Cause of High Estrogen

[jwal90]

I'll keep this short and sweet.


I decided to come off TRT 5 weeks ago after 8 months and I think my system may be back to baseline - the trouble is my baseline was Low T and High E. I'm doing everything I can for good natty levels including:


- Lifting Weights (short, intense)
- 8+ hours sleep
- Meditate, reduce stress
- Supplement Zinc, Vit D/B12 Ashwaganda, Calcium D-Glucerate
- Regular cold showers
- Keep BF below 12%
- Avoiding excessive alcohol intake (2-3 glasses red wine per week)
- Consuming probiotics (fermented food, apple cider vinegar)


I don't know what else I can do. I've had my liver function tested and everything is in range, the only other thing I can think of is gut function. I've had my zinc and D3 levels tested twice over the last year and both times they were at the bottom of the range, so could poor absorption be the issue? I've been supplementing which has barely made any difference. I read somewhere that low zinc correlates to high aromatase.


Can anyone else think of any reasons, given my diet and lifestyle, that I would have high E/low T?

 

[Vince Carter]

You mention gut...do you suffer with heartburn/reflux/GERD???

 

[jwal90]

No but I do suffer from other digestion problems, sometimes I will get constipation for a few days with really bad wind followed by diarrhoea, I took a food intolerance test and have avoided anything that came back on that list which has improved things.

The main thing that makes me suspect gut is that I have a very healthy diet and supplement yet several of my vitamin/mineral tests have come back low so maybe I'm not absorbing minerals properly. Also, I track everything I eat and have to consume around 4000 calories a day to gain weight, considering I'm 5' 10" and 175lbs this seems quite a lot.

 

[Systemlord]

As we age our body parts just don't work like they used to, your liver isn't clearing out the excess estrogen anymore making you estrogen dominant. Where are your SHBG levels?

 

[Vince Carter]

No but I do suffer from other digestion problems, sometimes I will get constipation for a few days with really bad wind followed by diarrhoea, I took a food intolerance test and have avoided anything that came back on that list which has improved things.

The main thing that makes me suspect gut is that I have a very healthy diet and supplement yet several of my vitamin/mineral tests have come back low so maybe I'm not absorbing minerals properly. Also, I track everything I eat and have to consume around 4000 calories a day to gain weight, considering I'm 5' 10" and 175lbs this seems quite a lot.

Ill still suggest you look in to low stomach acid situations, esp you mention you might have some absorption issues for vit/min which could be a key indicator. I supplement stomach acid with Betaine-HCL to help digestion as I suffered with those I mentioned above.

 

[jwal90]

Thanks Vince, I do have some betaine HCL but took it out of my supplement stack a while ago as I felt it wasn't doing much, perhaps I didn't give it long enough. Is there a stomach acid test available on the NHS?

Systemlord, numbers pre-TRT (Dec 2016) were

FSH: 3.4 IU/L (1.4 - 18.1)
LH: 2.9 IU/L (1.5 - 9.3)
Serum T: 9.9 nmol/L (8.4 - 28.7) (max 37 on TRT)
Free T: 0.175 nmol/L (0.169 -0.588) (max 0.749 on TRT)
E2: 168 pmol/L (0-145) (Max 290 on TRT)
SHGB 37.6 nmol/L (17.3 - 65.8)

I appreciate things slow down as we age but I'm only 27 and given my diet and lifestyle I would like to think my hormones would be more balanced than they are.

 

[FeelingLost]

Thanks Vince, I do have some betaine HCL but took it out of my supplement stack a while ago as I felt it wasn't doing much, perhaps I didn't give it long enough. Is there a stomach acid test available on the NHS?

Systemlord, numbers pre-TRT (Dec 2016) were

FSH: 3.4 IU/L (1.4 - 18.1)
LH: 2.9 IU/L (1.5 - 9.3)
Serum T: 9.9 nmol/L (8.4 - 28.7) (max 37 on TRT)
Free T: 0.175 nmol/L (0.169 -0.588) (max 0.749 on TRT)
E2: 168 pmol/L (0-145) (Max 290 on TRT)
SHGB 37.6 nmol/L (17.3 - 65.8)

I appreciate things slow down as we age but I'm only 27 and given my diet and lifestyle I would like to think my hormones would be more balanced than they are.

Hi jwal, just reread your back story. https://www.excelmale.com/forum/sho...a-Complete-Fail-Need-Advice&p=91726#post91726

Man you've been thru hell. Although you have come off of T you still need to take your AI and see if you can get your E2 down. Only once in your posts did I see an E2 reading even close to normal. If you still have a bottle of your old AI start taking some. Maybe start with .25 twice a week and just wait and see how you feel in a month or two.

If you are supplementing with DHEA I would stop that as well. Before I had access to an AI I tried all that OTC crap to lower E2 none of it worked for me. A very low dose .125 EOD took my E2 of 62 down to 29 in 5 weeks.

 

[jwal90]

Thanks mate, I'm sure my HTPA axis is functioning again, I normally wake up with wood most mornings and my nuts are swollen but still getting:

- Horrible anxiety (no depression)
- Insomnia
- 5lb weight fluctuations throughout the day
- No libido/weak erections

Had an E2 test yesterday which should be back next week but I'm so tempted to pop 0.25mg anastrazole to see if it helps with the symptoms above. My only concern, though it's very unlikely, is that my E2 is too low as the symptoms are pretty much they same, I don't want to crash.

Are you on AI monotherapy? I've heard mixed reports about this kind of treatment but if high aromatase is my problem it seems like the most logical solution to raise T/lower.

 

[Zooka15]

Have you tried daily dim and calcium d glucurate to help detox the estrogen.

 

[FeelingLost]

Thanks mate, I'm sure my HTPA axis is functioning again, I normally wake up with wood most mornings and my nuts are swollen but still getting:

- Horrible anxiety (no depression)
- Insomnia
- 5lb weight fluctuations throughout the day
- No libido/weak erections

Had an E2 test yesterday which should be back next week but I'm so tempted to pop 0.25mg anastrazole to see if it helps with the symptoms above. My only concern, though it's very unlikely, is that my E2 is too low as the symptoms are pretty much they same, I don't want to crash.

Are you on AI monotherapy? I've heard mixed reports about this kind of treatment but if high aromatase is my problem it seems like the most logical solution to raise T/lower.

No I am not. However if I was off my T injections and I had high E2 symptoms or a blood test showing high E I would take a very low dose to help get my number down.
In my T journey over the last 14 months I have had low E and high E and I know how both feel. When I have high E feeling I take .125 I can feel it in 4 hours. My prescriptions says 2 per week and an additional can be taken if needed based on how I feel.

 

[jwal90]

Results back from doc:

E2 125 pmol/L (0-145)

Once again said I was in the "normal" range and nothing to worry about It's interesting, as time goes on I'm starting to become familiar with the way my body responds to high/low E and/or low T. Think it's safe to assume my natty T is back in production and is once again getting converted to E readily.

I'm going to stick this out until my appointment in may and try an AI dose of 0.5mg 2x per week. I should be able to get a full blood panel done then including LH, FSH, prolactin etc and weigh up my options from there. I'm not opposed to the idea of getting back on TRT just would like to know if there's any way I can produce my own hormones sufficiently.

Had pretty bad depression the last 2 days and my first panic attack in 2 years which really sucked. Hopefully the AI can at least help with some of these symptoms.

 

[jwal90]

So a very interesting development today, I went to see Dr Savage last weekend and he called me today with the results of my blood tests:


My TT is 18 nmol/L!!


Thyroid was normal and SHGB 39nmol/L , I wasn't given the ranges. Interestingly my E2 was actually low (can't remember the number but think it was 30 pmol) and I had been taking 0.25 AI 2xpw so I will stop this now. These results were also after a moderately heavy night at the pub and a week of no exercise, OK-ish diet and poor sleep.


Was such a massive relief to hear this and I genuinely feel I now have a good shot at getting good levels naturally! Especially if I can get my mineral deficiencies under control and/or work out the root cause of this.


I've got a doc appointment tomorrow (phone) so I'm going to request a scan for varicoceles, diary intolerance test and perhaps a referral to a digestive/gut specialist.