100mg or 80mg weekly Starting Dose? opinions requested

[Jiu Jitsu Dude]

Hi Guys,

I just started my TRT injection today. My urologist has me on 100mg weekly (per my request after reading up here) injections (was going to be 200mg every 2 weeks). I'm not a needle fan but my wife is helping too (don't want 2x weekly injections-too much for me) . Anyways after reading that Dr. Mark Gordan has great luck with 60-80mg per week I was wondering since my Dr appears to be flexible should I consider asking to lower my second injection to 80mg and work up from there based on monthly labs instead of vice versa? Or should I stop smoking crack and leave it alone at 100mg /week?

I also like hearing that low doses may not require e2 control (cypionate only for protocol). At least that's what I'm seeing (reading).

PS.: I'm 52 years old, 5'11 and 240lbs. always been naturally muscular and thick (fat lol) but want to loose 15 lbs. Blessed to be competitively training/teaching and fighting JiuJitsu still. Had 147ng/dl T, Then with Ashwaganda and Vit D, zinc etc got it up to 330 ng/dl but free T was still very low so that's my story..

 

[Vince]

I think 100mg of testosterone cypionate should be a nice starting does, just do labs in 6-12 weeks and adjust from there if necessary. Because many members have struggles with estrogen, they have to go to a very low dose of T. Hopefully you won't be one of them.

 

[Mountain Man]

Start at 100. Adding an AI or HCG is unnecessary and should only be added if you are symptomatic. Don't anticipate problems until you have them. This complicates getting dialed in. Be patient, it's not a miracle cure without time and effort on your part with sleep, diet and exercise.

 

[Jiu Jitsu Dude]

Start at 100. Adding an AI or HCG is unnecessary and should only be added if you are symptomatic. Don’t anticipate problems until you have them. This complicates getting dialed in. Be patient, it’s not a miracle cure without time and effort on your part with sleep, diet and exercise.

Thank You for responding

 

[Jiu Jitsu Dude]

I think 100mg of testosterone cypionate should be a nice starting does, just do labs in 6-12 weeks and adjust from there if necessary. Because many members have struggles with estrogen, they have to go to a very low dose of T. Hopefully you won't be one of them.

Thank you Vince

 

[CoastWatcher]

Always try to keep your protocol as simple as possible. The key words, of course, are, "as possible." Over time, adjustments may be necessary; medications added/removed, doseages increased/decreased, frequency of administration shifted. At the beginning, I urge you to set yourself to the least complicated approach you can find.

 

[Blackhawk]

While I understand needle phobia, I had it myself for a long time, I suspect you are injecting IM with a large needle based on your doctor's orders. You don't have to do it that way. Today, there is already another thread on this subject. You may find you can go with tiny needles more often and feel better about it. https://www.excelmale.com/forum/showthread.php?15636-How-to-inject-Testosterone-Cypionate

Also, you did not state SHBG. Injections 1/week generally work well only for men with relatively high SHBG levels. If you SHBG level is low, you may need much more frequent/smaller injections.

 

[Guided_by_Voices]

I started with a lower dose and worked my way up to find what worked best, and I’m glad I did. The problem with starting with 100 (to paraphrase Dr. Crisler) is that if you don’t feel great you don’t know whether to go up or down. If you start with a lower dose and you feel less than perfect, you can generally assume that your sweet spot will be higher.

 

[Systemlord]

I took that approach in the beginning, not wanting to inject more than once weekly, not only did it fail me but I don't feel as if I'm on TRT unless injecting small doses EOD. SHBG will dictate dosing and injection frequency. Injecting once weekly can cause large swings in hormone levels and it isn't pleasant, smaller injections keep these fluctuations smaller and you feel better.

I doubt your SHBG is high with a low Total T, SHBG is likely lower which makes frequent injections even more important. All doctors specialize in a certain area of medicine, urologist and endocrinologists don't typically specialize in TRT and for this reason the majority of them will fail miserably at TRT by offering outdate protocols (injections every 2 weeks) used decades ago in the clinical trials.

There are specialists out there except they don't take insurance, they exists outside of insurance based healthcare.

 

[Saul]

Another data point. I am at 80 mg per week right now. If I go to 100 mg/week my E2 goes up and I would need an AI. Either is a good starting point but everyone is different so you will need labs.

 

[ratbag]

I believe I read that Dr. Saya was typically starting patients at 50-70mg twice a week. As noted in this thread if you have high SHBG which hasn't been mentioned. Only then would you take 1 shot a week. Otherwise it's a min of 2 shots a week or more. This dictates proper protocol. Your reference to your urologist doing a single shot every 2 weeks we know doesn't work. There is research that supports this. So if you plan on only one shot a week you are already compromising your protocol. Also know that 85% of men give up on TRT within 6 months notably because their MD didn't know how to set a proper protocol. We see this problem all the time here. You need to consider this. When 85% stop TRT because it doesn't work... it simply means it's not easy to get working.

 

[jdthoosier]

Another data point. I am at 80 mg per week right now. If I go to 100 mg/week my E2 goes up and I would need an AI. Either is a good starting point but everyone is different so you will need labs.

I do 72 mg every week and I simply cannot get to even 80 mg w/o a ton of side effects. We keep trying to increase cypionate to deal with my higher SHBG and every time I just cannot tolerate the side effects.

 

[sh1973]

I do 72 mg every week and I simply cannot get to even 80 mg w/o a ton of side effects. We keep trying to increase cypionate to deal with my higher SHBG and every time I just cannot tolerate the side effects.

I have really high shbg and cannot tolerate over 80mg per week without side effects. I’ve tried several injection frequencies over the years and for me once weekly is far superior to anything I’ve tried. I’m only doing 68mg per week and feel pretty well overall.

 

[jdthoosier]

I have really high shbg and cannot tolerate over 80mg per week without side effects. I've tried several injection frequencies over the years and for me once weekly is far superior to anything I've tried. I'm only doing 68mg per week and feel pretty well overall.

You have the lowest dosage I've seen yet. I'm still doing injections 2x a week. What about HCG?

 

[sh1973]

Hcg or dhea really do nothing subjective for me. I’ve had a vasectomy 9 years ago and obviously fertility isn’t an issue. My shbg is in the 60-70 range and twice weekly made me feel like total garbage even with the same dose. Another thing I’ve noticed at least with me is testosterone, even high doses don’t budge my shbg. It’s really finding where you feel best. I feel best with free t in the 10-14ng range which some doctors will say is low, but for me it’s good. I’ve had free t levels up into the low 40s at one time and felt like death and felt bad even in the low 20s. I know an older guy that’s been on the standard 200mg every two weeks for about five years and swears he feels fantastic. TRT is totally subjective in every aspect.

 

[Jiu Jitsu Dude]

Thanks for the info

 

[Jiu Jitsu Dude]

Another data point. I am at 80 mg per week right now. If I go to 100 mg/week my E2 goes up and I would need an AI. Either is a good starting point but everyone is different so you will need labs.

Thanks Saul

 

[Jiu Jitsu Dude]

I took that approach in the beginning, not wanting to inject more than once weekly, not only did it fail me but I don't feel as if I'm on TRT unless injecting small doses EOD. SHBG will dictate dosing and injection frequency. Injecting once weekly can cause large swings in hormone levels and it isn't pleasant, smaller injections keep these fluctuations smaller and you feel better.

I doubt your SHBG is high with a low Total T, SHBG is likely lower which makes frequent injections even more important. All doctors specialize in a certain area of medicine, urologist and endocrinologists don't typically specialize in TRT and for this reason the majority of them will fail miserably at TRT by offering outdate protocols (injections every 2 weeks) used decades ago in the clinical trials.

There are specialists out there except they don't take insurance, they exists outside of insurance based healthcare.

Thank You .......

 

[Jiu Jitsu Dude]

I started with a lower dose and worked my way up to find what worked best, and I’m glad I did. The problem with starting with 100 (to paraphrase Dr. Crisler) is that if you don’t feel great you don’t know whether to go up or down. If you start with a lower dose and you feel less than perfect, you can generally assume that your sweet spot will be higher.

That makes sense

 

[Jiu Jitsu Dude]

While I understand needle phobia, I had it myself for a long time, I suspect you are injecting IM with a large needle based on your doctor's orders. You don't have to do it that way. Today, there is already another thread on this subject. You may find you can go with tiny needles more often and feel better about it. https://www.excelmale.com/forum/showthread.php?15636-How-to-inject-Testosterone-Cypionate

Also, you did not state SHBG. Injections 1/week generally work well only for men with relatively high SHBG levels. If you SHBG level is low, you may need much more frequent/smaller injections.

Thanks Black Hawk