TRT prescriptions and BS about the state I live in.

[JmarkH]

Am I being fed a line of BS? My telemed trt clinic in Florida uses two compounding pharmacies to ship TC to me. Their pricing is ridiculous at $260 per delivered 10ml vial of TC.

I asked them to send the prescription to my local pharmacy. They said that was not possible because TC is a controlled substance and as such they can only send the prescription to a Florida pharmacy.

I don’t get it. They can ship it to me in the mail but not send the prescription to my local pharmacy?

I called and spoke with another well-known clinic in Florida and again they told me the same thing.

How is this possible? I live in Indiana. My wife takes Adderall, a controlled substance. We were traveling in the Carolinas and needed a refill. We just went to the local Walgreens and they called our Indiana pharmacy to have it forwarded to them. We then received our medication in a state we didn’t live in.

Can someone explain this to me?

 

[Systemlord]

They can ship it to me in the mail but not send the prescription to my local pharmacy?

I called and spoke with another well-known clinic in Florida and again they told me the same thing.

You might be dealing with individual state laws, laws that might not exist in other states.

 

[CKO]

Your cost for compounded TC is really high, like double of my compounded TC cost. Most TRT providers have zero interest in calling in TC prescriptions across state lines. Some times they can't due to state laws, most of the time it's because they don't want to deal with the scrutiny from the pharmacy. The pharmacist will look at an rx for TC from Florida and question it immediately, since TC is often abused (fake rx's). They will most likely call the providers office to confirm the RX. Your provider doesn't want to deal with that for every patient x every TC prescription.

Ask your provider to switch to Empower pharmacy or Hallandale. They are half the price of your current one. Or switch to Defy Medical

 

[t_spacemonkey]

i am so tired of this pure ripoff of patients everywhere. I agree defy is reasonable.
but I also considered dumping all docs all together and going to pure UGL. cost for 10ml/T ~30usd. or if you order raws more like 2usd/1g T (+the hassle of mixing yourself and some other parts/carrier oil)
after being on T couple years you know pretty much what to do, and what labs to look for.

 

[DaveK22]

I use a reputable UGL and could not be happier. I get 10ml for $45 and avoid all the BS with scripts, insurance, etc.

 

[Wilson7]

I use a reputable UGL and could not be happier. I get 10ml for $45 and avoid all the BS with scripts, insurance, etc.

All fine until you're that one guy who ends up the target of a controlled delivery and some overzealous young prosecutor with nothing better to do than trying to rid the world of those evil testosterone users and make a name for him/herself. In most states just 2 vials of non script is a felony. Some really f'd up laws but they are what they are. Not a priority for LE but s*** happens to someone every once in a while. Keep Rick Collins phone number handy.

 

[t_spacemonkey]

All fine until you're that one guy who ends up the target of a controlled delivery and some overzealous young prosecutor with nothing better to do than trying to rid the world of those evil testosterone users and make a name for him/herself. In most states just 2 vials of non script is a felony. Some really f'd up laws but they are what they are. Not a priority for LE but s*** happens to someone every once in a while. Keep Rick Collins phone number handy.

never heard of domestic order being seized or anybody caught (different with international since you play with customs). the only story which pops up on the web is some police guy on the east coast. i'm sure there was more to this then in the news article
obviously you don't sign for any delivery and accept package from 'workers', but again was not able to find anything on web using a wide array of search terms/engines.

 

[Deleted member 43589]

Am I being fed a line of BS? My telemed trt clinic in Florida uses two compounding pharmacies to ship TC to me. Their pricing is ridiculous at $260 per delivered 10ml vial of TC.

I asked them to send the prescription to my local pharmacy. They said that was not possible because TC is a controlled substance and as such they can only send the prescription to a Florida pharmacy.

I don’t get it. They can ship it to me in the mail but not send the prescription to my local pharmacy?

I called and spoke with another well-known clinic in Florida and again they told me the same thing.

How is this possible? I live in Indiana. My wife takes Adderall, a controlled substance. We were traveling in the Carolinas and needed a refill. We just went to the local Walgreens and they called our Indiana pharmacy to have it forwarded to them. We then received our medication in a state we didn’t live in.

Can someone explain this to me?

About the time they told me the price was $260, I would have hung up the phone. That is a RIP-off price. I remember my wife and I needed a prescription refilled while we were traveling in Florida, we took it to the pharmacy and they refilled it with no problem. This was long before the great Covid experience.

Anyway, this web page should shed a little light on this one:


DEA web site

COVID-19 FAQ

Telemedicine​

Question: I am registered with DEA in one state, but will be prescribing controlled substances to patients in another state via telemedicine in a manner permitted by the Ryan Haight Act. Will I need to hold a separate DEA registration in the state where my patients are located?

Answer: Yes (with certain limited exceptions, including an exception broadly applicable during the COVID-19 public health emergency). The Controlled Substances Act (CSA) generally requires practitioners prescribing controlled substances to patients in another state via telemedicine to be registered in those patients' state. The CSA does so in two distinct but partially overlapping ways.
First, unless subject to an exception, the CSA requires all practitioners to be registered in the state in which the patients to which they are prescribing controlled substances are located, regardless of whether the prescribing is taking place via telemedicine. The CSA provides that every person who dispenses, or who proposes to dispense, any controlled substance shall obtain from DEA a registration issued in accordance with DEA rules and regulations. See 21 U.S.C. 822(a)(2). Under the CSA, such dispensing includes prescribing and administering controlled substances. Id. 802(10). DEA may only register a person to dispense a controlled substance if that person is permitted to do so by the jurisdiction in which his or her patients are located. See id. 802(21), 823(f). Thus, unless an applicable exception applies, DEA regulations require a practitioner to obtain a separate DEA registration in each state in which a patient to whom he or she prescribes a controlled substance is located when the prescription is made, regardless of whether the prescription is made via telemedicine.
Second, in addition to this generally applicable registration requirement, the CSA also contains provisions (added by the Ryan Haight Act) expressly requiring a practitioner to be registered in the state in which the patient to whom he is prescribing is located when he or she is engaged in certain forms of telemedicine. Under the CSA, a prescription for a controlled substance issued by means of the Internet must generally be predicated on an in-person medical evaluation. See id. 829(e)(1). This requirement does not apply, however, when a practitioner is practicing telemedicine as defined by the CSA. The CSA's definition of the practice of telemedicine includes multiple different categories of telemedicine. And, for certain of these categories, the CSA specifically requires a practitioner of telemedicine to have a DEA registration in the state in which the patient is located. See, e.g., id. 802(54)(A)(ii)(III), (E), 831(h)(1)(B).
There are, however, certain limited exceptions to both the general and telemedicine-specific registration requirements. Most notably, DEA is permitted to waive practitioners' general registration requirements by regulation when consistent with the public health and safety, id. 822(d), and has done so for certain categories of practitioners. See 21 CFR 1301.23. The CSA also waives the telemedicine-specific requirement of registration in the patients' state for telemedicine practitioners in these categories. See 21 U.S.C. 802(54)(A)(ii)(III)(a), 831(h)(1)(B)(i). Thus, practitioners in these registration-waived categories can prescribe controlled substances to patients in another state via telemedicine without being registered in that state.
Exceptions may also apply in certain other situations. In particular, during the COVID-19 public health emergency, DEA has granted a temporary exception to its regulations—Exception to Separate Registration Requirements Across State Lines (DEA067), issued March 25, 2020—to allow practitioners to prescribe controlled substances in states in which they are not registered if the practitioner is registered with DEA in at least one state and has permission under state law to practice using controlled substances in the state where the dispensing occurs. In other words, under this exception, a DEA-registered practitioner is not required to obtain additional registration(s) with DEA in the additional state(s) where the practitioner's dispensing (including prescribing and administering) occurs if the practitioner is authorized to dispense controlled substances by both the state in which the practitioner is registered with DEA and the state in which the dispensing occurs. Practitioners may utilize this temporary exception via in-person prescribing or prescribing via telemedicine. Id. 802(54)(D). A practitioner using this exception must continue to comply with the laws and regulations of the state in which they are DEA-registered, and the laws and regulations of the state in which they are practicing, if different. DEA has granted this exception through the duration of the COVID-19 public health emergency as declared by the Secretary of Health and Human Services.
The CSA also authorizes the practice of telemedicine by a practitioner registered in any state during certain limited medical emergency situations requiring immediate intervention to avoid imminent and serious clinical consequences, such as further injury or death. Id. 802(54)(F).
Thus, practitioners generally must be registered with DEA in a patient's state to prescribe controlled substances to that patient via telemedicine, but a number of exceptions to that requirement exist. EO-DEA192, DEA-DC-044, July 28, 2020

 

[Wilson7]

never heard of domestic order being seized or anybody caught (different with international since you play with customs). the only story which pops up on the web is some police guy on the east coast. i'm sure there was more to this then in the news article
obviously you don't sign for any delivery and accept package from 'workers', but again was not able to find anything on web using a wide array of search terms/engines.

You should talk to Rick Collins about that or read Legal Muscle his book from 2002, if you can find a copy, it is very detailed and specific about the laws regarding non-script possession and how LE goes about their business if your package is ID'd. What you have to ask yourself is, if I'm that guy and yes it's relatively rare these days, but if they do come in your house with a warrant for personal use T, am I OK with that? Because I can assure you, it is a very unpleasant and costly experience and if there is anything in the house beyond those two vials of T you denied ordering, you'll end up in the judicial meat grinder.

 

[JmarkH]

About the time they told me the price was $260, I would have hung up the phone. That is a RIP-off price. I remember my wife and I needed a prescription refilled while we were traveling in Florida, we took it to the pharmacy and they refilled it with no problem. This was long before the great Covid experience.

Anyway, this web page should shed a little light on this one:


DEA web site

COVID-19 FAQ

I may be missing something, but I still didn't see where the pharmacy in the same state as the clinic could mail it out of the state to another state. They are doing this. So my question is, why can't I have them send the prescription to a CVS in Florida and have the pharmacy mail it to me in Indiana or transfer to my state? Not sure CVS would want to mess with it though.

 

[tareload]

You should talk to Rick Collins about that or read Legal Muscle his book from 2002, if you can find a copy, it is very detailed and specific about the laws regarding non-script possession and how LE goes about their business if your package is ID'd. What you have to ask yourself is, if I'm that guy and yes it's relatively rare these days, but if they do come in your house with a warrant for personal use T, am I OK with that? Because I can assure you, it is a very unpleasant and costly experience and if there is anything in the house beyond those two vials of T you denied ordering, you'll end up in the judicial meat grinder.

Or go to MesoRx and read to your heart's content. A nonpublicized suspended sentence/fine/plea for the little guy doesn't make the evening news.

 

[t_spacemonkey]

You should talk to Rick Collins about that or read Legal Muscle his book from 2002, if you can find a copy, it is very detailed and specific about the laws regarding non-script possession and how LE goes about their business if your package is ID'd. What you have to ask yourself is, if I'm that guy and yes it's relatively rare these days, but if they do come in your house with a warrant for personal use T, am I OK with that? Because I can assure you, it is a very unpleasant and costly experience and if there is anything in the house beyond those two vials of T you denied ordering, you'll end up in the judicial meat grinder.

i browsed through the legal section of mesorx forum. you are right there is some risk ofc.
after reading through hundreds of posts, there is not a single mention of domestic ordering issue. a lot of customs seized packages, one guy even had a warrant for something else, they found AAS and did not even touch it as they looked for weed.
but there is definitely some risk, can't deny that. i think the biggest risk is a domestic package getting damaged and leaking, and postal service opening it and doing some controlled delivery or getting a warrant

 

[Wilson7]

This really underscores two major issues. One the less docs want to prescribe, the more the on line clinics can rip off those willing to pay, and it is also forcing an otherwise law abiding group into illegal activity esp non-binary, trans and the older guys trying to stay glued together, nothing more. Moreover, the laws were either written by people that had no clue and simply lumped T and AAS into the same line of legislation as narcotics or they knew (less likely) that most self admin HRT or cosmetic androgen users are otherwise law abiding folks (real jobs, family, church going, conservative leaning), they'd be more likely to adhere to the law if it threatening to destroy their entire life that a simple possession charge could do. If you're a meth head, you could care less about anything so it really doesn't matter what the laws are. Big difference. This post wasn't about the on line legal issues nor is this forum a place to discuss non-script options/experiences so a good place to end it. In addition, I would not be opening admitting to ordering controlled substances illegally on an open public forum. Hard to deny the package isn't yours when you've already admitted to it in a public forum. You never know who is watching.

 

[JmarkH]

The direction of the thread is worthwhile. Yes, it has deviated from the original question, but not in a detrimental way. I'm still exploring my options and will have a conversation with CVS and Walgreens about the cross-state issues.

 

[t_spacemonkey]

This really underscores two major issues. One the less docs want to prescribe, the more the on line clinics can rip off those willing to pay, and it is also forcing an otherwise law abiding group into illegal activity esp non-binary, trans and the older guys trying to stay glued together, nothing more. Moreover, the laws were either written by people that had no clue and simply lumped T and AAS into the same line of legislation as narcotics or they knew (less likely) that most self admin HRT or cosmetic androgen users are otherwise law abiding folks (real jobs, family, church going, conservative leaning), they'd be more likely to adhere to the law if it threatening to destroy their entire life that a simple possession charge could do. If you're a meth head, you could care less about anything so it really doesn't matter what the laws are. Big difference. This post wasn't about the on line legal issues nor is this forum a place to discuss non-script options/experiences so a good place to end it. In addition, I would not be opening admitting to ordering controlled substances illegally on an open public forum. Hard to deny the package isn't yours when you've already admitted to it in a public forum. You never know who is watching.

I honestly think that posting on forums like this has absolutely no risk. they would need to get a warrant to get your IP and your data from the ISP. and thats providing you use your home internet and are the sole user of this. and you are in their jurisdiction. and providing you do not use a vpn or some other means of hiding your real info. then get another warrant to search your house for some small amount of AAS? there is thousands of forums like this. i think this is pretty paranoid. meanwhile lots of usa based ugl labs are selling, some for years already. you would think that they would go after them first. again there is risk, prob 1/million and only if you do stupid stuff like accept controlled deliveries, drive with that stuff around while smoking weed at the same etc. recently a guy in san diego (odin pharma) got busted for selling millions, and the guy even admitted years prior to buying raw powders to postal workers/customs. no encouraging anybody to buy UGL still, however it is a fairly viable option IMO, especially on a budget. the whole ripoff is a different story. unfortunately due to shitty laws around AAS many docs smell business and charge whatever they can get away with. but so do others like dentist etc. gov involvement makes everything more expensive simple as that.

 

[Nelson Vergel]

You may want to read these posts:

U.S. State Specific Laws on Testosterone and hCG

https://www.excelmale.com/forum/threads/how-testosterone-dispensing-regulations-can-affect-your-refills.7548/

www.excelmale.com

 

[Nelson Vergel]

Why Does Defy Medical Only Work with Two Pharmacies?

I’m a longtime lurker here on excelmale, I have learned so much on here, big fan of Nelson as well for all he has done for the “hrt community.” So I just became a patient at Defy Medical after switching from my local urologist who refused to allow me to dose above 100 mg weekly, even with free t...

www.excelmale.com

Buying test locally with a prescription

Will Defy send me a Perscription for tests instead of purchasing it directly from them???

www.excelmale.com

 

[FlowRW]

I'm in North Carolina. My Dr calls my TC 10ml vial into Walgreens for me. They will only dispense 1 vial at a time but it does last a bit longer than a month. No problem getting it. Costs me $28 each time, reasonable for sure.

 

[mrgarofalo]

Am I being fed a line of BS? My telemed trt clinic in Florida uses two compounding pharmacies to ship TC to me. Their pricing is ridiculous at $260 per delivered 10ml vial of TC.

I asked them to send the prescription to my local pharmacy. They said that was not possible because TC is a controlled substance and as such they can only send the prescription to a Florida pharmacy.

I don’t get it. They can ship it to me in the mail but not send the prescription to my local pharmacy?

I called and spoke with another well-known clinic in Florida and again they told me the same thing.

How is this possible? I live in Indiana. My wife takes Adderall, a controlled substance. We were traveling in the Carolinas and needed a refill. We just went to the local Walgreens and they called our Indiana pharmacy to have it forwarded to them. We then received our medication in a state we didn’t live in.

Can someone explain this to me?

If you have low T, have a urologist in your state check you out and they can prescribe TC. Any pharmacy of your codin choosing will fill the script if they write you one.

 

[Bbobtucker]

I'm not suggesting anyone get ripped off for easily obtainable/affordable meds but there's a convenience factor also. I can buy testosterone locally for less than defy (cash, insurance won't cover) but I have to convince my local primary care doc to prescribe it for me. Then there's the whole song and dance with defy about what am I taking since they didn't prescribe it. And additional follow ups with the primary care doc who now has a say in my trt care.

It costs me a little more but I let defy to their thing and it's easy and convenient and other than an annual physical w/ my primary care, I only deal with defy. And, I should preface, my primary care is a long time family friend, knows about defy, and is super easy to deal with - but it is still easier to deal just with defy.