How much reduction in hematocrit would be expected with a blood donation???

[Tron]

Hello:

In this topic it is said that:

"A phlebotomy of one pint of blood will generally lower hematocrit by about 3 percent"

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A reduction of a 3% was that I was expecting to happen.

15 June I had a blood test and my hematocrit was at 54.7%. Just after the test I had a blood phlebotomy of 500 ml (near a pint).

25 June I had a second blood test and my hema is 49%.

It means that with a 500 ml blood extraction my hematocrit has reduced a 5.7%. I think that is a reduction too much big, isn't it??

Could it be any problem with one of the two laboratory measurements??? It seems very strange to me such a big reduction.

I would appreciate very much the experiences of some users.

Thank you.

 

[Vince]

You may have be better hydrated at one of your blood draws, always stay well hydrated drinking plenty of water. It helps lower your HCT.

 

[Tron]

You may have be better hydrated at one of your blood draws, always stay well hydrated drinking plenty of water. It helps lower your HCT.

Yes, I knew it. I was well hydrated the two times before the blood tests.

It's strange but not imposible as I have seen. I need more experience on this facts to well control it.

The first blood test was made by my own in a private laboratory (very expensive). The second one was made by my national health service (Spain).

As I have told you sometimes I couldn't visit my endocrinologist from the national health service with an hematocrit of 54.7% without expecting many problems. Due that a month ago I felt my face a little bit flushed I suspected I had a high hematocrit and I was right... do you know what I mean???

 

[Vince Carter]

Ive known it as 3 points (55 > 52), NOT as a percentage but still a very general thing and not a rule by any means.

 

[ratbag]

Also you need to know your ferritin level before you give blood. This is what happened to me. I gave blood without knowing this and it killed my ferritin which made me hypothyroid. If you donate blood it tanks your ferritin. So one must be sure their ferritin level is high enough to support that donation.

 

[Gman86]

Yes knowing your ferritin level is extremely important. My insurance covers blood work, so I was getting like 13 tubes drawn each time, which eventually tanked my ferritin. I’ve never donated blood, but in my case even getting too many labs drawn, too often, can tank ferritin. And unfortunately ferritin is something that feels like it takes forever to raise back up. So just be careful. Like ratbag said, ferritin is very important for thyroid function, amongst a bunch of other important physiologic processes in the body.

 

[FeelingLost]

In January I had a HCT of 52.7 and was told to go donate blood.
I donated 1 pint and waited 2 weeks before retesting it came back 45.9

Crashed my ferritin. I believe it was a combo of hydration and lab error. Either way I'm paying the price.

 

[MarkM]

Ouch.....it can take a long time to bring the iron and ferritin levels back up.

 

[Gman86]

Do any of you know if ferritin is needed for proper cortisol production? I feel like I've read that somewhere. I'll do some more research myself and try to find out. Obviously we all know by now that TRT has been known to lower cortisol, just wondering if low ferritin is part of the problem or if TRT lowers it another way, or maybe it's a mix of both.

Obviously not everyone on TRT is going to have low ferritin, but unless you're supplementing with iron, 100% of us are going to have lower ferritin than when we started, due to getting labs drawn. To what degree ferritin is lowered probably depends on how many labs you got drawn, how often you get them drawn and whether u had to donate blood or not due to high HCT. But all of us at least get labs done, and anytime you lose blood, your ferritin is getting lowered. Just food for thought. Something to consider I feel like.

 

[MarkM]

I believe that proper ferritin levels are needed for one to have proper cortisol levels and for proper thyroid function. I've read somewhere that one whole blood donation will lower your iron levels by 25 to 30 points and will reduce your ferritin levels from 30 points up to as much as 50 points. That is why so many crash their ferritin levels due to donating blood too often while trying to control hematocrit.

 

[FeelingLost]

I believe that proper ferritin levels are needed for one to have proper cortisol levels and for proper thyroid function. I've read somewhere that one whole blood donation will lower your iron levels by 25 to 30 points and will reduce your ferritin levels from 30 points up to as much as 50 points. That is why so many crash their ferritin levels due to donating blood too often while trying to control hematocrit.

I find it interesting that when the body makes new red blood cells, to replace your donation, that they are ferritin deficient.

It is very similar to A1C. If you donate blood forget a accurate A1C. Itwill not represent the 3 month average.
It will always be lower because the sugar in our blood has not damaged the new blood cells yet.

 

[Vince Carter]

I've had to specifically complain about HCT and Ferritin when I was getting prompted on both things, that "they" had me locked in a vicious cycle of being forced to donate in order to continue my treatment, and then "they" complain about my Ferritin. Both ways I couldn't get ahead and just started cutting my Cyp dose down to find a balance of not donating, not killing my Ferritin, and so on and on. If you're HCT is going nuts, reduce the Cyp...big sign your dose is much too high. But then there's the idea that other treatments that result in Polycythemia(?) those people aren't being drained like guys on TRT.

 

[Gman86]

Ya that's a common cycle I've seen people report. Lowering dosage is definitely a good option to get out of the cycle. Also, I think maybe we shouldn't be as scared of HCT as we are, unless it's considerably above range, or if your experiencing negative symptoms, like elevated BP.

When my HCT was elevated, for instance, my blood pressure remained around 110/60, and I experienced no negative side effects that I was aware of. And even if BP was a little elevated, there are many other ways to get it down that are very effective, and fairly quick acting, that I would probably try first. Things like increasing potassium and supplementing with magnesium, and of course exercise will always be a good way to maintain a healthy cardiovascular system, but probably won't work quite as quickly as the first two options. Obviously very high HCT is not good, but I would much rather have a slightly high HCT over a tanked ferritin level any day.

So long story short, before donating to lower HCT, I would definitely try reducing dosage, increasing potassium intake (supplementing with creme of tartar is a cheap and easy way to get a ton of extra potassium), supplementing with magnesium (increase the amount of magnesium until your BP comes down or until you reach bowel intolerance) and obviously everyone should be exercising regardless of high HCT or not.

 

[Tron]

Ouch, I'm a little bit afraid for this information about ferritin. I don't know what are my ferritin level now after the phlebotomy.

My iron level in blood is good because it has been tested but ferritin levels have not been tested.

Is there any relation with these two things??? I mean, if iron level is good (75 microg/dL Range 37-170), would ferritin level be good too???

Oh, my god...

 

[MarkM]

Iron serum, which is the iron circulating in the blood, can be normal, while ferritin (stored iron), can be low. It would appear to me that your iron level is low normal at 75. It is likely that your ferritin levels are also low. Low ferritin can cause a host of concerns. One of the big concerns is the impact of low ferritin on proper thyroid function. Low levels of ferritin can decrease the conversion of T4 to T3 and it can increase levels of Reverse T3, which is normally not positive. I've read that ferritin levels generally need to be at 80 ug/dl for healthy thyroid function. Ferritin less than 50 ug/dl can result in hair loss. It will also give you hypothyroid symptoms. My ferritin levels were consistently in the 150 ug/dl range until I started donating blood to bring hematocrit down. Next thing I knew my ferritin was down to 30 ug/dl and I was wore out all the time. I am now supplementing to bring both the iron and ferritin back up to healthy levels. I'd like to get back to the 150 ug/dl range but I need to get to at least 80. As long as I am going to be donating blood on occasion I will probably always supplement with a little iron.
Then again, it is a vicious circle because iron helps build up your red blood cells which in turn can increase your hematocrit.

 

[ratbag]

No relation between ferritin and Iron serum. Many like me, have high Iron serum but very low ferritin. Ferritin is the stored iron in your body available for whatever needs it so it has to be there at a normal level. Even the lab ranges for ferritin are lower than they should be reflecting the masses who simply have too low of ferritin. My ferritin was low but in range and I had all sorts of issues. My PCP said it's in range it's not the problem. Yet My hormone MD said it's too low and to supp some iron which I did and the problems disappeared

 

[Gman86]

I’m pretty sure they don’t correlate. I have to go back and check all my previous blood works, but I’m almost positive even when my ferritin was tanked my iron level was always within range. Someone correct me if i’m wrong, but I think iron level is just the current iron level in your blood at the time of the blood draw, opposed to ferritin which is the storage level of iron.

So from my understanding, that day you could have normal iron levels, but overall you could still have poor iron storage levels a.k.a. ferritin levels. But please someone correct me if I’m wrong, I totally could be.

 

[Gman86]

Exactly. That's why ferritin is so important, vs just testing serum iron, because it's like a gas tank of iron that you build up, and can be taken from anytime your body needs iron for a metabolic process, which is probably constantly. So if you have a low gas tank of iron, it causes a host of problems

 

[Tron]

Ok, thank for the information.

In all case, it is something that I don't understand in this topic. For example, a big person like me has 8 blood liters in his body. If 1 liter is withdraw at one time then the ferritin is not possible to descend at 50% of the previous level. This is because 1 liter over 8 represent only the 12.5% and not all the ferritin was in the 1 liter extracted.

Why do the ferritins levels descend so much???

 

[ratbag]

Ferritin is very important for all hormones and your body tissue cellular structure and organs. You can't be low on ferritin without it compromising something or many things in your body. It's something we need. I never had ferritin issues until I started TRT. This is a common theme here because TRT generally reduces your ferritin. Some are not affected but I believe most are. It would be interesting to do a poll on this.