Coming off long term TEST use cold turkey - help in Netherlands

[Lucky Luke]

Hello All, i am new.

I have an interesting story on how i have come to be on testosterone for around 7 years.
8 Years ago i had a serious head injury, was suffering a few after side effects and my doc said hormones will speed up recovery. I went on test, hgh, dhea, pregnenolone.
that lasted for 1-2 years before going on test only. Mind you let me add i did try a myriad including test ethanoate,touches, cream before setting with cream and recently shots of sustanon 250.
I have since moved countries and having a family now with 2 jobs i do need my energy.
recently i asked to be moved off cream as i didnt like the way it made me feel (restless and crappy in the mornings) to shots where i feel really normal like i am not on anything.
The specialist said now they are going to cold turkey me and thats it, no discussion.
I am lost for options and worried as i do know how it feels to go cold turkey.
The last testosterone test was 4 and should have been around 25 the doc said, this was after being off for a few months. Please keep in mind i am not sure how they measure here and in what units..
My LH levels where zero and the testosterone when on cream was 70 (i was only only 4-5 pumps out of 6 of the cream tostran 2%).

i dont know if i should wear this cold turkey and put my family through this (have 3 kids under 10yr) or add some sups or even fly to another country. (the original doc has been de-registered FYI)

thoughts, anything will be very helpfull

Lucas

 

[Nelson Vergel]

It is crazy that the new doc in your new country wants to stop your testosterone replacement.

So, you do not have another option to see a new doctor? What country are you in now? What country did you live in before?

There are no supplements that can increase your T like gels or injections can.

 

[ERO]

What country are you in Lucas? Also, any doctor that really understands TRT would not do a cold turkey stop.

 

[Lucky Luke]

in Holland - europe.
they have a different approach here, as much as you may believe that being a liberal country things are different but they run the health system with an iron fist.
I have mentioned HCG and anti estrogen's to help the off period and the response was NO.

they did a test of my adrenals to see if the hypothalamus worked by fasting me and then giving a large shot of insulin, which was NO FUN believe me. The idea was that if the adrenals react within good time its fine. that said they still put me on the cream. until now.

lucas

 

[Lucky Luke]

to add i felt quite a drop to go from cream to shots, but that said more relaxed..

 

[Nelson Vergel]

What country did you move from? Any possibility to get Sustanon there?

 

[Lucky Luke]

australia, maybe would be the answer but then have to drag back through customs massive amounts.....

 

[Nelson Vergel]

Let me ask my buddies in your country to see if I can find another doctor.

 

[Lucky Luke]

Nelson, much appreciated.

 

[Nelson Vergel]

A doctor in Belgium. They are still looking for one in the Netherlands.

This doc is well known world wide.

http://www.hertoghe.eu/patients/

 

[Lucky Luke]

you are correct but he is between 2500-5000 euro to go to and 1 year waiting list.

 

[BBaller]

Lucky Luke,

That is very unfortunate that your physician seems to be mismanaging your care so cavalierly.

I cannot speak to international TRT-prescribing doctors, but I have on previously mentioned Mike from Danger and Play in a thread about stopping TRT cold turkey. From another thread

That said, it's still pretty speculative here but Mike from Danger and Play reports having gone off cold turkey and increased his T levels to the highest in his adult life using a combination of diet, exercise and postural exercises. You can read about that here: http://www.dangerandplay.com/2014/07/30/raised-testosterone-level-naturally-670/

I'm not sure if this will help in your case, but it's worth a shot and if you truly are without other recourse, it might offer some hope for you.

Good luck!

 

[Lucky Luke]

Thanks BBaller, i read what he said he was on for 18months which isn't too long. i am 7 years. that said i am still positive.
also was it just me seeing he had quite some man breasts... ?

i could try it as i have a long extensive training history in many disciplines, shouldn't be hard.
what tends to raise test naturally in the people i have trained with are heavy weight major groups like leg squats etc.
australians can be very hard heavy gym junkies.


my wife refuses to accept the doctors response here, she said she remembers me off for those few months and said no way you can go back there when we are not nearly set up. I am launching another company while managing another with parters while also doing personal training on the side, . my workload is long !
(FYI i do a lot of core and body weight exercises bringing in yoga and even boxing) This is prob the reason why they accused me as being an addict. The Doc said ''gee you look solid, do you train much ?''

the other idea is to fly to Spain or another close country for treatment, they are cheaper and more relaxed...

 

[torrential]

Lucky Luke,

Belgium would be a great location for you, no? Bike or ice skate to your appointment...-). Hertoghe may have other qualified practicioners he could refer you too. Wouldn't hurt to contact his office. They may be sympathetic to the year long wait, not to mention the cost.

Nelson,

Just a thought: Perhaps your overseas contacts would be so kind as to offer comment on the availability of TRT in the European and EU countries. Some prohibit it entirely (Denmark, Sweden) but some may be more progressive (Belgium?). The OP seems to think Spain is TRT friendly. And there have to be other qualified, experienced doctors at other price points out there.

 

[HoustonTX]

I agree with all of the comments that he should seek a doc in his situation. If there is no access to a doc (doesn't seems to be one), why wouldn't anyone suggest that he restart his HPTA? He didn't mention that he had low test naturally, just that he went on to speed up his recovery

 

[Lucky Luke]

Sorry, i should have mentioned yes i was low from the accident. I even rang my old doc( he has retired now) he pointed out i was for sure low when he saw me.

luke

 

[Nelson Vergel]

This directory may help people all over the world:




http://www.a4m.com/directory.html#

 

[GEORGE TOULIATOS]

here is an article i wrote for anabolic.org,concerning HPTA

http://www.anabolic.org/getting-to-know-the-hpta/

 

[Lucky Luke]

Fantastic article DR. The experience expedited in what you say is not something i am used to here.

I did notice you mentioned ''men in their 40's" as i am 41 soon and had a deficit problem to start (spoke with my Australian doc recently about it) i wonder if this process is possible as it has been 7-8 years on test.

The one thing my wife fears the most is my huge energy drop, she remembers when i was off the 3 months and how i didn't do much but slept and wasnt interactive with the kids etc etc. I do recall it wasn't much fun at that time...

Currently i run 2 businesses one of teaching people physically training (not weights just boxing etc) which i do partly with them and the other is a commodity business with partners.

What was expressed to me form my Aust doc was IF i could get off it could years and strict management and no docs here are wanting to work with that, they said slow it down over 3 months and thats it, no tests during that period, no HCG no anti estrogens nothing. Australia is too far away. I CANNOT afford a drop in energy due to my business's and wife & 3 kids.

Dr if you are in Greece would the option to come your way be available ?

Luke

 

[GEORGE TOULIATOS]

Fantastic article DR. The experience expedited in what you say is not something i am used to here.

I did notice you mentioned ''men in their 40's" as i am 41 soon and had a deficit problem to start (spoke with my Australian doc recently about it) i wonder if this process is possible as it has been 7-8 years on test.

The one thing my wife fears the most is my huge energy drop, she remembers when i was off the 3 months and how i didn't do much but slept and wasnt interactive with the kids etc etc. I do recall it wasn't much fun at that time...

Currently i run 2 businesses one of teaching people physically training (not weights just boxing etc) which i do partly with them and the other is a commodity business with partners.

What was expressed to me form my Aust doc was IF i could get off it could years and strict management and no docs here are wanting to work with that, they said slow it down over 3 months and thats it, no tests during that period, no HCG no anti estrogens nothing. Australia is too far away. I CANNOT afford a drop in energy due to my business's and wife & 3 kids.

Dr if you are in Greece would the option to come your way be available ?

Luke

Thank you for your kind words
I am surprised,hearing that MDs in AUS are not experienced on HPTA & AAS use
As far as i know,AAS use is strictly prohibited and a prescription parer is required for any kind of medication.AAS use equals with narcotics and is a pinical crime (as in USA as well).
In GRE doctors are not experienced either on HPTA-AAS,since bodybuilders are not the typical ordinary patiens to be examined from physicians.