What is the “common” definition of bodyfat?

[nodoctor]

I know scales are not perfect, but here is the read out from mine. Am I 12.2% body fat? Or should I be using subcutaneous which puts me at 10.6%? Maybe the picture helps.

Any help much appreciated.

 

[tareload]

I know scales are not perfect, but here is the read out from mine. Am I 12.2% body fat? Or should I be using subcutaneous which puts me at 10.6%? Maybe the picture helps.

Any help much appreciated.

You would use SC if you concerned with external fat. Obvious you dont have much visceral. What scale is this? Multi zone impedance model?

10.6% appears way high even in athlete mode Assuming bottom matches the top and back matches front. You have some weird fat hidden out of view of pic or is it representative?

Nice work!

 

[nodoctor]

It is a Renpho. Probably not expensive. I think it is that technology that sends a small electrical pulse because it only takes like a couple seconds.

 

[nodoctor]

And thanks for the kind words! I can still pinch subcutaneous belly fat though, so maybe the lighting is favorable in that picture as well.

 

[tareload]

It is a Renpho. Probably not expensive. I think it is that technology that sends a small electrical pulse because it only takes like a couple seconds.

Yep looked it up. Just the feet vs the Inbody that has handles as well. These machines use an empirical formula to match impedance vs BF. Good lighting but lighting doesn't give you visible veins on lower abs. Can't see the rest of you but you look sub 9% to me. Way 2 go!

 

[nodoctor]

Yep looked it up. Just the feet vs the Inbody that has handles as well. These machines use an empirical formula to match impedance vs BF. Good lighting but lighting doesn't give you visible veins on lower abs. Can't see the rest of you but you look sub 9% to me. Way 2 go!

Thanks! Is there any consensus on this forum as to what the value play for a relatively accurate bodyfat measurement is?

My scale works to track progress I think because I like to weigh once or twice a day to keep my mind thinking about reducing body fat, but it would be nice to know where I am at overall.

 

[tareload]

subcutaneous belly fat

Belly fat or skin? If you used to be heavier it could be extra skin. At this point doing relative caliper measurements probably more useful if you wanted to go lower. But that ain't healthy long term of course.

 

[tareload]

Thanks! Is there any consensus on this forum as to what the value play for a relatively accurate bodyfat measurement is?

My scale works to track progress I think because I like to weigh once or twice a day to keep my mind thinking about reducing body fat, but it would be nice to know where I am at overall.

Local Dexa scan for under $100 usually. All these measurements come with some error until death where they could actually weigh all the components.

BodPod I have tried as well.

 

[BigTex]

I know scales are not perfect, but here is the read out from mine. Am I 12.2% body fat? Or should I be using subcutaneous which puts me at 10.6%? Maybe the picture helps.

Any help much appreciated.

I like using these visuals. My guess from looking at your picture is you are probably in the 8-10% BF range. Especially if you put on oil like the guy in the picture did. Congratulations! Your scales are bioelectrical impedance analysis and could be off by 21-34%. I have observed that the more athletic you are the more it pushes your body fat levels upward. So the answer to your question 8-10% is probably more accurate. I agree with Readalot that skinfold calipers might be much more useful to you, better yet Dexa.

I did just find this:

The Renpho scale is quite accurate compared to the DEXA body scan with weight off by -1.5%, body fat off by 9.3%, muscle mass off by -3.61%, BMR off by -4.8%, and bone mass off by 2.9%.

"A comparison table demonstrating Renpho scale accuracy versus the dexa body scan.

Definitely a good machine to track progress as it will show if you are gaining or losing. However, I agree that at this point you need to do either a skin fold analysis or DEXA.

 

[BigTex]

@nodoctor, I am very impressed with the accuracy of this BIA scale. It is rated everywhere I have looked as the best once available. In fact, I have just purchased on to use at work in place of the hand held BIA we are given by the department. I also got one for home, no doubt my wife will strangle me for this. Check out this comparison to a DEXA. Damn reasonable price too...$27.

 

[nodoctor]

Belly fat or skin? If you used to be heavier it could be extra skin. At this point doing relative caliper measurements probably more useful if you wanted to go lower. But that ain't healthy long term of course.

I don't have much extra skin. I'm 149 now at 5'9" and the heaviest I've been was 185 when working out heavy and super often so mainly muscle (with some fat for sure).

I thought it was agreed to be healthy down to 8-9% bodyfat? My plan is to stay at the lowest bodyfat that feels healthy for me which I'm guessing will be that range. I know body builders to 5% and then back up to 12-15+ which isn't my plan.

 

[nodoctor]

I like using these visuals. My guess from looking at your picture is you are probably in the 8-10% BF range. Especially if you put on oil like the guy in the picture did. Congratulations! Your scales are bioelectrical impedance analysis and could be off by 21-34%. I have observed that the more athletic you are the more it pushes your body fat levels upward. So the answer to your question 8-10% is probably more accurate. I agree with Readalot that skinfold calipers might be much more useful to you, better yet Dexa.

View attachment 23602

I did just find this:

The Renpho scale is quite accurate compared to the DEXA body scan with weight off by -1.5%, body fat off by 9.3%, muscle mass off by -3.61%, BMR off by -4.8%, and bone mass off by 2.9%.

"A comparison table demonstrating Renpho scale accuracy versus the dexa body scan.

View attachment 23603


Definitely a good machine to track progress as it will show if you are gaining or losing. However, I agree that at this point you need to do either a skin fold analysis or DEXA.

Very helpful. So I guess I still look at the "bodyfat" one not the subq which puts me at 12.2 but I agree I'm in the 10 or just below based on those pictures. Which is maybe in the ballpark since your example has a 1.4% bump with renpho which would translate toe 10.8% for me.

 

[nodoctor]

@nodoctor, I am very impressed with the accuracy of this BIA scale. It is rated everywhere I have looked as the best once available. In fact, I have just purchased on to use at work in place of the hand held BIA we are given by the department. I also got one for home, no doubt my wife will strangle me for this. Check out this comparison to a DEXA. Damn reasonable price too...$27.

hahaha. That's my scale, but the later generation. Maybe they've gotten better and I should buy another for another part of the house. $27 is basically free.

 

[tareload]

@nodoctor, I am very impressed with the accuracy of this BIA scale. It is rated everywhere I have looked as the best once available. In fact, I have just purchased on to use at work in place of the hand held BIA we are given by the department. I also got one for home, no doubt my wife will strangle me for this. Check out this comparison to a DEXA. Damn reasonable price too...$27.

For the price and relative tracking I agree seems a value buy for most. If you want to get in the weeds I can share some of the Inbody stuff which is same principle but multiple compartments and frequencies. But at $5 to 10k quite a leap.

InBody in Studies - InBody USA

How accurate is the InBody? Explore over 400 medical studies that utilize InBody for their research purposes and validate its accuracy.

inbodyusa.com

 

[tareload]

Which is maybe in the ballpark since your example has a 1.4% bump with renpho which would translate toe 10.8% for me.

That would be difference for that particular person on that day. Remember these BIA scales have a fancy equation to correlate measurement against a standard like DEXA...

Example: each data point is a person

All the serious bodybuilders would tell you going lower only requires calipers and mirror for precision work. But for most these scales will do the trick for relative comparisons.

More BIA info...

Body Fat Series: Bioimpedance (BIA)

Naked's in-house research scientist dives into the literature on impedance, the common choice for in home body fat assessment.

nakedlabs.com

 

[tareload]

thought it was agreed to be healthy down to 8-9% bodyfat? My plan is to stay at the lowest bodyfat that feels healthy for me which I'm guessing will be that range. I know body builders to 5% and then back up to 12-15+ which isn't my plan.

Yep which is where you probably are. I said going lower meaning getting down there where you start to really stress multiple body systems. You are doing awesome.

 

[tareload]

If anyone wants to compare against measurement formulas....

Summary of Bodyfat Estimation Equations - Copy into MS Excel

May save you some time from posing the question on here…what’s my bodyfat %? If you can’t get a consensus under 15% mean with +/-3% SD then decent chance the answer is too darn high. Could also use the quick rule of thumb: waist-to-height ratio: keep it <=0.5 --see more info in the thread...

forums.t-nation.com

Would be interested in seeing other people's results for the table I mention in the link above vs other methods (BIA, DEXA, Bodpod, etc).

 

[BigTex]

I don't have much extra skin. I'm 149 now at 5'9" and the heaviest I've been was 185 when working out heavy and super often so mainly muscle (with some fat for sure).

I thought it was agreed to be healthy down to 8-9% bodyfat? My plan is to stay at the lowest bodyfat that feels healthy for me which I'm guessing will be that range. I know body builders to 5% and then back up to 12-15+ which isn't my plan.

3% is the bottom line for health for essential far for males. However, it is very individual. One of the subjects I tested in grad school for a research project was on the Div I-AA football program and was a 1st round draft pick for San Diego that year. He was 3%. I asked him what he was doing to be so low and he said nothing. He ate all of his meals at the cafeteria, no special diet. He was perfectly and been low far all his life. Don't worry about going up unless you are planning on adding a lot of mass for competition. As long as you feel good and your metabolics are good keep your body fat levels where you feel comfortable. As you see from the chart below you are in the athletic range.

 

[BigTex]

Exactly Readalot! Once you start getting down to <8% calipers and the mirror are your best bet. There are so many dietary tricks bodybuilders do the last 2 weeks before a show manipulating water, carbs and minerals that they makes some drastic changes during that time. Most of all everyone is slightly different. I have a friend that competes at our gym and he loves using Metformin during off season to help avoid the spill over effects of eating carbs and they takes around 20 weeks to get to the contest. They deal with a whole lot of individual variables at this point particularly pulling the water of out the sub-q level and then filling the muscle cell up 1quickly with water and glucose starting the night before. I have worked with some top level competitors including my wife during the last two weeks. It is very challenging and the eye often times becomes your best judge.

 

[BigTex]

Just for the heck of it. This device is the one we are given through our Kinesiology Department to use. Very inaccurate. Looks like the technology has come a long way.