ED On TRT. Bloods good on paper

[Joseywales95]

@DixieWrecked @Joseywales95 have either of you tried testosterone cream? just curious.

I have not. I considered trying fast acting Test prop.

 

[JA Battle]

so your e2 would probably benefit you to have 35-70 range (low 50s ideal). From my experience, For every 150 mcg (.15 mg) of daily injectable estradiol, my estradiol increased by 15. I’ve found e2 directly correlates with libido and sensitivity. Not eq. Due to the urge increase it indirectly helps eq to a certain point til it doesn’t. High e2 I notice I’m humping a lot more but with a noodle.

I’ve used injectable e2 now as a base and used it with masteron, deca, tren etc as experiments. It’s nice to be able to pick what level of e2 I have instead of continuing to feed test when I know in my case it disproportionally converts to dht. FYI I do not condone using these other drugs but was experimenting. I’m back on 12mg test prop with 200mcg daily of estradiol valerate.

I aromatize 50% less than you. When my test is at 1050 my e2 is at 20. Grew up with cracking joints and was always off. Very athletic but I had emotional issues and joint issues.

 

[FunkOdyssey]

so your e2 would probably benefit you to have 35-70 range (low 50s ideal). From my experience, For every 150 mcg (.15 mg) of daily injectable estradiol, my estradiol increased by 15. I’ve found e2 directly correlates with libido and sensitivity. Not eq. Due to the urge increase it indirectly helps eq to a certain point til it doesn’t. High e2 I notice I’m humping a lot more but with a noodle.

I’ve used injectable e2 now as a base and used it with masteron, deca, tren etc as experiments. It’s nice to be able to pick what level of e2 I have instead of continuing to feed test when I know in my case it disproportionally converts to dht. FYI I do not condone using these other drugs but was experimenting. I’m back on 12mg test prop with 200mcg daily of estradiol valerate.

I aromatize 50% less than you. When my test is at 1050 my e2 is at 20. Grew up with cracking joints and was always off. Very athletic but I had emotional issues and joint issues.

That's great detective work and experimentation you've done around finding your ideal E2 levels. I would just say that it's important to include SHBG to put things in context. Much like Total T, Total E2 is relatively meaningless compared to Free E2.

We're comparing apples and oranges if we both have 50 pg/ml E2 but my SHBG is 50 and yours is 10.

 

[Joseywales95]

so your e2 would probably benefit you to have 35-70 range (low 50s ideal). From my experience, For every 150 mcg (.15 mg) of daily injectable estradiol, my estradiol increased by 15. I’ve found e2 directly correlates with libido and sensitivity. Not eq. Due to the urge increase it indirectly helps eq to a certain point til it doesn’t. High e2 I notice I’m humping a lot more but with a noodle.

I’ve used injectable e2 now as a base and used it with masteron, deca, tren etc as experiments. It’s nice to be able to pick what level of e2 I have instead of continuing to feed test when I know in my case it disproportionally converts to dht. FYI I do not condone using these other drugs but was experimenting. I’m back on 12mg test prop with 200mcg daily of estradiol valerate.

I aromatize 50% less than you. When my test is at 1050 my e2 is at 20. Grew up with cracking joints and was always off. Very athletic but I had emotional issues and joint issues.

Thanks JA. I'm not sure where I would get my hands on injectable e2. Would maybe a higher dose of HCG suffice to increase E2? The most I've used is 300 IU EOD maybe bumping that up to 500-750?

 

[JA Battle]

That's great detective work and experimentation you've done around finding your ideal E2 levels. I would just say that it's important to include SHBG to put things in context. Much like Total T, Total E2 is relatively meaningless compared to Free E2.

We're comparing apples and oranges if we both have 50 pg/ml E2 but my SHBG is 50 and yours is 10.

Absolutely agree and I’m not sure where it all lands depending on shbg. Because I believe the lower the shbg the higher free dht is in relation to free e2.

 

[JA Battle]

Thanks JA. I'm not sure where I would get my hands on injectable e2. Would maybe a higher dose of HCG suffice to increase E2? The most I've used is 300 IU EOD maybe bumping that up to 500-750?

I think your mileage may vary as hcg can raise dht which impacts the function of the increase in estrogen or raises progesterone in some men which also impacts estrogen’s behavior. I found just directly supplementing to work when those other things never did a whole lot in the department I cared about. Worth a shot. I’m still dialing in and trying different levels. It hasn’t been long for me on estradiol and test as I went right into the testing with other drugs because I did not want to have any aromatizing from testosterone at first. The thing is it’s the only thing that has made any change in this department for me to date.

 

[Joseywales95]

Any thoughts on maybe adding 100mg of deca to increase E2?

 

[t_spacemonkey]

Any thoughts on maybe adding 100mg of deca to increase E2?

deca will fuck your libido beyond belief. you can try daily Tprop injections. something will ramped my libido a bit. I actually would try to find your max tolerable dose of T first. anything up to 40mg daily. yes I will be beaten down for this comment

 

[FunkOdyssey]

I actually would try to find your max tolerable dose of T first.

Not crazy, I'm in the process of doing that right now.

 

[Joseywales95]

deca will fuck your libido beyond belief. you can try daily Tprop injections. something will ramped my libido a bit. I actually would try to find your max tolerable dose of T first. anything up to 40mg daily. yes I will be beaten down for this comment

So just to clarify since I'm low amortizer perhaps a higher dose of test will allow me to hit that E2 feel good threshold? Or is it more of a ratio? If its the latter I don't think this will help me.

 

[t_spacemonkey]

So just to clarify since I'm low amortizer perhaps a higher dose of test will allow me to hit that E2 feel good threshold? Or is it more of a ratio? If its the latter I don't think this will help me.

it might convert to e2 ofc. but it might ramp your libido. i think the key for you is find the root cause of your ED. is it physiological? apparently not, if cialis/viagra don't do shit. do you get aroused ' i want sex' sort of thing if you see some woman is close to you? but then just hard to keep it up? you need to dig into this a bit. the mental part plays a huge role. your prolactin is already ok - but you could go the route of for ex. try 0.25mg pramipexole which is a dopamine analog. that sends the libido of most guys through the roof. I am not convinced that e2 is your issue, although it might be possible

 

[Systemlord]

So just to clarify since I'm low amortizer perhaps a higher dose of test will allow me to hit that E2 feel good threshold? Or is it more of a ratio?

Your ratios are already way off and that's why you have no libido. Your body is unable to create the proper T:E2 ratios.

It's estrogen therapy or BUST!

 

[drp]

What is your age? Do you have BPH?

 

[Joseywales95]

What is your age? Do you have BPH?

35 and no I do not.

 

[HSLD]

deca will fuck your libido beyond belief. you can try daily Tprop injections. something will ramped my libido a bit. I actually would try to find your max tolerable dose of T first. anything up to 40mg daily. yes I will be beaten down for this comment

I have found that I have experienced the best erectile function and libido on the highest doses I have tried. Of course, E2 is high as well.

The problem I run into at higher levels is that HCT increases and sleep quality deteriorates.

 

[jtierney001]

Hey guys,

I was hoping someone may be able to help me with my current ED situation.

To provide additional context to my ongoing health journey, particularly concerning my struggles with erectile dysfunction (ED) while on TRT. Enclosed, Below is my most recent bloodwork, taken during my current TRT regime of 120mg Testosterone Enanthate (Test E) administered MWF.

Testosterone, Total, LC/MS 1067.6
Testosterone, Free 30.00
Sex Horm Binding Glob, Serum 51.4
Estradiol, Sensitive 29.2
Prolactin 10.2
Iron Bind.Cap.(TIBC) 294 (250 - 450)
Iron 61 (38 - 169)
Ferritin 98 (30-400)

A bit about my background: I've been an athlete throughout my life, including being a college swimmer. My fitness journey continued through after college. I maintain a healthy diet for about 5-6 days a week. Prior to hormone therapy, I did not experience any issues with ED or sexual health. To give you a clearer picture, my pre-TRT response to Cialis worked amazingly

My stats are as follows: 6'5" and weighing 215 lbs.

Current supplements: multivitamins, fish oil, vitamin D, selenium, p5p, along with Cialis and Viagra.

The challenge I am facing is ED, which has persisted for the past year and a half despite being on TRT. Initially, I wasn't a candidate for TRT as I had no hypogonadism test was ~375, but I started the treatment in April 2022 (with a dose of 120 from a TRT clinic) to optimize my gym and work performance, and possibly explore performance-enhancing drugs in the future. The first six weeks were promising with enhanced gym performance, libido, and erection quality. However, I soon experienced a decline in libido and erection quality. Following the clinic's advice, I reduced my dose to 100mg and incorporated HCG, but the ED issues persisted. I have experienced moving the dose around for 5-6weeks but to no avail. (All under 200mg)

Despite trying various online suggestions and medication adjustments, including 20mg of Cialis and 100mg of Viagra, my erection quality is still only about 50-70% of what it was pre-TRT. I don't experience nocturnal erections / morning erections.

Curious if anyone has any thoughts! Much appreciated

FWIW, This forum is great for giving ideas for 'detective work' and discovery. So I'll relay a bit of my experience in the hope it helps you find an answer. I was hypogonadal before starting treatment [200-250], but without any loss of libido or erections.

I started with intramuscular injections once every 5 days. Once I dialed in after about 8 weeks, my labido was off the charts. As a continued the protocol my TT went to 760. My erections were fine, but I was starting to experience an inability to orgasm. Meanwhile my Hemoglobin had Hematocrit continued to rise to peak around 18.5 and 54% respectively to the point my Doc told me to stop taking it until I donated blood. Here's the part you may want to consider:

I noticed the problems w/ orgasms and mild ED symptoms coincided with the times my Hemoglobin was peaking. While it didn't affect labido it was having an effect on the actual performance and enjoyment of sex.

I dialed down the dosage to land my TT around 450 to 550 and started injecting sub-Q. I still donate blood every 2 months but my sex drive, erections, and ability to orgasm are all very consistent at the lower level. Also my Hemoglobin and Hematocrit both returned to normal ranges--they don't get as high anymore. I also notice the sensitivity of my man parts increases after donating blood.

So take that as you will. I didn't see any measures you had on your blood thickness or viscosity--but I also notice you're running a much higher TT than I do. While I might like 1000 TT for some things in life, I found a good balance at 1/2 that. Like I said this is FWIW. When dealing with the human body there are many variables and nothing here is presented as an 'answer' to your particular issue as we obviously don't have the same particulars at all. Good luck!

 

[Dicky]

I think your mileage may vary as hcg can raise dht which impacts the function of the increase in estrogen or raises progesterone in some men which also impacts estrogen’s behavior. I found just directly supplementing to work when those other things never did a whole lot in the department I cared about. Worth a shot. I’m still dialing in and trying different levels. It hasn’t been long for me on estradiol and test as I went right into the testing with other drugs because I did not want to have any aromatizing from testosterone at first. The thing is it’s the only thing that has made any change in this department for me to date.

Hey JA. I'm curious at how you are doing these days with your E2 injection protocol. This is interesting to me, as I also aromatize very little. I got my hands on some E2 cream and was using it when I was experimenting with lowering my testosterone dose. I felt fine on lower T, except for aching joints. The T cream was great for helping that. I have since increased my T dose and no longer use the E2 cream, but it was useful when I did use it