Enclomiphene or Cold Turkey—advice needed

[SeattleBattle]

Thank you in advance for your help. I started TRT in July and did 100mg per week until end of October, so four total months. Was injecting 2x per week, no AI or HCG. I have never been able to get the anxiety under control, so in mid November I started taking 300 IU of HCG EOD. For the first few weeks, I felt like a million bucks, but then the hCG started to create intense anxiety as well.

I’m 50 years old and in great health, I work out three times a week. T level before was 350, but my side effects were very modest and I’d be more than happy to return to normal life, I just accept that for me, the anxiety from TRT is too brutal to bear.

so, here’s my question. I’m just down to HCG 300 IU 2x a week to stay sane, but I know HCG suppresses LH and the HPTA, should I just:

1. quit cold turkey? Would love to hear from anyone who has?

2. do Enclomiphene and AI PCT under supervision of great doc for 30 days?

I can bear some down days, but I really have no no idea what to expect from cold turkey. Part of me is wary of adding more drugs into my system through PCT, but I will do whatever it takes to be done.

This forum has been immensely helpful to me, I thank you in advance for your reply.

 

[Tdizzle]

Thank you in advance for your help. I started TRT in July and did 100mg per week until end of October, so four total months. Was injecting 2x per week, no AI or HCG. I have never been able to get the anxiety under control, so in mid November I started taking 300 IU of HCG EOD. For the first few weeks, I felt like a million bucks, but then the hCG started to create intense anxiety as well.

I’m 50 years old and in great health, I work out three times a week. T level before was 350, but my side effects were very modest and I’d be more than happy to return to normal life, I just accept that for me, the anxiety from TRT is too brutal to bear.

so, here’s my question. I’m just down to HCG 300 IU 2x a week to stay sane, but I know HCG suppresses LH and the HPTA, should I just:

1. quit cold turkey? Would love to hear from anyone who has?

2. do Enclomiphene and AI PCT under supervision of great doc for 30 days?

I can bear some down days, but I really have no no idea what to expect from cold turkey. Part of me is wary of adding more drugs into my system through PCT, but I will do whatever it takes to be done.

This forum has been immensely helpful to me, I thank you in advance for your reply.

I am curious to hear everyone’s answers. Recently I was considering contacting Defy to see if they could help me discontinue TRT. They have a PCT protocol for discontinuing. I tried cold turkey a few months ago and it’s brutal. I lasted 2 1/2 weeks

I am growing tired of dealing with the side effects and wonder how I might feel if I can get off TRT.

 

[SeattleBattle]

I am curious to hear everyone’s answers. Recently I was considering contacting Defy to see if they could help me discontinue TRT. They have a PCT protocol for discontinuing. I tried cold turkey a few months ago and it’s brutal. I lasted 2 1/2 weeks

I am growing tired of dealing with the side effects and wonder how I might feel if I can get off TRT.

would you mind talking about the 2.5 weeks and what kind of sides you dealt with?

 

[Tdizzle]

would you mind talking about the 2.5 weeks and what kind of sides you dealt with?

First week wasn’t bad. After that , fatigue set in hard. Then I slowly felt depressed. Couldn’t work out because I felt to weak. Mood was really down. Also, I couldn’t get an erection to save my life. Pretty much everything you would expect.
Not sure how long that wouldn’t have lasted but I couldn’t handle it.
That’s when I did some research and Defy has a protocol using HCG and a few other medication to help kickstart your natural production.

Defy Medical Centers

 

[SeattleBattle]

First week wasn’t bad. After that , fatigue set in hard. Then I slowly felt depressed. Couldn’t work out because I felt to weak. Mood was really down. Also, I couldn’t get an erection to save my life. Pretty much everything you would expect.
Not sure how long that wouldn’t have lasted but I couldn’t handle it.
That’s when I did some research and Defy has a protocol using HCG and a few other medication to help kickstart your natural production.

Defy Medical Centers

Thank you very much!!

 

[Tdizzle]

Thank you very much!!

Your welcome. For me, I’m most curious about how I would feel with my natural production again. . If it doesn’t help I can always go back on T. My fear is waiting to long and then my natural production may never fully come back.
Don’t get me wrong , TRT has helped me in some ways but in other ways I feel like I’m worse.
Looking back on my own experience, the negative side effects started when I lost my natural production and had to raise my dose. From there it’s been a balancing act that never seemed
to balance out. Sometimes I feel like the only thing I have to show for all of this is some big arms LOL

 

[SeattleBattle]

Your welcome. For me, I’m most curious about how I would feel with my natural production again. . If it doesn’t help I can always go back on T. My fear is waiting to long and then my natural production may never fully come back.
Don’t get me wrong , TRT has helped me in some ways but in other ways I feel like I’m worse.
Looking back on my own experience, the negative side effects started when I lost my natural production and had to raise my dose. From there it’s been a balancing act that never seemed
to balance out. Sometimes I feel like the only thing I have to show for all of this is some big arms LOL

How long had you been on TRT when you tried to quit cold turkey?

 

[Tdizzle]

How long had you been on TRT when you tried to quit cold turkey?

Just over a year when I tried. Ive been on it for about 18 months now

 

[SeattleBattle]

Just over a year when I tried. Ive been on it for about 18 months now

Got it. I’m hoping the shorter duration (4 months) gives me a fighting chance of a less painful withdrawal period. I’m sitting here staring at the Enclomiphene which I’m genuinely willing to take, just really trying to weigh which path gets me back to baseline (which is all I want) with the fewest sides and most safety. I’m reading a lot of positives about Enclomiphene and hopeful someone who has used it for PCT might chime in.

 

[BigBamBoo]

I have stopped TRT cold turkey a few times. I actually feel better about 3-4 weeks after stopping. Call it a second honeymoon stage.

After that, I slowly lose drive working out, sexual symptoms go away...yes...TRT causes me to have negative sexual issues...energy levels decrease a bit, but that levels off after a couple of months.

My thoughts is to just cold turkey if you are going to stop. I did not want to prolong my system being shut down.

Everyone is different and from reports some men have a hard time stopping.
I guess I am lucky and it is not a big deal for me....no big crash, etc.

Good luck to you.

 

[SeattleBattle]

I have stopped TRT cold turkey a few times. I actually feel better about 3-4 weeks after stopping. Call it a second honeymoon stage.

After that, I slowly lose drive working out, sexual symptoms go away...yes...TRT causes me to have negative sexual issues...energy levels decrease a bit, but that levels off after a couple of months.

My thoughts is to just cold turkey if you are going to stop. I did not want to prolong my system being shut down.

Everyone is different and from reports some men have a hard time stopping.
I guess I am lucky and it is not a big deal for me....no big crash, etc.

Good luck to you.

Thank you so much for your insight and perspective. I’m curious, given the negatives, why have you gone back to TRT in the past?

 

[sh1973]

I have stopped TRT cold turkey a few times. I actually feel better about 3-4 weeks after stopping. Call it a second honeymoon stage.

After that, I slowly lose drive working out, sexual symptoms go away...yes...TRT causes me to have negative sexual issues...energy levels decrease a bit, but that levels off after a couple of months.

My thoughts is to just cold turkey if you are going to stop. I did not want to prolong my system being shut down.

Everyone is different and from reports some men have a hard time stopping.
I guess I am lucky and it is not a big deal for me....no big crash, etc.

Good luck to you.

I think negative sexual issues that you state are far more prevalent than what we hear on here. Whenever my t levels are over 1000ng I’m completely utterly asexual. Doing 60mg a week puts my trough 650-700 and I do have some libido but still not as good as before starting trt with low t. Energy and well-being are pretty good with this low dose. If one of these doctors could figure out the missing pieces of trt, especially sexual desire, they’d have patients galore.

 

[BigBamBoo]

I think negative sexual issues that you state are far more prevalent than what we hear on here. Whenever my t levels are over 1000ng I’m completely utterly asexual. Doing 60mg a week puts my trough 650-700 and I do have some libido but still not as good as before starting trt with low t. Energy and well-being are pretty good with this low dose. If one of these doctors could figure out the missing pieces of trt, especially sexual desire, they’d have patients galore.

I agree. And from this forum and others I belong to, it seems a large majority start TRT hoping to ”fix” sexual issues.

I hold out hope that maybe in the coming years there will be a breakthrough in finding the missing pieces.

 

[sh1973]

Yeah I wish I could figure the libido issue out but don’t have much hope that anything’s on the immediate horizon.

 

[BigBamBoo]

Thank you so much for your insight and perspective. I’m curious, given the negatives, why have you gone back to TRT in the past?

Each time I restarted TRT it was due to the DR(s) assuring me that this protocol will work for me.

And there are some positives for me as well. But the negatives are greater than the positives for me.

 

[Charliebizz]

Why is it when ever I’m off trt the forums rave about it and then when I get back on every one starts coming off again Hahahahah.

 

[Cataceous]

... Doing 60mg a week puts my trough 650-700 and I do have some libido but still not as good as before starting trt with low t. ...

I forget, did you try going lower without success? What we sometimes neglect is that total testosterone of 650-700 ng/dL is at or above the average peak value for men in their prime. Troughs are probably at more like 400-500.

 

[sh1973]

I went down to 40mg but that felt too low. I did have a couple days that libido did feel better but fatigue set in. I did not do labs to see where I was but 25% is a substantial drop. Perhaps I should go down to like 50 or 52 mg and see how that works. Every time I’ve tried coming off TRT I hit a 2 day period around 10-12 days after injection to where I feel normal. The weird thing is it doesn’t matter whether the last injection was 120mg or 80mg it always happens in the same window. This could possibly explain why the best I’ve ever felt on TRT was the first year and a half on AndroGel 1.62. I did try it again no too long ago but felt really angry toward the evening which I’m not sure what that’s about.

 

[BigBamBoo]

I forget, did you try going lower without success? What we sometimes neglect is that total testosterone of 650-700 ng/dL is at or above the average peak value for men in their prime. Troughs are probably at more like 400-500.

I am 50 and my current natural (I am not currently on TRT) TT is just shy of 600. But....my SHBG is 70+ so my free T is only around 9.

When I was in my mid 30’s my TT was 750+. Never checked free T back in those days or SHBG for that matter.

 

[Cataceous]

I am 50 and my current natural (I am not currently on TRT) TT is just shy of 600. But....my SHBG is 70+ so my free T is only around 9.

When I was in my mid 30’s my TT was 750+. Never checked free T back in those days or SHBG for that matter.

Yes, we really need to go by free testosterone. Guys in their prime are averaging about 30 nMol/L for SHBG. This puts typical Tru-T free T at about 24 ng/dL. Yours is perhaps around 16 at the moment, at least touching the bottom of the healthy normal range (16-31).