Low SHBG Guys

[Ref4ua]

Guys that have low SHBG, what protocols have you used and what is your SHBG?

I’m a low SHBG guy myself (11) prior to starting TRT and have tried ED @20mg and it still put my free over the top and E2 out of control. Just thought we could all share in one post what all we’ve tried and the results.

 

[IceFyre]

Started at 12.2 for SHBG doing 14mg ED with 300Iu Hcg eod e2@13 Switching to EOD shortly of prop/cyp blend

 

[sebastian_r]

Use half the dose.

10mg/day is plenty. 20mg is already 2-3 times the daily natural production of a young healthy male.

Try propionate if you haven't already.

My protocol: 10mg/day prop, no AI, no HCG, no problems

 

[Bentiger07]

I wouldnt paint a broad brush on the issue and say 10mg’s the magic formula. I think if your SHBG’s low, start with either 1 of 2 methods (after speaking with doc):

-Start from the avg of what most daily injectors are doing. From what I gathered, people are mostly doing anywhere from 9-18mg daily (successfully). Middle point would be about 13-14mg a day and then after some weeks (unsure how many weeks as I believe that depends on not just halflife, but possibly SHBG level as well? I think about 3-6 weeks will do), evaluate symptoms. Titrate down or up based on symptoms.

-Start around 9mg daily and then after some weeks, start evaluating how you feel. IF needed, move up by adding in an extra 2mg every 3-6 weeks.

Depending on your budget, get lab values every 3-15 weeks to aid that process. Minimize tissue damage with a smaller needle. If inconvenience of injecting daily is a factor, you can test EOD next.

Im no expert in this and just going on some experience and the little I gathered. Not even sure if 10 days is long enough to start evaluating symptoms but from what I read, regular guys get reach a stable level about 4-5weeks.

 

[OxS2]

Use half the dose.

10mg/day is plenty. 20mg is already 2-3 times the daily natural production of a young healthy male.

Try propionate if you haven't already.

My protocol: 10mg/day prop, no AI, no HCG, no problems

What's your SHBG? Also what does your bloodwork look like on this dose?

 

[Vince Carter]

Don't fall in the Prop trap.

The more operative part for you will be Estrogen control, if you already have a problem with E, expect that to continue. I use 16mg/D of Cyp but my Estrogen is the hardest part, it's not controlled by the small daily dose, for me.

I recommend the low SHBG guy look for an E2 that is close to their SHBG value. DON'T fear a trough E2 in the single digits. My Free E, DOUBLES in the course of the day...think about managing your E from the PEAK value. Pull some labs @ 12hrs post injection and just compare your trough to that.
Lastly, add the "Estradiol, Free" test to your regimen. Just as your Free T is very high you could be assured that your Free Estrogen is likely similar. We know SHBG binds to E just like it does with T.

 

[James]

Don't fall in the Prop trap.

The more operative part for you will be Estrogen control, if you already have a problem with E, expect that to continue. I use 16mg/D of Cyp but my Estrogen is the hardest part, it's not controlled by the small daily dose, for me.

I recommend the low SHBG guy look for an E2 that is close to their SHBG value. DON'T fear a trough E2 in the single digits. My Free E, DOUBLES in the course of the day...think about managing your E from the PEAK value. Pull some labs @ 12hrs post injection and just compare your trough to that.
Lastly, add the "Estradiol, Free" test to your regimen. Just as your Free T is very high you could be assured that your Free Estrogen is likely similar. We know SHBG binds to E just like it does with T.

Follow this advice

 

[Systemlord]

SHBG is 14-22 and daily injections provides the best results. The food you eat also influences estrogen.

 

[Charliebizz]

I personally could never get dialed in on trt. My shbg is around 12-14. It’s sad but I actually feel better with a total t of 211 then on trt. That said I do not feel great but doing ok

 

[Gman86]

I personally could never get dialed in on trt. My shbg is around 12-14. It’s sad but I actually feel better with a total t of 211 then on trt. That said I do not feel great but doing ok

Did you ever try testosterone cream?

 

[Charliebizz]

I have not. That’s the only thing in the hrt world I haven’t tried. But I also have a pregnant wife and a 19 month old

 

[Bentiger07]

Don't fall in the Prop trap.

The more operative part for you will be Estrogen control, if you already have a problem with E, expect that to continue. I use 16mg/D of Cyp but my Estrogen is the hardest part, it's not controlled by the small daily dose, for me.

I recommend the low SHBG guy look for an E2 that is close to their SHBG value. DON'T fear a trough E2 in the single digits. My Free E, DOUBLES in the course of the day...think about managing your E from the PEAK value. Pull some labs @ 12hrs post injection and just compare your trough to that.
Lastly, add the "Estradiol, Free" test to your regimen. Just as your Free T is very high you could be assured that your Free Estrogen is likely similar. We know SHBG binds to E just like it does with T.

Vince, Why do you say pull labs 12hrs after injecting. Is that the peak for daily injectors? With the trough being before the next daily injection? As a daily injector, I had a blooddraw taken before my next injection which I assume is my trough. I know peaks and troughs are less for daily injectors as theyre levels are more stable than weekly injectors, but there still must be one that that just isnt as noticeable.

 

[Gman86]

I have not. That’s the only thing in the hrt world I haven’t tried. But I also have a pregnant wife and a 19 month old

Was just curious how a low SHBG guy did on the creams if you happened to of tried it. But makes sense. Obviously this is a bad time to risk transference between either of them.

 

[Charliebizz]

I

Was just curious how a low SHBG guy did on the creams if you happened to of tried it. But makes sense. Obviously this is a bad time to risk transference between either of them.

I wonder how it would work for me also. But on shots my estrogen goes wacky. I don’t like taking e blockers. I’m not really sure what transdermals would do to my e2

 

[Gman86]

I

I wonder how it would work for me also. But on shots my estrogen goes wacky. I don’t like taking e blockers. I’m not really sure what transdermals would do to my e2

I’m curious about E2 and transdermals as well. Some say on here that there’s more E2 conversion, but from what I’ve seen with people’s labs the E2 conversion doesn’t seem any different than with injections, plus if you apply some of the cream to the scrotum, the high DHT negates some of the effects of high E2. So basically you can tolerate higher levels of E2 than you would normally. There’s nothing that I’ve seen to lead me to believe that men on creams have more issues with E2 than injections.

 

[Charliebizz]

Well for me personally if it’s the same as injections that’s not going to work. I was taking as low as 60mg a week and my e2 would be high. Low shbg is tough. You never know until you try though. I might visit at a later date but frankly trt has left a bitter taste in my mouth

 

[Gman86]

Well for me personally if it’s the same as injections that’s not going to work. I was taking as low as 60mg a week and my e2 would be high. Low shbg is tough. You never know until you try though. I might visit at a later date but frankly trt has left a bitter taste in my mouth

Ya I feel for guys that just can’t figure it out, I really do. But giving up is never the correct option. I would definitely try cream applied to your scrotum before getting too discouraged. I guarantee you can find a protocol that works with injections, but I would personally try creams, if I was you.

I don’t want to derail the OP’s thread, but also make sure your other hormones are in order, specifically the thyroid. Also, I’m learning a ton lately about growth hormone peptides, and I didn’t realize how vital it is to have optimum growth hormone levels. All these different hormone systems play a part in TRT. It’s very difficult to make TRT work when the other hormone systems are not optimized. Whatever you do though, don’t give up.

 

[TLR]

I personally could never get dialed in on trt. My shbg is around 12-14. It’s sad but I actually feel better with a total t of 211 then on trt. That said I do not feel great but doing ok

I've often wondered if guys that have naturally low T also have lower SHBG which results in normal Free T, and that's "normal" for them. Seems like a lot of the guys that don't respond well to TRT have low SHBG. MAY just be the way theyre system is wired.

 

[Charliebizz]

I've often wondered if guys that have naturally low T also have lower SHBG which results in normal Free T, and that's "normal" for them. Seems like a lot of the guys that don't respond well to TRT have low SHBG. MAY just be the way theyre system is wired.

I wonder also. My free t is at bottom of range also. But I have symptoms of low t also. I never tested t when I felt normal so I will never know.

 

[Charliebizz]

Ya I feel for guys that just can’t figure it out, I really do. But giving up is never the correct option. I would definitely try cream applied to your scrotum before getting too discouraged. I guarantee you can find a protocol that works with injections, but I would personally try creams, if I was you.

I don’t want to derail the OP’s thread, but also make sure your other hormones are in order, specifically the thyroid. Also, I’m learning a ton lately about growth hormone peptides, and I didn’t realize how vital it is to have optimum growth hormone levels. All these different hormone systems play a part in TRT. It’s very difficult to make TRT work when the other hormone systems are not optimized. Whatever you do though, don’t give up.

I get what your saying. But I don’t call it giving up. I just feel it’s not the answer for me. I’m not built for all the time invested and money and the wild swings. I’d rather feel low grade normal. Then all over the place like I am on trt. I also do not want to derail op thread. Was just adding I do not do well on trt as a low shbg guy.