Testosterone Dose and Cardiomyopathy/left ventricular hypertrophy development

[Kaus Klinski]

Hi Guys,

I've read that testosterone doses of more than about 100 mg/week can cause cardiomyopathy and or left ventricular hypertrophy when used long term. On the other hand, renowned experts like Dr. McClain recommend a starting dose of 200 mg for TRT. What is your guys opinion on this?

I've been using 250 mg T-Enantate e5d for about 1 1/2 years and have been diagnosed recently with mild cardiomyopathy and mild left ventricular hypertrophy. So I reducef my dose to only 125 mg a week, but of course I'm losing a lot of the gains I made in the gym.

Regards
Kaus Klinski

 

[Sicillian]

DEFINE_ME

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/full/10.1161/circulationaha.114.012066

 

[Kaus Klinski]

Hi Sicillian,

well, I've been on Dutasteride as well, DHT was almost zero, but still ...

regards
Kaus Klinski

 

[Jucaro]

Everything in excessive dose may be harmfull. For me 200mg/week of testoterone is unthinkable and I actually doubt about anybody's need of such doses.
In my particular case, I started using viagra in my early 40's for some low sexual performance, I didn't had any idea of testosterone defficiency at that time, then I started having periods of palpitations, and extrasystoles, some years later an echocardiogram showed there was cardiomyopathy, with hypertrophy of left ventricle and septum. No High BP.
Never used any medication for the heart problem, I preferred to do a little exercise, since I quicky improved symptoms after moderate work outs.
I started TRT at 47 y/o, initially with doses about 140mg/week: Not good due to estradiol issues and no good tolerance to AI.
Once I settled my weekly dose in something less than 100 mg/week plus 250 iu HGC every 3 days, and after a couple of years, everything looks fine with the heart, long time without feeling any extrasystole or palpitation, and my last echocardiogram showed within normal ranges.
So it seems it was the opossite for me: fixing testosterone defficiency was the solution and not the cause of some heart cardiomyopathy. May be the matter is not just about testosterone use, but healthy testosterone use.

 

[Kaus Klinski]

May be the matter is not just about testosterone use, but healthy testosterone use.

You're probably right. But how can experts like Dr. Rand claim 200 - 300 mg/week are completely safe (and required for most men to have a good clinical response) when obviously the opposite is the case? I don't get it.

regards
Kaus Klinski

 

[Jucaro]

You're probably right. But how can experts like Dr. Rand claim 200 - 300 mg/week are completely safe (and required for most men to have a good clinical response) when obviously the opposite is the case? I don't get it.

regards
Kaus Klinski

I am in Spain, and I have never heard about Dr. Rand, but 200 - 300 mg/week is a dose for the bodybilding world, and is obviously insane.
In other hand, younger men are likely to tolerate better higher doses, but it doesn't mean it is ok.
Anyway, check with the lab and see where your levels are... then you will know.
Right dose is not a rule, it is individual and should keep you within physiological levels (if you are looking for health and not just for muscles).

 

[Kaus Klinski]

I am in Spain

I'm in germany ;-)

and I have never heard about Dr. Rand

He is one of the leading experts in the field. See one of his videos here:

regards
Kaus Klinski