Alternatives, for those who can't tolerate TRT?

[TPersall2828]

I get severe, severe mood issues on even very low doses of test (20mg 2x per week), including irritability, scary intrusive thoughts, crying spells, throwing screaming fits etc. all of which are unlike me and go away within a week or two of discontinuing.

Unfortunately, my natural levels have been in the mid 100's for the last 5 plus years and I have absolutely no energy and zero libido. It's embarrassing but I haven't had sex in almost six years, not only do I have no libido but I really don't even have the energy or motivation to socialize enough to date anyone.

I'm only 39 and the thought of living this way for the rest of my life is depressing, but I've tried so many TRT protocols over the past 5 years and the mood issues I get are just too much, I seriously fear I might assault someone or do something really stupid when I'm on. On 20mg 2x per week my trough levels are 473 and 19 (test and e2), which seem reasonable, but even on that the rage, anger, crying etc. are unbearable. I've always been very sensitive to everything, and can't take multivitamins, vitamin d, cofee etc. as I react to nearly everything.

 

[Systemlord]

I've always been very sensitive to everything, and can't take multivitamins, vitamin d, cofee etc. as I react to nearly everything.

Same here, I can't handle caffeine, alcohol or stimulates. I was at my GF house once and she gave my a protein bar, which was loaded with caffeine which gave me panic attacks, never having had a panic attack in my life.

The problem might be the injections creating sustained hormone levels that don't decline quickly enough, definitely a problem for those that are sensitive to androgens.

Maybe what you need is another delivery system, topical gel, cream or the newer oral testosterone undecanoate Jatenzo/Orlando/Kyzatrex with short half-lives (6 hours vs 5-7 days) and androgen levels that decline rapidly.

In theory, this would give your receptors a break as levels are declining.

Oral TRT Products: Jatenzo, Tlando, Kyzatrex, & DiTest

Testosterone Replacement Therapy: A Narrative Review with a Focus on New Oral Formulations (2022) Salman Z Bhat and Adrian S Dobs Male hypogonadism affects 10–30% of the male population and is often under-recognized and under-treated. Different replacement formulations exist, each with...

www.excelmale.com

My Experience On Jatenzo (Oral TRT) Log

I wanted to start a thread detailing my personal experience with Jatenzo (oral TRT) which is remarkable in how quickly it has shown results when compared with injections. The first week on Jatenzo was very pleasant unlike my experience after dosing changes on injections, all with minimal swings...

www.excelmale.com

 

[FunkOdyssey]

I get severe, severe mood issues on even very low doses of test (20mg 2x per week), including irritability, scary intrusive thoughts, crying spells, throwing screaming fits etc. all of which are unlike me and go away within a week or two of discontinuing.

Unfortunately, my natural levels have been in the mid 100's for the last 5 plus years and I have absolutely no energy and zero libido. It's embarrassing but I haven't had sex in almost six years, not only do I have no libido but I really don't even have the energy or motivation to socialize enough to date anyone.

I'm only 39 and the thought of living this way for the rest of my life is depressing, but I've tried so many TRT protocols over the past 5 years and the mood issues I get are just too much, I seriously fear I might assault someone or do something really stupid when I'm on. On 20mg 2x per week my trough levels are 473 and 19 (test and e2), which seem reasonable, but even on that the rage, anger, crying etc. are unbearable. I've always been very sensitive to everything, and can't take multivitamins, vitamin d, cofee etc. as I react to nearly everything.

What have you tried for protocols? You aren't mentioning what ester and formula you used either (that's important).

 

[TPersall2828]

Thanks for all that info above, cost kept me from looking into topicals, but it's really something I may consider at least trying.

As far as protocols. My prescription has always been cypionate, I used enanthate at times when I did not have access to a doctor. My injections were always twice weekly, started from 150mg per week, and over the past few years worked all the way down to my current 20mg twice per week, same issues regardless of dose. I have also tried daily subq injections, but I have no response to that, and when I had my blood tested, my levels were still in the mid 100's, so it's almost as if I wasn't absorbing any of it. Have tried low dose (.25-.5) arimidex on all of the twice weekly protocols, it does take the edge off of things but the fatigue/low libido it brings on basically leaves me feeling the same as when I'm off trt.

One interesting thing is that each time I start back on TRT again, the first two weeks I always feel amazing, at exactly two weeks is when all the issues start. At this point it's like clockwork, I notice I start crying during random TV commercials, and within a day or two I'm angry at everyone, threatening people, yelling at my dog etc. I always thought that seemed like an e2 issue, but my e2 is always in range.

 

[Jim Marlowe]

If you haven't already you should get genetic testing and run the results through NutraHacker and Prometheas. At this stage, i would suggest you consider going for whole genome sequencing. Prices are under $500. We're entering a revolution for whole genome testing and it's taking about 10-12 weeks to get results. The whole field is going to explode soon. I wouldn't be surprised if the backlog takes six months to get results at some point soon.

In any case, you need to look at what SNPs you have for MAO-A metabolizing, COM-T, MTHFR, MTR, MTRR, and other genetic issues. You can fix your unique nutritional issues, and then revisit TRT. People like Chris Masterjohn PhD offer genetic and nutritional counseling. The guy is brilliant, and his point is that everyone has five or six rare gene variants that create unique problems requiring specific, narrowly tailored solutions.
There are TRT docs who are mentioned on this board who understand this stuff, but I don't feel compelled to push any specific names.

If your initial approach to TRT hasn't panned out, look into the foregoing. Don't give up, my brother. It may not be easy, but you're going to figure a lot of this out.

 

[FunkOdyssey]

I think you are long overdue to try a transdermal formula or an oral product.

 

[TPersall2828]

Thanks guys.

I'd never even heard of Jatenzo until now, since I'm paying out of pocket, I doubt I could afford it. I do think I can afford to give a topical gel/cream a try though. I suppose if I really wanted to try everything before giving up, I could try a daily test suspension/base (or even prop?) although that would obviously mean obtaining it from overseas.

 

[FunkOdyssey]

Thanks guys.

I'd never even heard of Jatenzo until now, since I'm paying out of pocket, I doubt I could afford it. I do think I can afford to give a topical gel/cream a try though. I suppose if I really wanted to try everything before giving up, I could try a daily test suspension/base (or even prop?) although that would obviously mean obtaining it from overseas.

The other thing you should try at some point is a formula without benzyl benzoate and benzyl alcohol. Those excipients ended up ruining my TRT experience with a laundry list of crazy side effects. I never would have figured it out, except that I had a much better experience on scrotal cream, and started thinking about what was different between testosterone delivered by cream versus injection. The excipients are the biggest difference.

Hikma offers a clean generic T enanthate formula that won't break the bank.

 

[TPersall2828]

The other thing you should try at some point is a formula without benzyl benzoate and benzyl alcohol. Those excipients ended up ruining my TRT experience with a laundry list of crazy side effects. I never would have figured it out, except that I had a much better experience on scrotal cream, and started thinking about what was different between testosterone delivered by cream versus injection. The excipients are the biggest difference.

Hikma offers a clean generic T enanthate formula that won't break the bank.

Wow, thanks, had never even considered something like that being the issue. Being I have so many sensitivities to things, I will look into this as well.