I want to go with defy, but I have a major concern

[CoastWatcher]

Nelson vergel: I live in south east pennsylvania.

Ero: No that's not what I'm saying, I absolutely don't want to continue feeling this way. I am in the process of setting up with defy. These are just the thoughts that I have, and assumed someone else may have had the same thoughts that I do, and would tell me their opinion or their experience.

Paul-e: That's what I was thinking. Actually you have a good idea and that could possibly help! Thanks that's the kind of advice I'm looking for. Do you happen to know what range of LH clomid is used to achieve? The research I've done points to the high end of the lab range 1.7 - 8.6 mIU/mL. I would assume that you wouldn't use clomid to go above the lab range, right? That would probably lead to the same concern with HCG of desensitizing the leydig cells.

Fireproof: You are absolutely spot on! Thank you, this is the advice I am looking for. That would probably strengthen my case if the unfortunate would happen.

Torrential: That might be it, I do this with everything. I would love to be able to just make a decision without analyzing the sun, moon, and stars about what kind of topping I want on my ice cream! Joking, but you get the point.

I wasn't saying I wouldn't get treatment because I might not be able to afford it in the future, it is a concern, but I was asking how to minimize that risk, and so far have gotten some good advice.

Coastwatcher: You're right. My hormones are all screwed up, I can't believe I'd ever be thinking "I want more estrogen!" but from what I've learned about hormones, estrogen is just as important as testosterone in men.

Re-ride: It's getting tougher and tougher to live everyday in this country. I get exactly what you're saying, if I learn how to manage my routine, then I can do what I have to do if necessary.

1. Is my DHEA result anything to be concerned about? I know most guys try to keep theirs high, but is it a bad thing to be above the range?

2. My T:E ratio is 57, so that means I would have to have a total testosterone of 1140 to have an E2 of 20. 20 is still low. How do I increase my aromatisation, and I know how funny that is because most guys want to do the opposite!

Quit worrying about ratios and ranges - they are guidelines to assist you and your doctor. How you feel is the most important issue. Your estradiol will increase as your testosterone does. E always follows T.

 

[CoastWatcher]

What are the symptoms of adrenal fatigue?

https://www.excelmale.com/forum/sho...-may-be-the-problem&highlight=Adrenal+fatigue

Excellent resources on the Forum regarding adrenal fatigue.

 

[averagemale]

Jackie: That is actually a lot for me, I am on medicaid. I can probably do so, but in the future it could be a problem. I know that money isn't as important as feeling good, but only IF you have it. I wish it weren't this way, but that is what it is unfortunately.

I am going to do this, I have to. I have no choice, I feel like complete crap, and at 22 when people tell me how young I am it pisses me off. I don't feel young one bit, not at all. Youth isn't ED, piss poor mood, tiredness, no ambition, drive, no sex drive, no confidence, joint aches. I've been to about 12 doctors, 3 hospitals, 20 blood tests, and multiple medications. That is NOT youth. I want what people who are older than me, tell me is youth. Jeez I've been missing out.

You're absolutely right about the local doctors, nothing but passing the buck to who "should" help me. No one can make a decision.

Coastwatcher: I feel like crap. That's the thing.

 

[Vettester Chris]

I'm a little worried right now. Should I retest my DHEA-S, and go from there? I don't know much about adrenal fatigue, not to be rude, but is it a recognized condition, or is it in the process of being one? I know that several years ago, certain diseases weren't recogonized, and we called things diseases that weren't. Such as homosexuality, and hysteria.

What are the symptoms of adrenal fatigue?

Don't be worried. If in your life you've never had a lab result that is a bit high or low, then you are a miracle prodigy. Yes, of course, we've all had marks on our labs out of range, and that's why we take labs, for sake of identifying the current status of your health. No different than the DHEA. It's just enough that might prompt someone or a physician to take a deeper look. If your TSH was 5.2, I'd be suggesting you look at the different labs related with your thyroid.

If you're interested in the symptoms, then it's all out there for you to research ... Stop the thyroid madness has a whole section on it, Dr. Lam has tons of stuff on his site, AdrenalFatigue. org has some great info w/ Dr. Wilson, and the link that goes to Nelson's post has some exceptional information as well.

 

[Re-Ride]

Keep official hard copies of labs, case notes documenting the base line and result of therapy. Rationally this should persuade a new doc on continuity of care. "It doesn't work like that". A phrase that's gone viral. Why don't bureaucrats just stick their tongues out and put their thumbs in their ears like five year olds? It was better when they said "I'll get back to you on that" or they gave you an 800 number to a nice gal who gave yet another dead end referral.

You may get lucky. I'd document no matter what. Everything is paperless these days. You may be charged for your record. Even then you might not get it. Try anyway.

With my own DHEA-s climbing off the chart for over a year I asked for a closer look at adrenal and thyroid function. If getting TRT these days through normal channels is like climbing Mt. Everest then looking at thyroid and adrenals is like taking a rocket to Mars to climb Olympus Mons. I ignore my DHEA-s climbing off the chart for over a year because that's the only choice I have.

As with other "campaigns from top" the one against mens health can be bypassed for the "well qualified". Who is dictating national policy and to what end? The only answer is a bit disconcerting.

 

[averagemale]

Okay. You guys have a lot of information, and most of it seems like my labs other than T and my symptoms are pretty normal.

It's looking like I may be more primary than secondary? I would assume I need to talk to dr saya or chrisler to be sure. Everything in the HPTA is functioning, my pituitary is putting out the signal for more testosterone and isn't getting it. That looks unfortunately like primary, and clomid wouldn't do much.

What are the LH levels that clomid is used to get? Would clomid be used to get higher than the lab range?

 

[Jackie Treehorn]

Jackie: That is actually a lot for me, I am on medicaid. I can probably do so, but in the future it could be a problem. I know that money isn't as important as feeling good, but only IF you have it. I wish it weren't this way, but that is what it is unfortunately.

I'm sorry to hear that. Believe me, I was not trying to make light or make fun of your financial situation.

It sounds like you can and will do this now, because you know it's in the best interest of your physical (and mental) health. After you start feeling better, your motivation level will increase, and your situation at work will improve because you will be more productive...believe me. Your co-workers are going to be wondering what the hell happened to you!

I am going to do this, I have to. I have no choice, I feel like complete crap, and at 22 when people tell me how young I am it pisses me off. I don't feel young one bit, not at all. Youth isn't ED, piss poor mood, tiredness, no ambition, drive, no sex drive, no confidence, joint aches. I've been to about 12 doctors, 3 hospitals, 20 blood tests, and multiple medications. That is NOT youth. I want what people who are older than me, tell me is youth. Jeez I've been missing out.

Wow, I feel for you. Trust me...when you get with Defy, there's nowhere to go but up...and they will get you feeling better. Keep us informed about your progress.

 

[Vitamin_C]

I have high DHEA-S as well, my recent 24 hour urine cortisol came back mid range.

 

[Vettester Chris]

I have high DHEA-S as well, my recent 24 hour urine cortisol came back mid range.

Vitamin C, if you by chance you posted your results and have a circadian graph and/or correlation analysis with DHEA, please let me know the link? I'd really like to see it, and it might be beneficial for AM as well. Thanks!

 

[Vitamin_C]

I don't have labs that correlate my DHEA with circadian . My latest DHEA-S came from my initial labs with Defy, with my DHEA-S being 545 (138-475). My DHEA has always been upper range for at least the last four years. I've had a couple 24 hour urine cortisols with the Mayo clinic, those ones came back elevated. My recent urine cortisol I did with my PCP and it came back 33 (0-50 ug/24hr).

 

[vbbuilt]

From a financial perspective, it's all about priorities. Have you set enough aside in case you become unemployed? The recommended set-aside is having 6 months of salary saved/invested. Does diverting money to TRT helps there? What about life's emergencies? Do you have money set aside for a major car repair? What about something in your home that goes down, requiring replacement/repair? Do you use money for TRT or have you built up your emergency funds? What if you have a major illness and health insurance doesn't cover the bills? When considered this manner, your priorities become clear. When you've built up your financial cushion, then and only then can you pay for life's extras, like TRT. Perhaps give up something like going to movies and going out to eat, in exchange for having money for TRT?

 

[averagemale]

Jackie treehorn: Thank you, I didn't take it personally.

Vbbuilt: I am working on it. With low income, the amount that you can save is limited. Honestly I don't really do anything at all that I could cut back on. Pretty much everything that I spend money on is essential, and as cheap as I can get it. Such as car insurance, cell phone, gasoline.

Basically if something really expensive comes up, its either credit cards or I'm screwed. It's a crap way to live, but it seems like this is what the world is these days.

I live at home still, I don't even think of moving out, because I know it's simply not a possibility with the way my life is going right now.

Do you guys think I am primary or secondary?

 

[SoCalSurfer]

Ageragemale, bite the bullet and go with Defy. I worked for years with a local doc and really didnt get good results until the docs at Defy got me all setup correctly. If you can find a good local doc who will order labs so insurance covers them all the better. I get my Testosterone through my insurance and most of my labs as well. HCG and DHEA are not covered but the cost per month is not that high. You will start to feeling much better once things are stabilized then you can go to college and do well. I had a lot of brain fog and one doc said I had adult ADHD when really it was low T levels, I was in the 150's and felt like shit. Now things are great.