Wondering what to do. 23m

Aluudon · 2026-03-20T12:39:14-0500

I am 23m 6’2 275

Recent blood tests have shown a total Test level of 260ngdl

My doctors are very reluctant to give me a requisition for FH and LH, which would determine the cause of this borderline hypogonadism level.

My diet and training is extremely locked in. 21-2300 cal with 200+ protein ever day.

I am experiencing many symptoms of hypogonadism, and am looking into self medicating.

I’ve done a shit ton of research, and at this point have considered HCG, and enclo before self administering a testosterone dose of 125-200mg a week. I have on hand a list of what I believe is all of the required add ons (AI, duta for dht, and ezetimbe for LDL)

Just looking for some advice and opinion regarding this as I would really like to be starting treatment sooner than next year which is what I’m looking at if I go the doctor way

I have to go self administered or through family doctor because unfortunately I can’t afford a TRT clinic.

Nelson Vergel · 2026-03-20T12:55:23-0500

what country are you in?

Aluudon · 2026-03-20T13:05:33-0500

Nelson Vergel said:
what country are you in?

Canada

Nelson Vergel · 2026-03-20T13:12:02-0500

You may want to try this:

C

Thread 'BloodTestsCanada.com - BlueHorizons (Canada)'

Feb 14, 2023

Hi everyone.

Thought I'd contribute to this section by letting everybody know I've used this online company 5 times in the past year for bloodwork and each time went smoothly.

All you do is select the test you want, pay (including with Paypal) and print off a requisition (or upload online) to Dynacare labs in your area.

Within 24-hours I can typically see my tests on Dynacare Plus website and I get an e-mail with results from Blue Horizon's shortly after.

Very convenient for monitoring testosterone/HRT without the hassle of a conventional doctor's request.

C

Thread 'Canadian Patients: Dynacare Sensitive Estradiol Test'

Mar 22, 2018

Canadian patients taking advantage of Dynacare's introduction of the Sensitive (LC, MS, MS) Estradiol test should ALWAYS CONFIRM THAT THE CLERK AT THE RECEPTION DESK HAS ENTERED THE PROPER CODE FOR THE SENSITIVE TEST. Earlier this week I discovered that the "standard" e2 test had been entered despite the fact that my doctor had clearly ordered the sensitive test. I only caught it because I asked to see what the clerk had ordered. It was wrong. In fact, she argued that there was only one estradiol test and she had entered it properly. She hadn't. We have to remain our own advocates.

madman · 2026-03-20T18:43:14-0500

Aluudon said:
I am 23m 6’2 275

Recent blood tests have shown a total Test level of 260ngdl

My doctors are very reluctant to give me a requisition for FH and LH, which would determine the cause of this borderline hypogonadism level.

My diet and training is extremely locked in. 21-2300 cal with 200+ protein ever day.

I am experiencing many symptoms of hypogonadism, and am looking into self medicating.

I’ve done a shit ton of research, and at this point have considered HCG, and enclo before self administering a testosterone dose of 125-200mg a week. I have on hand a list of what I believe is all of the required add ons (AI, duta for dht, and ezetimbe for LDL)

Just looking for some advice and opinion regarding this as I would really like to be starting treatment sooner than next year which is what I’m looking at if I go the doctor way

I have to go self administered or through family doctor because unfortunately I can’t afford a TRT clinic.

Welcome to Nelson's house!

Forget fretting over your dismal TT 260 ng/dL as your FT would be subpar/low!

Two the biggest labs in Canada (Lifelabs and Dynacare) both have slightly different reference ranges for TT.

Lifelabs 8.4-28.8 nmol/L or 242-830 ng/dL and Dynacare 7.6-31.4 or 219-905 ng/dL.

https://www.rainbowhealthontario.ca/TransHealthGuide/pdf/AppendixJ.pdf

Dynacare - TESTOSTERONE

TESTOSTERONE

www.dynacare.ca

Your TT is hovering just above Lifelabs bottom end and not too far off from Dynacares bottom end.

Even then although TT is important to know FT is what truly matters as it is the active unbound fraction of T responsible for the positive effects.

Again with a dismal TT 260 ng/dL it is a given that your FT would be low or fall in the grey zone where some men may experience symptoms of low-T.

FT <5 ng/dL would be considerd low.

FT 5-9 ng/dL would be considered the grey zone where some men may experience symptoms of low-T.

FT 10-15 ng/dL would be healthy.

FT 20-25 ng/dL would be high-end/high.

You need to seek out a doctor who understands this.

Anyone in the know who specializes in T therapy would treat a man experiencing symptoms of low testosterone and a FT <10 ng/dL.

Would tread lightly when it comes to self-treating especially if you lack the understanding of how exogenous T works and what is a sensible starting dose.

Too many are caught up on that more T is better mentality and end up being overmedicated off the hop or on therapy which can cause numerous issues especially when it comes to elevated hematocrit and libido/erectile function.

The body was never meant to be amped up on T 24/7 steady-state.

Yes most men on TTh are injecting 100-200 mg T/week whether once weekly or split into more frequent injections.

The majority of men can easily achieve a healthy/high trough FT injecting 100-150 mg T/week especially when split into more frequent injections.

Yes there will always be those outliers who may need the higher-end dose 200 mg T/week but it is far from common as in rare.

Such dose would easily have the majority of men overmedicated.

Keep in mind some men can achieve stellar levels injecting <100 mg T/week especially when split into more frequent injections.

Most doctors in Canada will not go above 150 mg T/week not because they are sticklers but more so because the majority of men can easily hit a healthy/high trough FT on such.

Rare one would need to go much higher!

The standard starting dose is 100 mg T/week or 50 mg T split twice-weekly.

Always best to start low and go slow on a T-only protocol so we can see where said protocol (dose T/injection frequency) has your trough TT and more importantly FT, estradiol and SHBG let alone critical blood markers RBCs, hemoglobin and hematocrit.

There will always be time to increase the dose or throw in hCG if need be.

Forget use of an AI as they are rarely needed and definitely do not mess with those %-ARIs (finasteride/dutasteride) as you are going to be in a work of hurt especially when is comes to sexual function!

Absolutely no need to jump in head first here.

What province do you live in?

Thread 'Testosterone Therapy in Canada'

Mar 25, 2023

@Marcel

THE DEA And ACCESS TO TRT TELEMEDICINE - Page 6 - ExcelMale Forum. TRT, Hormones, Peptides, Men’s Health

COMMENTS DUE DATE: MARCH 31. THE DEA WANTS TO LIMIT YOUR ACCESS TO TELEMEDICINE EXECUTIVE SUMMARY: The DEA has proposed new rules to update the Ryan Haight Act, which could negatively affect telemedicine prescribing of non-narcotic medications in Schedules III, IV, and V. These rules would...

www.excelmale.com

We have always been far worse off than the US when it comes to the treatment of men for testosterone deficiency.

Although there has been some improvement in certain areas we are still lacking in many others.

*In 2013, a comprehensive Canada-wide needs assessment revealed that over 25% of Canadian physicians were uncomfortable with the diagnosis and treatment of TD and identified significant knowledge gaps related to patient management.4 To address...

Thread 'Testosterone Products in Canada - (oral, nasal, transdermal, injectable)'

Oct 12, 2024

Big pharma transdermal T patch Androderm manufactured by Allergan Inc. was discontinued back in 2018!

Big pharma brand name Andriol (oral TU) manufactured by Merck was also discontinued back in 2018 and more recently 2024 our beloved Delatestryl (testosterone enanthate) manufactured by Valeant has been discontinued.

The only oral TU available is the generic PMS-Testosterone and Taro-Testosterone capsules.

Come 2025 we may have the option to use the newer versions of oral TU Kyzatrex or Tlando which are available in the US as Marius Pharmaceuticals and Verity Pharmaceuticals are...

Thread 'Largest dataset of mFT levels to date: male reference ranges spanning a wide age range, using a gold standard ED LC-MS/MS method'

Mar 14, 2026

Sit and dwell on that!

Think of all those overmedicated men on T-therapy gassed up on FT well beyond their natty genetic set-point and unfortunately many off them off the hop!

You can blame all those run of the mill T clinics, kiddie forums loaded with all those numbskulls, throw those blast n cruisers in there too and put the icing on the cake the cesspool of so called gurus polluting gootube!

Gotta love all those kiddie forums loaded with the brainwashed sheep still pushing that more T is better mentality dishing out piss poor advice!

So much misinformation littered on the net its...

Post in thread 'Lab results seem way too high'

Oct 23, 2025

This one is going out to all those newbies especially the ones self-treating that clearly have NO CLUE what the f**k they are doing!

Yes even when you are f**king with TP the first 3 weeks means nothing when looking at the bigger picture here!

Damn shame!

26. What is a reasonable timeline to begin to observe improvements in the signs and symptoms of testosterone deficiency?

*Following the initiation of testosterone therapy, serum concentrations of testosterone are known to correct earlier than the symptomatic, structural, and metabolic signs associated with TD.76,77 As...

Post in thread 'Impact of TRT and Supraphysiological Testosterone Doses on Biological Aging'

Oct 8, 2025

Gman86 said:
I personally just go by the range labcorp and quest uses. I personally feel best with a free T higher than average. At least 40 on Labcorp’s range, and at least 400 on quest’s range. Which might seem really high to some, but that’s just where I’ve found that I feel best. And there’s a famous TRT doc that all of us have come across at some point. I’m blanking on his name, but I know throughout all the patients he’s treated, he said on average his patients do best with a free T between 40-60. Which is Labcorp’s range. It would be roughly 400-600 using quest’s range

STILL...

Post in thread 'How do you know when to take an AI.'

Nov 26, 2025

firefighterinNC said:
Little update - went back to the original endocrinologist today. He reviewed my lab work from the last year and gave me some options. Basically he said I could come off testosterone for a while and let my receptors cleanse themselves. I asked about Kyzatrex and he said he has seen good success with it, just as good if not better than injections, but I needed to be prepared for a price increase over injections.
He told me to skip this weeks dose of test cypionate to down regulate a bit and then start Kyzatrex next week whenever it came in the mail.
Kyzatrex for 12 weeks and then...

Aluudon · 2026-03-20T20:02:42-0500

madman said:
Welcome to Nelson's house!

Forget fretting over your dismal TT 260 ng/dL as your FT would be subpar/low!

Two the biggest labs in Canada (Lifelabs and Dynacare) both have slightly different reference ranges for TT.

Lifelabs 8.4-28.8 nmol/L or 242-830 ng/dL and Dynacare 7.6-31.4 or 219-905 ng/dL.

[
View attachment 56158

View attachment 56159

Your TT is hovering just above Lifelabs bottom end and not too far off from Dynacares bottom end.

Even then although TT is important to know FT is what truly matters as it is the active unbound fraction of T responsible for the positive effects.

Again with a dismal TT 260 ng/dL it is a given that your FT would be low or fall in the grey zone where some men may experience symptoms of low-T.

FT <5 ng/dL would be considerd low.

FT 5-9 ng/dL would be considered the grey zone where some men may experience symptoms of low-T.

FT 10-15 ng/dL would be healthy.

FT 20-25 ng/dL would be high-end/high.

You need to seek out a doctor who understands this.

Anyone in the know who specializes in T therapy would treat a man experiencing symptoms of low testosterone and a FT <10 ng/dL.

Would tread lightly when it comes to self-treating especially if you lack the understanding of how exogenous T works and what is a sensible starting dose.

Too many are caught up on that more T is better mentality and end up being overmedicated off the hop or on therapy which can cause numerous issues especially when it comes to elevated hematocrit and libido/erectile function.

The body was never meant to be amped up on T 24/7 steady-state.

Yes most men on TTh are injecting 100-200 mg T/week whether once weekly or split into more frequent injections.

The majority of men can easily achieve a healthy/high trough FT injecting 100-150 mg T/week especially when split into more frequent injections.

Yes there will always be those outliers who may need the higher-end dose 200 mg T/week but it is far from common as in rare.

Such dose would easily have the majority of men overmedicated.

Keep in mind some men can achieve stellar levels injecting <100 mg T/week especially when split into more frequent injections.

Most doctors in Canada will not go above 150 mg T/week not because they are sticklers but more so because the majority of men can easily hit a healthy/high trough FT on such.

Rare one would need to go much higher!

The standard starting dose is 100 mg T/week or 50 mg T split twice-weekly.

Always best to start low and go slow on a T-only protocol so we can see where said protocol (dose T/injection frequency) has your trough TT and more importantly FT, estradiol and SHBG let alone critical blood markers RBCs, hemoglobin and hematocrit.

There will always be time to increase the dose or throw in hCG if need be.

Forget use of an AI as they are rarely needed and definitely do not mess with those %-ARIs (finasteride/dutasteride) as you are going to be in a work of hurt especially when is comes to sexual function!

Absolutely no need to jump in head first here.

What province do you live in?

I live in Ontario, I have a requisition from my doctor to get TT retested, as well as FT and SHBG tested.
My family has a history of baldness so I wanted to get fin in case hair thinning occurs.
I understand a bit about how exogenous hormones work, I’ve done a good amount research. I just have never done them.

The reason I want to have AI on hand is because my body fat is above 30% and aromatization is way more likely to occur. On low dose, probably not, but better to have than to not.

Obviously, all of these things are determined by bloods, I’m just buying them in case.

madman · 2026-03-21T10:32:47-0500

Aluudon said:
I live in Ontario, I have a requisition from my doctor to get TT retested, as well as FT and SHBG tested.
My family has a history of baldness so I wanted to get fin in case hair thinning occurs.
I understand a bit about how exogenous hormones work, I’ve done a good amount research. I just have never done them.

The reason I want to have AI on hand is because my body fat is above 30% and aromatization is way more likely to occur. On low dose, probably not, but better to have than to not.

Obviously, all of these things are determined by bloods, I’m just buying them in case.

From my pm.

Yes in Canada your FT will be tested using the calculated linear law-of-mass action Vermeulen (cFTV) which will give a good approximation and is considered the next best testing method as unfortunately the gold standard Equilibrium Dialysis which is the most accurate testing method for free testosterone is not easily accessible to most men living in Canada.

Both Dynacare and Lifelabs use the calculated Vermeulen method.

You can easily do it yourself online for free as the calculator is available to the general public.

Free & Bioavailable Testosterone calculator

Just need to know your TT, SHBG and Albumin in order to calculate your FT.

The default Albumin 4.3 g/dL can be used if you do not know where it sits.

Even then in Ontario your labs should be covered by OHIP in most cases.

I always use Dynacare.

Definitely need to address the excess adipose as use of exogenous T especially injections can easily drive your FT which will drive up estradiol.

Even then you still need to tread lightly when it comes to the use of an AI.

If anything micro dosing is where its at and bottom line here is making sure you do not drive this critical metabolite too low otherwise you will be in a world of hurt especially for long-term cardiovascular and bone health let alone maintaining a healthy libido/erectile function, throw in the positive effects on lipids in there too!

Again need to tread lightly when it comes to the use of 5-ARIs (finasteride/dutasteride) especially when it comes to sexual function and mental health.

I clearly understand many men are concerned about hair loss when using exogenous T as this side-effect can happen to individuals that are prone to such as in the men that have a genetic predisposition to MPB.

The majority of sides when using exogenous T are the result of running too high a trough/steady-state FT level let alone when it comes to cosmetic sides such as oily skin/acne, excessive body hair, MPB, gynecomastia your genetics will have the final say.

Keep in mind when it comes to MPB/AGA your chance of accelerating such when using exogenous T comes down to genetics and sensitivity of the AR/hair follices to DHT.

Important point often overlooked here is that high DHT is not always needed as again it comes down to the sensitivity of the AR/hair follices to DHT.

MPB is genetic and regardless of whether one is on T-theray or natty it is inevitable and will happen at a certain time point in ones life.

Some experience it in their early 20s whereas in others it will not start until decades later.

Testosterones metabolite dht plays a big role here but it really comes down to the sensitivity of ones AR to dht and ones threshold as balding can happen even in genetically prone individuals with lower dht levels.

Testosterone use/abuse can speed up the process in genetically prone individuals.

Many men have this fear when jumping on exogenous T whether therapeutically or when abusing testosterone and resort to the use of a 5 alpha reductase inhibitor without thinking about the horrible sexual/mental sides they can cause.

* The most common side effects of 5-ARIs include impotence, decreased libido, ejaculatory disorders, and gynecomastia.14 Less common side effects that have been reported include infertility, breast tenderness, depression, anxiety, dementia, and suicide. 15-18

* Changes in neuroactive steroids following 5-ARI use can lead to dysfunction of the dopaminergic system, reduction of hippocampal neurogenesis, an increase in neuroinflammation, alterations of the HPA axis, and epigenetic modification. Moreover, the alterations of the neuroactive steroids, especially AP, are also linked to the alteration of central nervous system receptor functions including dopaminergic receptors, GABA-A receptors, estrogen receptors, and androgen receptors

As I have stated numerous times on the forum we need to tread lightly when trying to manipulate testosterone metabolites estradiol and DHT as they are needed in healthy amounts and are critical to our overall health.

Ts metabolites estradiol and DHT are needed in healthy amounts to experience the full spectrum of testosterones beneficial effects on (cardiovascular health, brain health, libido, erectile function, bone health, tendon health, immune system, lipids, and body composition).

*Natural testosterone is viewed as the best androgen for substitution in hypogonadal men. The reason behind the selection is that testosterone can be converted to DHT and E2, thus developing the full spectrum of testosterone activities in long-term substitution

Thread 'Androgenetic alopecia'

May 25, 2024

Androgenetic alopecia (AGA) is the most common nonscarring alopecia and is characterised by distinct gradual patterned hair loss. AGA is mediated by genetic predisposition and excessive follicular sensitivity to androgens, mainly in males, leading to the progressive conversion of scalp terminal hair into vellus hair. Although highly prevalent, it is not fatal but may have a severe psychosocial impact, especially on females and younger males. Significant advances have been made in understanding AGA’s epidemiology and pathophysiology, but only 2 drugs remain approved by the FDA -...

Look over post #15

Post in thread 'Dht lowering medications'

Aug 27, 2022

Checkmate7 said:
Thank you,appreciate it. Guess just reduce 5 alpha reductase enzyme

TREAD LIGHTLY!

The clinical applications of 5ARi's - ExcelMale Forum. TRT, Hormones, Peptides, Men’s Health

Introduction: Five-alpha reductase (5-AR) deficiency was first identified by Imperato-McGinley and Walsh as the cause of pseudohermaphroditism in two separate studies. The discoveries led to the development of finasteride (inhibitor of type 2 isoenzyme of 5-AR) and dutasteride (inhibitor of type...

www.excelmale.com

The most common side effects of 5-ARIs include impotence, decreased libido, ejaculatory disorders, and gynecomastia.14 Less common side effects that have been reported include infertility, breast tenderness, depression, anxiety, dementia, and suicide. 15-18...

Post in thread 'Thinking about TRT and could use some guidance'

Sep 6, 2025

JSMITH1976 said:
Thanks for this. I was under impression that 200mg/wk was the usual minimum effective starting dose so 100mg would be a conservative dose. If I do decide to go with TRT I will start at 50mg/wk and check levels in 3 months to see how things are going.

Thanks for this. I was under impression that 200mg/wk was the usual minimum effective starting dose so 100mg would be a conservative dose.

Way off here!

200 mg/week is considered the top-end therapeutic dose and even then the majority would be overmedicated on such.

Standard starting dose and this is coming from those...

Thread 'T and Male Bone Health: A Puzzle of Interactions'

Apr 4, 2025

Figure 1 339x190 mm ( x DPI)

https://academic.oup.com/jcem/advance-article-abstract/doi/10.1210/clinem/dgaf191/8090450?redirectedFrom=fulltext&login=false

Bone Structure: The Key Players Under the Magnifying Glass

Testosterone in men is mainly secreted by the gonads, with minor contributions from the adrenal cortex. Testosterone and DHT exert their effects through the androgen receptor (AR). Testosterone can be aromatized to bind estrogen receptors (ER and ER) (20, 21). AR and ERs are expressed on osteoblasts and osteocytes, though their presence...

Thread 'Testosterone and Bone Density with Dr. Abe Morgentaler'

Nov 9, 2022

Testosterone is important for the bones!

One of the things physicians should look for in men with low bone density is testosterone levels. Men who have low levels of testosterone are at risk for osteoporosis. However, recent studies have shown that men on testosterone therapy who are testosterone deficient and have low bone density saw improved levels in bone density.

Thread 'Approach to Gynecomastia in Primary Care Clinics'

Aug 26, 2022

An Approach to Gynecomastia in Primary Care Clinics (2022)
Kavya Bharathidasan, MD, Jordan Curl, BS, Vedesh Kumar Babu, MD, Shaili Felton, MD, and Kenneth Nugent, MD

Abstract

Gynecomastia is a more common finding in primary care clinics than is recognized. Because this finding can be easily overlooked, appropriate investigation and management often are missed. The workup of gynecomastia is highly individualized, based on the patient’s presentation and related factors. It should be guided by thorough history taking and physical examination. Unless the patient has...

Thread 'Gynecomastia: Approach to Evaluation and Management of a Common Disorder'

Dec 14, 2023

Dr. Sathya Krishnasamy gave a comprehensive overview of gynecomastia, covering its definition, prevalence, hormonal regulation, pathogenesis, differentials, and management options. He discussed the role of androgen receptor and aromatase in breast development, as well as the impact of various drugs, tumors, and environmental factors on gynecomastia. The session also included a case study and highlighted the importance of a thorough evaluation to determine the underlying cause, along with potential treatment options.

Highlights: