Need help with sleep management on TRT

[stx359]

I had the same issue when I initiated TRT. I have been a solid sleeper my entire life and suddenly I was wide awake at 3:00-4:00 every night. I tried all the supplements mentioned on here and several prescription meds. Eventually I switched to Natesto for other reasons and one of the benefits was a return to my normal sleep pattern. I am back to 7 hours a night with no supplements and no prescriptions. I think my testosterone was simply too high. I was running troughs of 1000 and now I am running peaks of 800 three times a day which is probably closer to what I was when I was "normal."

 

[ERO]

Get some full spectrum CBD oil. My sleep is bad as well on TRT but this has helped. Dose with dinner and right before bed. Doesn't work 100 percent of the time but definitely helps.

 

[cigpk]

Get some full spectrum CBD oil. My sleep is bad as well on TRT but this has helped. Dose with dinner and right before bed. Doesn't work 100 percent of the time but definitely helps.

I’m sober so this will not be an option for me.

I am thinking I will try a dose reduction of my test if I don’t see any improvement over the next several months

 

[Gman86]

I had always thought Remag was the best form of magnesium, though I have never taken it.

However, Magtein magnesium l-threonate has been proven to be the only form of magnesium to cross the blood brain barrier and increase brain levels of magnesium.

They are both expensive.

But based on studies, I would say Magtein is "better" because of the increase in brain levels. I haven't really tried to take 3 caps of Magtein, the recommended daily dose before bed, I will give it a try. I tend to take 1-2 caps a day along with a cheaper magnesium complex. Mostly I take Mg to prevent muscle cramps.

Though I think very cheap forms like mg oxide will also work, it isn't highly absorbable, but take enough for long enough it will likely work for most people. Not for sleep, just to raise cellular / serum levels of Mg. BTW, we likely all know that serum levels of Mg isn't a good indication of cellular levels.

melatonin half life is 20-50 min, so suppressing it before bed only affects going to sleep, not sleep maintenance.

I don't have a problem going to sleep, it's sleep maintenance that a problem.

Now getting on a forum, internet, chat, whatever COULD cause some level of stress which could cause one to wake up during sleep.

I have had times where I wake up thinking about some conversation, debate, controversy that occurred right before going to bed. Even my wife bringing up something important in bed as we are going to sleep can disturb my sleep because I end up dwelling on it and it wakes me up. For her, maybe it helps her because she is thinking about it and "hands it off" to me and her part is "done".

Ya I also take 1 cap of Magtein before bed. I bought it because of the whole passing the blood brain barrier thing that I read about.

 

[Gman86]

I've tried 3 forms of magnesium, this ionic liquid one:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B005PFK3YS/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o09_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

plus transdermal magnesium and magnesium bisglycinate. They just helped a bit the first few days and then the effect wore out. At least none of these gave me loose stool, as with magnesium chelate and magnesium citrate.

I read your message about the blubox tinted glasses and I was thinking about buying a pair, but I would like to try again with some melatonin first, when I wake up at night, along with some glycine before bed.
Also, I read that the glasses should wrap around the eyes, in order to avoid having the blue light hitting your eyes from the sides, but I don't know if that's an overkill to be honest.



I have the same issue with waking up warm and sweaty, at the point that last night I had to open the window to get some cold air in, while my wife was covered with a sheet and a throw.
I flagged out that the issue is most likely high E2, as Dr. Saya told me on my first checkup with him, but I keep hearing people on this forum saying that it's actually low E2 to cause the issue, which is the exact opposite of what my blood tests are showing.
When my E2 was low I was having serious anxiety at bedtime and it was impossible to fall asleep, but, when I was eventually falling asleep, I was getting those 5-6 hours of uninterrupted sleep.

Here’s the video where I learned about blublox glasses. The they talk about why it’s not important to have lenses on the sides of the glasses. The guy says it doesn’t matter. But then again, he’s obviously selling them, so I guess we have to take what he says with a grain of salt. But he seems like a very honest guy, imo, and I trust that he knows what he’s talking about. You can watch it though and make your own judgement.

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1219331258229922

 

[Trents]

I wake virtually every night and usually hard to go back to sleep. Waking at 2-4am doesn't leave time for any supplement to kick in before time to get up really. Been this way for prob 3 years. I turn 58 Saturday so part may be age. Diurnal cortisol tests did show deregulation but nothing seems to help Phosphatidylserine gives me insomnia. Here's a few things I've tried:



unisom(doxylamine succinate)
Diphenhydramine hcl
Periactin(Cyproheptadine)
5htp/tryptophan
Theanine
melatonin
Gaba
HERBS Valerian, Chamomile, hops, passion flower Lemon balm
magnesium(Oral/transdermal)
AMINOS (Taurine Glycine ornithine
Inositol
phenibut
Kava kava

Have blue blockers, sleep mask, grounding pillow, always open to new ideas...

Try klonopin 1-2 mg if nothing else worked

 

[Reason]

Klonopin is a benzo and shouldn't be used regularly.

 

[Gman86]

Klonopin is a benzo and shouldn't be used regularly.

I’d have to agree. Being sedated, is not the same thing as sleep.

 

[GreenMachineX]

Anyone here try megadoses of cbd for sleep?

 

[DragonBits]

Anyone here try megadoses of cbd for sleep?

I take full spectrum CBD, though I wouldn't call it a megadose. About 4-6 drops. It's kind of expensive, about 50 cents a drop.

I think it helps a little, but it could be just my imagination, it's not super noticeable.

 

[GreenMachineX]

Gotcha. 125mg cbd worked pretty well last night for me.

 

[Vince Carter]

I’m sober so this will not be an option for me.

Just for those that come along later and see this, this is absolutely not true, CBD has none of the "get you high" association with THC

 

[Vtail]

Extended release Melatonin seems to help me stay asleep a little longer. It's available from Amazon in 5mg tabs.

 

[GreenMachineX]

Just for those that come along later and see this, this is absolutely not true, CBD has none of the "get you high" association with THC

agreed.
I do wonder though if a 1:1 ratio of cbd to thc would be even better for sleep though. I need more of a knockout effect. CBD is working at 125-150mg per night but it’s not cost effective.

 

[fifty]

Gotcha. 125mg cbd worked pretty well last night for me.

If I had a dollar for every poster who claimed substance X is great then a week later says it doesn’t work then I would be rich.

 

[GreenMachineX]

If I had a dollar for every poster who claimed substance X is great then a week later says it doesn’t work then I would be rich.

Shrug

 

[DragonBits]

If I had a dollar for every poster who claimed substance X is great then a week later says it doesn’t work then I would be rich.

So what are we talking about, $20 or maybe even a $100?

One other thing I haven't tried, progesterone, it's supposed to have sedative effects. Though it seems like tablets MAYBE are more effective for this than the cream. Because it's the metabolites produced in the liver that are more sedative.

Hmm, I wonder if I ate the cream would it be like a tablet?

 

[Reason]

CBD, besides being an anti-inflammatory, is also an anxiolytic. If CBD has helped your sleep measurably, it might be worth considering lowering stress and other forms of mental health improvement like exercise, therapy, etc. so you don't rely on supplements long-term.

I know for me, I can take a benzo and sleep really well, so I'm trying to manage my anxiety and stress levels while using supps to keep me afloat.

 

[Vince Carter]

Isn't the "thing" with CBD is that's it not standardized as far as a potency is concerned? Or that there's not an established "dose" in milligrams (or whatever) that could promote sleep?

 

[JimGainz]

I’ve used CBD in a 1:1’ratio (Care by design is the brand) with great success for sleep and also
Tinnitus. I take 1/3 of a dropper (6mg CBD and THC) and I sleep for 4-5 hours straight (a big deal for me) and the maddening ringing in my ears is not noticeable the next morning. I love the stuff - but you need THC in the mix. The hemp based CBD did nothing for me.