal glands or sex organs (testicles or ovaries). Learn more.

medlineplus.gov

Thanks for the link, I hate that all of the high DHEA's symptoms are always geared toward females.

One thing clicked though, according to the link "DHEAS is mostly made in the adrenal glands, two small glands located above your kidneys. They help control heart rate, blood pressure, and other body functions."

I have a resting heart rate of 70-75bpm which feels kind of fast to me, and it has always been that high regardless of diet and lifestyle. I also have BP of ~135/75. A little high and has always been that way as well.

Gman86, anything similar with you?

 

[CKO]

I run 735 ( 102 ug/dL - 416) naturally. I do take Rhodiola, which I have heard affects dhea levels.

 

[Gman86]

What're you levels like? I agree it doesn't seem normal. I often wonder if it might be the key to get me feeling 100% again...even though it's hard to remember what normal truly feels like or if it ever existed for me.

Brain Fog? Yes. I suffered with it horribly until my current protocol that's in my signature. I've been on this protocol since 2019. I still get minor brain fog from time to time, and bouts of fatigue.

Brain fog is the one issue that I still have from when I had low T. It’s what brought me to getting my hormones checked in the first place. It’s the only symptom I really still have. Maybe some fatigue as well, but I think it’s normal fatigue from working so much and having quite a few stressors in my life atm. I just can’t kick it no matter what protocol I’m on. And like u, I think my high dhea-s levels might have something to do with it. But glad ur brain fog is doing much better on ur current protocol. U don’t take any pregnenolone or ai or anything other than test cream and HCG? What brand of HCG are u taking? Here’s a list of all the times I’ve had DHEA tested since I started HRT

Most recent at bottom
Preg = Pregnyl HCG
APS = APS compounded HCG
EMP = Empower pharmacy compounded HCG
DHEA-S - 486 (106-464) No HCG (8-5-15)
DHEA-S - 411 (106-464) No HCG
DHEA-S- 615 (106-464)Preg2Kiu
DHEA-S - 729 (106-464)Preg2Kiu
DHEA-S - 452 (106-464)Preg1Kiu
DHEA-S - 550 (106-464)Clomid
DHEA-S - 677 (106-464)
Unitedpharmacy 2Kiu
DHEA-S - 869 (106-464)APS2Kiu
DHEA-S - 605 (106-464)Preg1Kiu
DHEA-S- 590(106-464)Preg600iu
DHEA-S- 572(106-464)Preg800iu
DHEA-S - 492 (106-464)EmpHCG
DHEA-S - 484 (106-464)EmpHCG
DHEA-S - 384 (106-464)EmpHCG
DHEA-S - 446(106-464)EmpHCG
DHEA-S - 479(106-464)EMPHCG
DHEA-S - 465 (106-464) NO HCG
DHEA-S - 440 (106-464) No HCG
DHEA-S - 404 (106-464) No HCG (11-2-19)
DHEA-S - 632 (138.5-475.2) No HCG, 200mg Nandrolone, 84mg test (8-31-20)
DHEA-S - 433 (33-416) No HCG (1-25-21)
DHEA-S - 435 (33-416) No HCG (6-24-21)

 

[StepbyStep]

Brain fog is the one issue that I still have from when I had low T. It’s what brought me to getting my hormones checked in the first place. It’s the only symptom I really still have. Maybe some fatigue as well, but I think it’s normal fatigue from working so much and having quite a few stressors in my life atm. I just can’t kick it no matter what protocol I’m on. And like u, I think my high dhea-s levels might have something to do with it. But glad ur brain fog is doing much better on ur current protocol. U don’t take any pregnenolone or ai or anything other than test cream and HCG? What brand of HCG are u taking? Here’s a list of all the times I’ve had DHEA tested since I started HRT

Most recent at bottom
Preg = Pregnyl HCG
APS = APS compounded HCG
EMP = Empower pharmacy compounded HCG
DHEA-S - 486 (106-464) No HCG (8-5-15)
DHEA-S - 411 (106-464) No HCG
DHEA-S- 615 (106-464)Preg2Kiu
DHEA-S - 729 (106-464)Preg2Kiu
DHEA-S - 452 (106-464)Preg1Kiu
DHEA-S - 550 (106-464)Clomid
DHEA-S - 677 (106-464)
Unitedpharmacy 2Kiu
DHEA-S - 869 (106-464)APS2Kiu
DHEA-S - 605 (106-464)Preg1Kiu
DHEA-S- 590(106-464)Preg600iu
DHEA-S- 572(106-464)Preg800iu
DHEA-S - 492 (106-464)EmpHCG
DHEA-S - 484 (106-464)EmpHCG
DHEA-S - 384 (106-464)EmpHCG
DHEA-S - 446(106-464)EmpHCG
DHEA-S - 479(106-464)EMPHCG
DHEA-S - 465 (106-464) NO HCG
DHEA-S - 440 (106-464) No HCG
DHEA-S - 404 (106-464) No HCG (11-2-19)
DHEA-S - 632 (138.5-475.2) No HCG, 200mg Nandrolone, 84mg test (8-31-20)
DHEA-S - 433 (33-416) No HCG (1-25-21)
DHEA-S - 435 (33-416) No HCG (6-24-21)

Wow, you've tested yours a lot. I think I've only checked mine while on TRT but I'm going to have to go through my physical records with notes to see if there is any pattern. I do not believe I have ever tested below 600.

I'm on Pregnyl at the moment, but that most recent test was when I was on Empower HCG. I'm the guy that had the thread about Empower vs. Pregnyl. No I don't really take any Pregnenolone. I have taken two 50mg capsules over the past few months just to see if I felt anything...but didn't really notice much. I've never tested my pregnenolone levels either. Just kinda gun-shy towards adding anything new to my protocol....it sucks to tweak something and feel worse for a period of time.

With regards to your statement about normal fatigue from work and stress, I get it and thought the same thing for a while. My normal work consists of long hours of physical labor 6 days a week. I recently have had 3 months of work due to COVID related issues, and honestly my energy levels/brain fog are pretty much the same as when I was working. It's been a bit of a wake-up call.

I think that there must be another piece to the puzzle, and DHEAs has been the only red flag to pop up in my labs. It's just frustrating that it's so cost/time prohibitive to continually do blood tests.

 

[Gman86]

Wow, you've tested yours a lot. I think I've only checked mine while on TRT but I'm going to have to go through my physical records with notes to see if there is any pattern. I do not believe I have ever tested below 600.

I'm on Pregnyl at the moment, but that most recent test was when I was on Empower HCG. I'm the guy that had the thread about Empower vs. Pregnyl. No I don't really take any Pregnenolone. I have taken two 50mg capsules over the past few months just to see if I felt anything...but didn't really notice much. I've never tested my pregnenolone levels either. Just kinda gun-shy towards adding anything new to my protocol....it sucks to tweak something and feel worse for a period of time.

With regards to your statement about normal fatigue from work and stress, I get it and thought the same thing for a while. My normal work consists of long hours of physical labor 6 days a week. I recently have had 3 months of work due to COVID related issues, and honestly my energy levels/brain fog are pretty much the same as when I was working. It's been a bit of a wake-up call.

I think that there must be another piece to the puzzle, and DHEAs has been the only red flag to pop up in my labs. It's just frustrating that it's so cost/time prohibitive to continually do blood tests.

I agree with everything ur saying. And that’s really interesting the little accidental experiment u did with being off from work for 3 months. I have a feeling it’s the same deal with me. I have a lot going on, but I’m the most go with the flow chill person ever, and I don’t feel stressed by everything really, so in the back of my mind I’m guessing that if the stressful things in my life went away I would feel the exact same. I felt the same when I didn’t have any stress in my life, so I doubt it’s having much of an effect now

And I agree, it’s sucks adding something obv hoping to feel better, and u end up feeling worse. And it’s also not easy staying on a protocol when ur not feeling the best just to hold out until u can get labs done and test things out subjectively and objectively, which is the correct way to do things. Definitely not easy when ur not feeling the best. I’m a very impatient person by nature, so that’s definitely the hardest part for me, in regards to dialing in hormones

I have days in a row that brain fog will be less and I’ll feel a bit better, and some days where it’s worse, so I just need to figure out how to get more good days, and obv less bad days. I think I’m on the right track, but it just takes so long to test things out, and get labs, and then try something else, get labs, etc. But I’m just trying to be patient and do things the right way at this point. But overall I feel pretty good. Just trying to kick the brain fog, and I know the fatigue and brain fog are linked, so I know the fatigue will clear if I can get the brain fog to go away. Or vice versa. Anytime brain fog is worse, energy is worse. Anytime brain fog is better, energy is considerably better. Other than that I’m doing really well in all other areas. So very thankful for that at least

 

[StepbyStep]

I think I'm going to try to put some pressure on my doctors to get answers about my DHEA's levels. If anything comes of it I'll send you a PM, I know you're one of the regulars around here.

I feel for you man, IMO brain fog is one of the worse symptoms IMO and the fatigue is definitely linked.

Did you by chance see post #6? Just curious to know if we share any commonality there.

 

[Gman86]

I think I'm going to try to put some pressure on my doctors to get answers about my DHEA's levels. If anything comes of it I'll send you a PM, I know you're one of the regulars around here.

I feel for you man, IMO brain fog is one of the worse symptoms IMO and the fatigue is definitely linked.

Did you by chance see post #6? Just curious to know if we share any commonality there.

Oh I didn’t even see that. My pulse rate is usually in the 70’s as well. BP is always good tho. I’m a health freak. So it usually averages around 110/60

And I pretty much agree. Imo depression is actually the worst disease/ symptom anyone can experience, on HRT or not. Imo nothing in the world can come close to depression. Luckily 99.9% of the time I experience zero depression. It’s something I’m extremely grateful for. HRT just makes me more of an eternal optimist than I already was. But I agree with u, nobody understands how much bad brain fog can inhibit ur life. It literally effects all areas of life. It’s pretty brutal. But I’d definitely rather be happy and have brain fog, and than have a clear head and be depressed.

But definitely send me a PM. I’d love to talk more with someone experiencing the same elevated DHEA-S issue as me. It’s a very rare issue, so not many people to talk to that are also trying to figure out what’s causing it

 

[Guitarman5]

I also suffer from high DHEA-S which I think is a result of taking 7-keto DHEA almost 6 years ago. After about 2 weeks of taking it, I had a series of panic attacks that lasted for 3 days, and after that my health declined. I had extreme anxiety, brain fog, paresthesia, fatigue, etc. A couple of weeks later I ordered a 4x saliva cortisol and DHEA-S test and the result came back morning cortisol super high and DHEA-S in the 1000's. I did the same test a year later and cortisol had come down and DHEA was down in the 700 range and that is where it has been ever since and have even verified it with blood tests, the latest one being about a month ago. Thankfully now I am a lot better but still have some mild brain fog and fatigue. What baffles me is if you look at a steroid pathway chart, 7-keto DHEA is not converted back into DHEA-S so why it is still high after all these years idk, my guess is that it created some kind of negative feedback loop with my hormoes.

I've been doing some research on how to lower DHEA-S and for men, you really can't find much, but I did come across one doc who had an interesting theory of lowering it via the enzyme 3 beta HSD. 3 beta HSD is used to convert DHEA into androstenedione, androstenediol into testosterone, and also pregnenolone into progesterone. One of 3 beta HSD's cofactors for conversion is called NAD+ and there are several factors that may make one's NAD+ levels decline such as age and metabolic syndromes such as diabetes, insulin resistance, etc. You can raise NAD levels a couple of ways, one is doing a ketogenic diet, (which is what I'm trying now) and another is taking a supplement called NMN which is the precursor to NAD+. I wanted to try the keto diet before I try any more supplements, although I have heard great results from the NMN supplementation. I am going to get retested after I have been on the diet for 3 months and I will update if I see any changes.

Here's the video of the Doc commenting on how to lower DHEA-S via 3 Beta HSD

 

[AndroChishti]

@StepbyStep I also have slightly high levels of DHEA SO4 (500 ug/dl) with
Progesterone 1.5ng/ml, it is due to my adrenals being overactive. I also have a fast resting heart rate, and though I am fit and have been soccor for many years I could never develop adequate amounts of endurance and If I push myself on the field, my heart starts exploding (lol). I think it is due to excess Catecholamines in the blood that comes with overactive adrenals, just a theory so far. Will get my Catecholamines checked next month will report back.

 

[StepbyStep]

Guitarman5, do you know what your DHEAs levels were prior to taking the supplement and what is your resting heart rate? Good work on finding the video, I appreciate it. I'll dig into it and try get get a better understanding of the pathways. Please keep us updated on how keto works out for you too.

For the record, the few times I've tested my Cortisol is has always come back normal. I've done two AM blood tests and two x4 diurnal saliva tests. With that said it's been a few years since those tests.

AndroChishti,

I haven't tested progesterone's, but I will add it to my next set of labs. I've also struggled with endurance even when I was fit and regularly working out. I know exactly what you mean by feel like your heart exploding.

What all are you getting tested for catecholamines?

 

[StepbyStep]

Here's an example of an Adrenal neoplasm causing elevated DHEAs in a female. The mcg/dl is the same unit as ug/dl, so the pre-op elevated numbers are right up there with ours.

Isolated DHEAS production by an adrenal neoplasm: Clinical, biochemical and pathologic characteristics

Androgen-secreting adrenal neoplasms have a low incidence, usually secrete multiple hormones, and may present with hirsutism, acne, and alopecia. We report an exceedingly rare case of a purely dehydroepiandrosterone-sulfate (DHEA-S) secreting adrenal ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[AndroChishti]

It is just a urinary catecholamine test, dont know anything much more than that at this point. Please let me know what your progesterone levels comes back to.

 

[Guitarman5]

@StepbyStep Unfortunately I was only 25 when I took the 7-keto DHEA and didn't have any labs at that point so I don't know my DHEA levels prior to that. I've always thought that what if my DHEA levels were always high and that is why I didn't respond well to the 7-keto. My resting heart rate is around 70-75 bpm and my blood pressure is around 140/85 but I've always had semi-high blood pressure.

Does anybody else have eye problems? After the panic attack, I developed a whole bunch of eye problems like eye floaters, visual snow, blue field entoptic phenomenon, and am no longer able to wear contacts. The eye doctor says there are no problems with my eyes so I've always wondered if it had something to do with the high DHEA.

 

[StepbyStep]

@Guitarman5

I've always had visual snow, but it has gotten a little worse over the past year. I've gotten a noticeable amount of eye floaters over the past year and after looking up blue field entoptic phenomenon I think I have a little bit of that too. I also have tinnitus, and I've read that there's a link between tinnitus and visual snow/BFEP.

 

[phil9p]

Just to also chime in, I've been researching high DHEA S as I have been suffering from really bad brain fog the last few years.

I agree with you guys that it does seem to be too high. I'm from the UK and getting help from a GP is basically non existent, let alone a blood terms for your hormones.

I'm hoping to get a fresh blood test and pay private to see an Endo as I do thing this is definitely contributing to my brainfog/fatigue.