Issues with cypionate causing heart pounding

[transetpmedia]

I did a post a while back explaining that I get an excessively strong heartbeat that is very uncomfortable on TRT. This heart symptom is part of a bigger health issue that I have not been able to fix, sort of like a chronic bounding pulse. I've been on TRT for 1.5 years and suffered this most of the time. My protocol is 8mg cypionate a day IM which has always been from Perrigo. My bloodwork is good; my levels sit around 700-750 and free testosterone is 0.5-0.6 (on British scale). Estrogen is relatively low and hematocrit around 0.5.

What was strange was that I found my last vial gave me less of the heavy heartbeat feeling. I started a new vial a week ago and the heart pounding has started again badly. The effect of the testosterone feels the same from both vials, so to me it feels like there is something else that is added that is giving me this heart pounding effect rather than the testosterone itself. I see it includes extra ingredients, Benzyl Alcohol and Benzyl Benzoate, I don't know if they are the cause and perhaps the last vial I used had different amounts in it?

Whatever is causing it, I am looking to try another type of testosterone as I can't handle this anymore. I was wondering if perhaps gel or cream would have less side effects like this. Can anyone offer me their thoughts on this and if there is testosterone formulation that would have the least amount of extra chemicals in it, or perhaps ones that are most benign?

 

[JmarkH]

Do you know your blood pressure, A1C, and cholesterol, and have you gotten a cardiac calcium score? All of these help with a look under the hood.

 

[transetpmedia]

Do you know your blood pressure, A1C, and cholesterol, and have you gotten a cardiac calcium score? All of these help with a look under the hood.

Blood pressure is around 105/65. I can't remember the exact numbers but my A1C and cholesterol are good. Cardiac calcium score is something I haven't gotten before. FYI I'm only 29.

 

[JmarkH]

I've got nothing then unless it is an allergic reaction to the oil. Have you tried different oils?

 

[transetpmedia]

I've got nothing then unless it is an allergic reaction to the oil. Have you tried different oils?

Only tried cottonseed oil, but I don't believe it's that.

 

[Belekas]

I doubt its the oils but who knows and more context is needed. Have you tried normal dosing like 1-2x week and if yes for how long? What about all other context - are you overweight, do you workout, hows your sleep? Also how sure you are that you need TRT in the first place as you are still very young and a lot of times true TRT is not needed when we fix and address all other life issues and bad habits, etc. 0.6 for FT on British scale means top of the range and if thats tested at through then at peak you are flying a lot higher. Some men feel like shit at higher levels, some at lower levels, so you need to find your sweetspot and usually less is more. I tried microdosing and I felt like shit straight from the get-go, went back to usual 2x per week IM and was fine again. The context is that matters most, but most people think thats its only numbers, ratios, etc, when in reallity its far far from only being that. Would be great if it was that simple, but here like everything in life- you gotta put in the work yourself to feel great as TRT is not a magic bullet, like a lot think. And thus TRT might not work for you, but you will never know unless you explore all the venues before dropping the towel. Hang in there!

 

[transetpmedia]

I doubt its the oils but who knows and more context is needed. Have you tried normal dosing like 1-2x week and if yes for how long? What about all other context - are you overweight, do you workout, hows your sleep? Also how sure you are that you need TRT in the first place as you are still very young and a lot of times true TRT is not needed when we fix and address all other life issues and bad habits, etc. 0.6 for FT on British scale means top of the range and if thats tested at through then at peak you are flying a lot higher. Some men feel like shit at higher levels, some at lower levels, so you need to find your sweetspot and usually less is more. I tried microdosing and I felt like shit straight from the get-go, went back to usual 2x per week IM and was fine again. The context is that matters most, but most people think thats its only numbers, ratios, etc, when in reallity its far far from only being that. Would be great if it was that simple, but here like everything in life- you gotta put in the work yourself to feel great as TRT is not a magic bullet, like a lot think. And thus TRT might not work for you, but you will never know unless you explore all the venues before dropping the towel. Hang in there!

I tried EOD but got issues with what felt like high e2. I am normal weight, stopped working out so much because of this bounding pulse issue and my sleep is fine except I don't get very deep sleep because of this problem.

I had low T symptoms for around 7 years after taking steroids when I was 19. Tried everything under the sun and it just didn't work. I feel like my dose is my sweetspot. The problem is not with the cypionate but this strange heart symptom I have. I had it before I started TRT (for many years) but TRT made it worse. It seems that anything which alters how my heart is functioning can make it worse. I know the effect from whatever is causing it (whether that be the testosterone itself or something else added) wouldn't be strong, it seems to be amplified in me because of this symptom and whatever is going on in my body.

 

[aneuman]

When you say "pounding heart" what does it feel? Is it that you feel that you heart is beating harder like trying to get out of your body? Do you feel your pulse when your at rest, or trying to sleep, and the pulse is so loud that can become distracted?

When you feel like that, have you measured your blood pressure and pulse? Is the pulse normal (below 100, ideally 60-70)

If so, it very well could be generalized anxiety disorder. I've been to a cardiologist for this "heavy beating" problem. My complaint was "my heart doesn't let me sleep" and the doctor laughed. I had all procedures done, echocardiogram, stress test, calcium score. Everything was great. My calcium score was 0 (zero) at 55 years old. The doctor say that my heart was beating strong and that was a good thing.

I have noticed that when I feel like that, it affects my sleep, I usually fall asleep within 2-3 min, but sometimes wake up during the night and it's hard to go back to sleep. At times I feel like I have some sort of breathing problem, like I have to make an (minimal) effort to breath, but it's really in my head. My respiratory rate during sleep has been consistent around 15 bpm for years. I have used a real time origin sensor during sleep and my O2 levels never fall below normal.

I recently started T.cyp, just like you Perrigo, at 15mg M-W-F (similar to your dose of 8mg a day) and I'm feeling the sensation again. It had gone away when I was using hCG only, and I think that non-physiological constant levels of free T, even when the levels itself are well within range, could be exacerbating my anxiety.

My two cents.

 

[transetpmedia]

When you say "pounding heart" what does it feel? Is it that you feel that you heart is beating harder like trying to get out of your body? Do you feel your pulse when your at rest, or trying to sleep, and the pulse is so loud that can become distracted?

When you feel like that, have you measured your blood pressure and pulse? Is the pulse normal (below 100, ideally 60-70)

If so, it very well could be generalized anxiety disorder. I've been to a cardiologist for this "heavy beating" problem. My complaint was "my heart doesn't let me sleep" and the doctor laughed. I had all procedures done, echocardiogram, stress test, calcium score. Everything was great. My calcium score was 0 (zero) at 55 years old. The doctor say that my heart was beating strong and that was a good thing.

I have noticed that when I feel like that, it affects my sleep, I usually fall asleep within 2-3 min, but sometimes wake up during the night and it's hard to go back to sleep. At times I feel like I have some sort of breathing problem, like I have to make an (minimal) effort to breath, but it's really in my head. My respiratory rate during sleep has been consistent around 15 bpm for years. I have used a real time origin sensor during sleep and my O2 levels never fall below normal.

I recently started T.cyp, just like you Perrigo, at 15mg M-W-F (similar to your dose of 8mg a day) and I'm feeling the sensation again. It had gone away when I was using hCG only, and I think that non-physiological constant levels of free T, even when the levels itself are well within range, could be exacerbating my anxiety.

My two cents.

Things trigger my heart to pump harder, but the real symptom I have is a feeling in my arteries. Like my blood is very heavy and my pulse is pounding my brain. This feeling is always there to some degree, but gets worse with things that trigger it. I have a low heart rate (50-55) and have this sensation when I am relaxed and sometimes it can be really bad even when I'm relaxed. I understand that people would assume anxiety, but the sensation is so strong and unnatural in its feeling. Plus you can see my arteries literally pulsate. This is a video I took a while ago of me:

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If you look at my channel you can see more.

I sleep 8 hours a night but it's never full refreshing. If I eat slightly less food I can get close to good night sleep, but if my pulse worse I can sleep 8 hours but wake up feel like I've only slept 4. It's interesting that you don't get it with HCG. To me I would have thought that it's to do with the chemicals it comes with, because I don't understand why the constant level would be a problem. I was on clomid and had testosterone of 1100 and a free testosterone higher then I have now and never had this problem.

 

[transetpmedia]

My heart is healthy on paper, I am wondering if I perhaps have some sort of dysautomnia that causes this symptom.

 

[aneuman]

My heart is healthy on paper, I am wondering if I perhaps have some sort of dysautomnia that causes this symptom.

What you're relating is very similar to what happens to me. When I was skinnier, I could even see my heart beating on my chest, similar to your carotid arteries in the video. I can "feel" my heart pumping harder. This is upsetting and this effect increased my anxiety in a sort of doom loop.

My advice, go to a cardiologist if you can and have it check out. Avoid Dr. Google and Dr. Forums, as you will be diagnosed with every possible rare and terminal disease known to man, and will be prescribed as many esoteric treatments as there are.

My guess, it's probably nothing. With a low pulse you can expect your heart to beat harder. Have a doctor see it and clear you.

Good luck.

 

[transetpmedia]

What you're relating is very similar to what happens to me. When I was skinnier, I could even see my heart beating on my chest, similar to your carotid arteries in the video. I can "feel" my heart pumping harder. This is upsetting and this effect increased my anxiety in a sort of doom loop.

My advice, go to a cardiologist if you can and have it check out. Avoid Dr. Google and Dr. Forums, as you will be diagnosed with every possible rare and terminal disease known to man, and will be prescribed as many esoteric treatments as there are.

My guess, it's probably nothing. With a low pulse you can expect your heart to beat harder. Have a doctor see it and clear you.

Good luck.

Thanks. I've had this for close to 10 years, had every test and know that on paper I'm healthy. For me it has never been a concern about the state of my health. It's just the physical feeling stops life from being worth living much of the time. Being on TRT seems to make it worse, I'm hoping it's just the cypionate but we will have to see.

 

[Russo]

Just here to tell you that it has nothing to do with the bezoate and alcohol. This is just the solvent and the anti-bacterial content in the formula. I know it because I brew. Don't extress over it trying to buy from another brand. It's not the product. Your problem is hormone related, ok? Just telling you this so you can focus in the right direction of your problem.

 

[transetpmedia]

Just here to tell you that it has nothing to do with the bezoate and alcohol. This is just the solvent and the anti-bacterial content in the formula. I know it because I brew. Don't extress over it trying to buy from another brand. It's not the product. Your problem is hormone related, ok? Just telling you this so you can focus in the right direction of your problem.

Do you know why the cypionate would cause me problems when on clomid my levels were 50% higher but I didn't have any issues?

 

[Willyt]

I experienced the same during my year of TRT as have others on this forum. It is usually dose dependent. Mine went away as soon as I lowered the dose.
Your daily dose looks reasonable. Maybe test whether dose is the driver by reducing dose to 7mg daily and see what happens?

 

[Systemlord]

Estrogen is relatively low

This statement leaves too much to the imagination. Low or high estrogen could absolutely cause pounding, overly strong heartbeats.

I couldn’t tolerate cypionate and enanthate esters, on daily and EOD protocols and I didn’t respond to TRT anything beyond these two protocols. The flat steady hormones caused dangerously low blood pressure while sleeping. I would wake up in the middle of the night gasping for air, swollen abdomen (pooling blood) and pain in legs.

Waking up made the symptoms disappear quickly.

I also had overly strong pounding heartbeats.

Years later it dawned on me that I needed very short acting esters. Jatenzo fixed the problems I had on the cypionate and enanthate esters, having a 6 hour half-life. Hormone levels peak and decline quickly.

My testosterone levels are twice as high now compared to when on cypionate.

 

[transetpmedia]

I experienced the same during my year of TRT as have others on this forum. It is usually dose dependent. Mine went away as soon as I lowered the dose.
Your daily dose looks reasonable. Maybe test whether dose is the driver by reducing dose to 7mg daily and see what happens?

If I go lower it reduces but I don't feel good. I mentioned in other posts, but with 1100ngdl test on clomid I didn't have this problem, which suggests it isn't the test?

 

[Systemlord]

but with 1100ngdl test on clomid I didn't have this problem

You most likely had higher estrogen on clomid.

 

[transetpmedia]

This statement leaves too much to the imagination. Low or high estrogen could absolutely cause pounding, overly strong heartbeats.

I couldn’t tolerate cypionate and enanthate esters, on daily and EOD protocols and I didn’t respond to TRT anything beyond these two protocols. The flat steady hormones caused dangerously low blood pressure while sleeping. I would wake up in the middle of the night gasping for air, swollen abdomen (pooling blood) and pain in legs.

Waking up made the symptoms disappear quickly.

I also had overly strong pounding heartbeats.

Years later it dawned on me that I needed very short acting esters. Jatenzo fixed the problems I had on the cypionate and enanthate esters, having a 6 hour half-life. Hormone levels peak and decline quickly.

My testosterone levels are twice as high now compared to when on cypionate.

I can't remember exactly but estrogen was at a good level, not too high not too low. Perhaps 25-30? Interesting what you are saying about those esters. You think issue stems from not fluctuating? I don't think Jatenzo is available to me (or in the UK generally), did you ever try cream?

 

[Systemlord]

You think issue stems from not fluctuating?

Yes, I do.

I don't think Jatenzo is available to me (or in the UK generally), did you ever try cream?

Yes, the cream gets through the skin into the blood stream no problem, my skin doesn’t absorb or store the T. The highest I got was 86 ng/dL.