5 Weeks TRT - symptoms and questions

[Carguy14]

Hi Team - 5 weeks in 200mg Test 1x weekly due to total T being at 319 most of my life (I’m now 49). I’m 6’1, 221 lbs and after 5 weeks, weight same, but gained 4 lbs of muscle, lost 4 lbs of fat. My clinic uses Inbody scan and it shows my percent body fat going from 26 to 22.6.

I have felt TONS of energy, high libido, and starting to see physical change. However, I have also had horrible insomnia. And…as of last 2 days, I’m starting to lose morning erections. Due to insomnia, I did reduce my last shot from 200 to 150. The last shot was 3 days ago.

Had blood drawn past week and will have results in a few days, but here are my questions.
-should I reduce my Test to 100, or 150?
-clinic prescribed me Anastrozle and Enclomiphene, but told me to hold off taking until first flood draw. Should I start low doses of these?
-does my symptoms of insomnia and now lowered sex drive indicate Estrogen issue?
-Also, I just ordered 90 day supply of Semorelin…objective is more muscle! Will this interfere with my TRT/Estrogen balance? Should I consider holding off on this until I get the right balance?

Thanks

 

[Systemlord]

Had blood drawn past week and will have results in a few days, but here are my questions.
-should I reduce my Test to 100, or 150?
-clinic prescribed me Anastrozle and Enclomiphene

Enclomiphene prescribe alongside TRT is a red flag you joined a T-Mill who is just trying to sell you as much product as they can profit from.

Enclomiphene won’t do anything while on injectable testosterone.

Already 5 weeks in and bloods drawn and you’re already thinking about changing the dosage without knowing where your levels sit, very strange indeed.

To top it off you most likely haven’t even reached a steady state yet.

 

[madman]

Hi Team - 5 weeks in 200mg Test 1x weekly due to total T being at 319 most of my life (I’m now 49). I’m 6’1, 221 lbs and after 5 weeks, weight same, but gained 4 lbs of muscle, lost 4 lbs of fat. My clinic uses Inbody scan and it shows my percent body fat going from 26 to 22.6.

I have felt TONS of energy, high libido, and starting to see physical change. However, I have also had horrible insomnia. And…as of last 2 days, I’m starting to lose morning erections. Due to insomnia, I did reduce my last shot from 200 to 150. The last shot was 3 days ago.

Had blood drawn past week and will have results in a few days, but here are my questions.
-should I reduce my Test to 100, or 150?
-clinic prescribed me Anastrozle and Enclomiphene, but told me to hold off taking until first flood draw. Should I start low doses of these?
-does my symptoms of insomnia and now lowered sex drive indicate Estrogen issue?
-Also, I just ordered 90 day supply of Semorelin…objective is more muscle! Will this interfere with my TRT/Estrogen balance? Should I consider holding off on this until I get the right balance?

Thanks

Welcome to Nelson's domain!

Hi Team - 5 weeks in 200mg Test 1x weekly due to total T being at 319 most of my life (I’m now 49)

This is a myth that needs to be put to rest.

Even if your TT was lower it does not mean you would need a high dose of androgens to achieve a healthy let alone high trough FT level.

The common starting dose across the board is 100 mg T/week.

Most men are injecting 100-200 mg T/week strictly IM (shallow/deep) or subcutaneously whether once weekly, or split into twice-weekly (every 3.5 days), M/W/F, EOD, or daily.

Even then a majority of men would never need the high-end dose 200 mg T/week to achieve a healthy let alone high trough FT level.

Are there what we call those outliers, most definitely but it is FAR from COMMON.

Most men can easily achieve a healthy/high or in some cases very high trough FT injecting 100-150mg T/week especially when split into more frequent injections.

Unfortunately, you were overmedicated from the get-go.

Piss poor protocol starting a man out on 200 mg T/week.

The best piece of advice is to start low and go slow on a T-only protocol.

Ancillaries such as hCG can eventually be added if need be.

Would try to avoid using an AI!

I have felt TONS of energy, high libido, and starting to see physical change. However, I have also had horrible insomnia. And…as of last 2 days, I’m starting to lose morning erections

This would be what we call the honeymoon period where one tends to experience a euphoric-like feeling, increased energy, and an increase in libido/erections when first starting due to rising T levels, and increased dopamine/lighting up of the AR.

Unfortunately for many, this is temporary and short-lived as the body will eventually adapt to the new set-point and things will level off more into what we call the norm.

Good chance your TT, FT, and estradiol levels are going to be very high on such a dose let alone it is a given that you are going to drive up other critical blood markers such as RBCs, hemoglobin, and hematocrit.

Hard to pinpoint what may be the cause of your erectile issues as we are shooting in the dark here without a full set of labs.

Keep in mind that testosterone has a tonic effect on the CNS and can easily make one feel amped up/on edge which can have a negative impact on sleep.

Chances are your TT and more importantly FT level is sky-high on such a dose!




Had blood drawn past week and will have results in a few days, but here are my questions.
-should I reduce my Test to 100, or 150?
-clinic prescribed me Anastrozle and Enclomiphene, but told me to hold off taking until first flood draw. Should I start low doses of these?
-does my symptoms of insomnia and now lowered sex drive indicate Estrogen issue?

Would be a wise move to decrease your dose as you were jacked up on T from the get-go.

100 or 120 mg T once weekly or better yet split into twice-weekly injections would be a good starting point.

Lots of time to increase the dose down the road if need be!

Drop the AI and the addition of enclomiphene is a waste of time as your hpta will be shut down when using exogenous T.

Again we need a full set of labs before jumping to any conclusions.

Libido let alone ED are multifactorial.

 

[Carguy14]

Thanks for thoughtful replies. Seems to be consensus on this thread as well throughout this forum that starting lower is likely better. That said, I will likely be dropping my dose to 100mg starting next week. I will also share blood when it comes.

So, anything to help with insomnia in the short run or will this be temporary until my body gets used to it?

Also, to clarify, no ED issues…just a dip in sex drive comparative to where it was.

 

[FunkOdyssey]

So, anything to help with insomnia in the short run or will this be temporary until my body gets used to it?

Testosterone has a stimulant effect on the CNS that you develop some tolerance to. Even on a normal physiological dose, if it is significantly higher than you're used to, you can have some insomnia at first. It goes away with adaptation (give it 1-3 months).

If you take more testosterone than you can personally handle, you won't develop a complete tolerance to the stimulant effects no matter how long you wait and your sleep will be consistently worse long-term. You'll feel persistently "wired but tired". If that happens, just take less.

 

[Carguy14]

Enclomiphene prescribe alongside TRT is a red flag you joined a T-Mill who is just trying to sell you as much product as they can profit from.

Enclomiphene won’t do anything while on injectable testosterone.

Already 5 weeks in and bloods drawn and you’re already thinking about changing the dosage without knowing where your levels sit, very strange indeed.

To top it off you most likely haven’t even reached a steady state yet.

I read as well the clinic stated that enclomiphene will help with teste shrinkage as well keep your body making test. This inaccurate?

 

[FunkOdyssey]

I read as well the clinic stated that enclomiphene will help with teste shrinkage as well keep your body making test. This inaccurate?

The only way that might work is if you were taking a very low dose of TRT. Maybe at like 50 mg a week or something, enclomiphene could keep your HPTA working a little bit. There's no way it is doing anything at 100+ mg a week because it will be overpowered by negative feedback exerted by testosterone at the hypothalamus level.

Enclomiphene blocks estrogen receptors that are responsible for a large part of the subjective benefits of TRT. It's actually a really dumb idea to include that in a cookie cutter protocol. I wouldn't be taking it. I wouldn't use the anastrozole either.

 

[Systemlord]

Also, to clarify, no ED issues…just a dip in sex drive comparative to where it was.

Again, your hormones are in flux, with the half-life of cypionate is 5-7 day, so roughly 42 days to steady blood levels.

It can take up to 12 weeks for your body to adapt to the new hormone set-point, but if you keep changing your dose every now and then you’re gonna be at this dialing in process for a long time.

You can draw no conclusions about your protocol as of yet. You don’t even know where your hormone levels sit, so thinking about lowering your dose at this point is a bit premature.

You also can’t base your protocol off someone else, because no two people respond the same to exogenous testosterone.

 

[Systemlord]

I read as well the clinic stated that enclomiphene will help with teste shrinkage as well keep your body making test. This inaccurate?

The protocol that you’re on, and the dosages, yes, it’s 100% in accurate. Injectable testosterone has a strong suppressive effect on the HPTA that enclomiphene cannot counteract.

I’ve never heard of a single case where enclomiphene reversed testicle atrophy of someone on injectable testosterone, never!

Whoever is running this clinic is a fraud and this is nothing more than cowboy medicine.

 

[Carguy14]

I’ve never heard of a single case where enclomiphene reversed testicle atrophy of someone on injectable testosterone, never!

Whoever is running this clinic is a fraud and this is nothing more than cowboy

You can draw no conclusions about your protocol as of yet. You don’t even know where your hormone levels sit, so thinking about lowering your dose at this point is a bit premature.

Interesting. But…wouldn’t it be safer to start lower and raise over time? Good news is I will have blood work back before next shot anyway…

 

[Systemlord]

Your reply is buried in my quote.

I’ve never known TRT to be unsafe, and with high satisfaction rates, as well as the Traverse study, TRT is relatively safe and anything that happens on TRT in the short term is benign.

Let’s say your Total T levels are 850, then all this discussion about lowering your dose disappears.

Wait for your labs to come in and then make a decision. If your Total T and Free T levels are at the higher end, or slightly higher, allow your body time to adapt for at least 12 weeks and then reassess how you feel at that time.

My advice, don’t turn TRT into an obsession or hobby.

 

[Carguy14]

My blood work came in and I’m at 979 testosterone, 35 for estrogen. Sermorelin starts tonight. Thoughts on reducing to 100mg?

 

[Systemlord]

Thoughts on reducing to 100mg?

Why would you think about lowering your dosage, anything wrong?

Say you lowered your dosage to 100 mg, now your levels are lower, and you don’t feel as good, forcing another dosage increase.

Stop treating TRT like a new hobby, enjoy it.

 

[madman]

My blood work came in and I’m at 979 testosterone, 35 for estrogen. Sermorelin starts tonight. Thoughts on reducing to 100mg?

If your labs were drawn at true trough (7 days post-injection) then you are hitting an absurdly high trough TT of almost 1000 ng/dL.

Even then as I stated previously although TT is important to know FT is what truly matters as it is the active unbound fraction of T responsible for the positive effects.

With a trough TT of almost 1000 ng/dL depending on where your SHBG sits your trough FT is going to be on the upper end/high

The shit kicker here is your peak TT, FT, and estradiol will be much higher.

Peak T levels (12-24 hrs) post-injection let alone during the first few days are going to be sky-high.

Again you were started on a piss poor protocol.

No man should be started on the high-end dose of 200mg T/week.

Idiotic!

Post labs (assays/reference ranges) let alone CBC which includes important blood markers (RBCs, hemoglobin, and hematocrit).

 

[madman]

Why would you think about lowering your dosage, anything wrong?

Say you lowered your dosage to 100 mg, now your levels are lower, and you don’t feel as good, forcing another dosage increase.

Stop treating TRT like a new hobby, enjoy it.

Trough?

FT?

All these years on here and you are still clueless.

This is embarrassing.

He was overmedicated from the get-go.

You should know better.

Start low and go slow we always say!

 

[Carguy14]

Free t is 25.7. Is that ok? 2.44%

 

[Systemlord]

Free t is 25.7.

25.7 what? What are the units and ranges?

 

[madman]

Free t is 25.7. Is that ok? 2.44%

Post labs (assays/reference ranges) let alone CBC which includes important blood markers (RBCs, hemoglobin, and hematocrit).

Need to know how many days after your last injection labs were drawn?

Highly doubtful that you had your free T tested using an accurate assay (ED/UF).

Even then as I stated previously with a TT of almost 1000 ng/dL depending on where your SHBG sits your FT is going to be on the upper end/high.

Good chance you drove down your SHBG on that absurd starting dose of T.

 

[madman]

Free t is 25.7. Is that ok? 2.44%

Post a screenshot of your results.

TT, FT, estradiol, SHBG, and CBC.

 

[Carguy14]

Latest labs. I take my shot once a week. Labs were done the same day as my weekly shot, but I waited until after blood was taken before doing my injection.