Nandrolone Experiences

[benaoao]

Checking in here...

current regimen: HCG 250iu + Deca 100mg both E3.5D, feels great.

I started breaking out from HCG 500iu E3.5D, which undoubtedly comes from the fact that I get lower shbg from 200mg/wk of AAS... which frees up testosterone, DHT (and E2). So I had to adjust that one down, Taeian is right when he says that Deca base is superior for people who are very sensitive to androgens. Plus I don’t think there’s a need for as much HCG while on other drugs as opposed to monotherapy where 1000 iu/wk is my sweet spot.

 

[DS3]

Nandrolone Survey: Please Participate - Excel Male Health Forum

Forwarding for a friend who is collecting data for his Doctorate. My name is Todd Kielman. I am a Physician Assistant and Sexual Medicine Specialist with emphasis on Men's Health and Hormone Replacement. In collaboration with Nelson Vergel, we are conducting a study into the use and...

www.excelmale.com

 

[3percent]

What do you mean by sensitive to androgens? do you know your e2 levels? how did you feel without the hcg vs with? also do you feel motivated, assertive with nandrolone only comparing to testosterone

I've been told most people feel manly

thanks

 

[DS3]

What do you mean by sensitive to androgens? do you know your e2 levels? how did you feel without the hcg vs with? also do you feel motivated, assertive with nandrolone only comparing to testosterone

I've been told most people feel manly

thanks

I have not met a single person claims enhanced feelings of manliness while taking nandrolone in comparison to testosterone. Of course that is anecdotal and based on limited life experience, leaving a wide gap for other possibilities. However, until there is substantial evidence, even anecdotal, suggesting that nandrolone produces enhanced feelings of ‘manliness’, Ill remain extremely skeptical.

It’s seemingly a handful of people that praise nandrolone while the majority remain neutral about its effects, or dislike it altogether.

 

[captain_j]

I've recently added prescribed deca to my protocol at 120 mg a week. I am 3 weeks in, and not quite sure how I feel about it yet. I can't be positive, but it does seem to be causing some lethargy. Hard to say for sure since we are heading into winter here and the shorter days always tend to affect me, but we will see how it goes. I haven't noticed any benefits in the gym yet. I was hoping to be able to lower my testosterone dose after adding the deca, but I'm not quite ready to take that plunge yet. I don't feel that nandrolone has added enough yet to make that viable.

 

[Jake_from_StateFarm]

I've recently added prescribed deca to my protocol at 120 mg a week. I am 3 weeks in, and not quite sure how I feel about it yet. I can't be positive, but it does seem to be causing some lethargy. Hard to say for sure since we are heading into winter here and the shorter days always tend to affect me, but we will see how it goes. I haven't noticed any benefits in the gym yet. I was hoping to be able to lower my testosterone dose after adding the deca, but I'm not quite ready to take that plunge yet. I don't feel that nandrolone has added enough yet to make that viable.

What was your reason for starting deca? A lot of guys with bad joints have reported great results.

 

[captain_j]

I struggle with low SHBG. I've felt best on higher doses of test versus lower, but controlling E2 was always an issue due to the lower SHBG. I was hoping to use nandrolone as a partial replacement or stand-in for test so that I can lower my test dose and not have to take an AI. My joints aren't quite that bad yet (I'm 39), but I do lift weights 3 times a week and have done so for years.

 

[madman]

I've recently added prescribed deca to my protocol at 120 mg a week. I am 3 weeks in, and not quite sure how I feel about it yet. I can't be positive, but it does seem to be causing some lethargy. Hard to say for sure since we are heading into winter here and the shorter days always tend to affect me, but we will see how it goes. I haven't noticed any benefits in the gym yet. I was hoping to be able to lower my testosterone dose after adding the deca, but I'm not quite ready to take that plunge yet. I don't feel that nandrolone has added enough yet to make that viable.

Do not expect too much when it comes to muscle/strength gains on such as dose let alone 3 weeks in is nothing as not only are your blood levels in FLUX but the decanoate ester is longer acting than cypionate or enanthate and blood levels will take longer to stabilize.

 

[Sly]

Do not expect too much when it comes to muscle/strength gains on such as dose let alone 3 weeks in is nothing as not only are your blood levels in FLUX but the decanoate ester is longer acting than cypionate or enanthate and blood levels will take longer to stabilize.

I disagree. At 60mg a week, I gained 10lbs and gained an average of a 20% increase on lifts. I have been working out for 35 years, on trt for 3 years.

 

[madman]

I disagree. At 60mg a week, I gained 10lbs and gained an average of a 20% increase on lifts. I have been working out for 35 years, on trt for 3 years.

This would be far from common and even then no one is gaining any significant amount of muscle mass let alone strength on 100 mg/week ND.

 

[3percent]

gaining muscle is very rare on 60mg deca a week. I think I read @Nelson Vergel took 600mg of deca to get to 200lbs lean muscle. He is very muscular like a bodybuilder but I may be wrong about dosage

 

[Paul M]

Someone who lifts for hypertrophy can gain muscle without any pharms, as we're all aware. Surely even adding 60mg of nandrolone can only help to gain even further. It's hardly going to inhibit gains especially in conjunction with testosterone at TRT dosage. Obviously no one is going to be stepping on the stage even in an amateur juiced comp on those doses though.

 

[Sly]

In my case, it helps that I’ve had more muscle in the past, so that “muscle memory” helps me to gain muscle back faster. Also being that the main reason I’m taking nandrolone is for joint relief and that relief is allowing me to lift heavier than I could without it. As we’ve all experienced what works for one may not work for another as each person’s body is different. This goes for nutrition, supplements, medications, training, etc.

 

[madman]

gaining muscle is very rare on 60mg deca a week. I think I read @Nelson Vergel took 600mg of deca to get to 200lbs lean muscle. He is very muscular like a bodybuilder but I may be wrong about dosage

He was using 200 mg T/200 mg ND many years ago.

Again very rare anyone is going to 10 lbs of pure muscle tissue (actin/myosin) on a measly 60 mg ND/week.

Sure there may be minor improvements for some.

Even at 100 mg/week, the muscle/strength gains are going to be far from impressive.

The majority of men adding ND to a trt protocol are using it for relief of joint/bone pain and the prescribed therapeutic dose is 50-100 mg/week.

50-100 mg/week are therapeutic doses.

The uninformed seem to think that adding such doses is going to pack on muscle.

I would not even waste my time on such doses if my goal was to gain muscle mass.

200 mg/week would be the minimum dose needed to take full advantage of NDs anabolic properties.

Even then higher doses of 300-600 mg/week are where NDs true muscle-building potential shines.

Top all that off with the fact that regardless of the doses used the final results not only come down to following a proper diet/training protocol as ones GENETICS will have the final say!





post#5

Does anyone use Nandrolone (Deca Durabolin) ? - Excel Male Men's Health Forum

My doc offered my nandrolone and aid it would help me build muscle. I read about it and it looks like it causes erectile dysfunction. When I asked him about it, he said that for some people, it can, but if it does, regular function comes back a few weeks after stopping. I read something...

www.excelmale.com

I used nandrolone for 10 years. My first book was about it.

As long as you use it with 100-200 mg of testosterone per week, you will be OK. I never had any prolactin issues on it.

200 mg of nandrolone plus 100-200 mg of testosterone once per week can do wonders. You can gain 2-3 pounds a week if you eat well and clean and do resistance exercise 4 times per week. I would add 500 IU HCG twice per week.

This is from my first book I co-authored with Michael Mooney (Built to Survive)

 

[madman]

gaining muscle is very rare on 60mg deca a week. I think I read @Nelson Vergel took 600mg of deca to get to 200lbs lean muscle. He is very muscular like a bodybuilder but I may be wrong about dosage

Keep in mind that on trt we are using therapeutic doses (50-100 mg/week) of ND and some may run slightly higher levels.

Again the majority are using it for relief/improvement of joint/bone pain and adding it to their trt protocol.

The small pilot study from Lipscultz had men that were on a T only protocol (100/200 mg/week).

The men on 100 mg/week of T were adding 50 mg/week of ND.

The men on 200 mg/week of T were adding 100 mg/week of ND.


There are also some men who struggle on T only protocols when running higher doses (100-200 mg/week) and will take the approach of lowering their T dose <100 mg/week and add in ND at a dose of 100-200 mg/week depending on the individual.

Then you have a small minority that drops the T and follows an ND only protocol at a dose of 100-200 mg/week.

Doses of ND in the 200+ (250-600 mg/week) are not therapeutic doses for hrt and would be used/abused for the sole purpose of muscle/strength enhancement!

 

[DS3]

@Nelson Vergel is it safe to assume that you never experienced memory issues or decreased cognitive function while using nandrolone?

 

[Nelson Vergel]

@Nelson Vergel is it safe to assume that you never experienced memory issues or decreased cognitive function while using nandrolone?

Yes, no issues. Why would you expect cognitive issues with nandrolone?

 

[DS3]

Yes, no issues. Why would you expect cognitive issues with nandrolone?

From an anecdotal standpoint, I have experienced fairly significant lapses in memory and cognitive function while using nandrolone (e.g. increased recall time, decreased complex reasoning ability, etc.). I have read anecdotes from other men experiencing the same. In addition to these anecdotes, which are not generalizable findings, several animal models have suggested neurotoxic effects from nandrolone use.

Nandrolone abuse decreases anxiety and impairs memory in rats via central androgenic receptors - PubMed

Anabolic androgenic steroids (AASs) affect areas of the central nervous system, which are involved in emotional and cognitive responses such as sexuality, anxiety, and memory. In the present study we imitated the abuse of AASs by administering high doses of the AAS nandrolone decanoate (ND) to...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Voluntary exercise does not ameliorate spatial learning and memory deficits induced by chronic administration of nandrolone decanoate in rats

Chronic exposure to the anabolic androgenic steroids (AAS) nandrolone decanoate (ND) in supra-physiological doses is associated with learning and memo…

www.sciencedirect.com

Nandrolone decanoate administration elevates hippocampal prodynorphin mRNA expression and impairs Morris water maze performance in male rats

The misuse of anabolic androgenic steroids has in several reports been associated with effects resulting in altered behavior. This study used the Morr…

www.sciencedirect.com

 

[S1W]

From an anecdotal standpoint, I have experienced fairly significant lapses in memory and cognitive function while using nandrolone (e.g. increased recall time, decreased complex reasoning ability, etc.). I have read anecdotes from other men experiencing the same. In addition to these anecdotes, which are not generalizable findings, several animal models have suggested neurotoxic effects from nandrolone use.

Nandrolone abuse decreases anxiety and impairs memory in rats via central androgenic receptors - PubMed

Anabolic androgenic steroids (AASs) affect areas of the central nervous system, which are involved in emotional and cognitive responses such as sexuality, anxiety, and memory. In the present study we imitated the abuse of AASs by administering high doses of the AAS nandrolone decanoate (ND) to...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Voluntary exercise does not ameliorate spatial learning and memory deficits induced by chronic administration of nandrolone decanoate in rats

Chronic exposure to the anabolic androgenic steroids (AAS) nandrolone decanoate (ND) in supra-physiological doses is associated with learning and memo…

www.sciencedirect.com

Nandrolone decanoate administration elevates hippocampal prodynorphin mRNA expression and impairs Morris water maze performance in male rats

The misuse of anabolic androgenic steroids has in several reports been associated with effects resulting in altered behavior. This study used the Morr…

www.sciencedirect.com

I was unable to get beyond the abstracts.

The first article mentioned 15mg/kg per day (rats). For me, that would be about 8,820mg/week.

In the second article, do they mention dosages?

All of the articles mention abuse. Wondering if this could be an issue with doses commonly used for TRT, like 80mg or 100mg/week, for example.

What dosages were you using, and for how long, when you experienced cognitive effects?

 

[Nelson Vergel]

First study also injected the rats with an androgen receptor antagonist "AR antagonist flutamide (FL)". They also did not use testosterone along with nandrolone. None of the studies prevented hypogonadism in those rats.

My nandrolone years were the most productive of my life. I created two non-profits, wrote two books, and operated a clinic all at the same time. I do not think you would call that a decrease in cognitive capacity.

If someone has decreased in cognitive capacity while using anabolics (plus, of course, TRT in combination), I think they should check their sleep quality (oxygen saturation during the night). Androgens may affect deep sleep in some men. Lack of good quality sleep is the number one cause of cognitive decline.