Starting on TRT Compound Cream and Joining the Forum

[MikeMentzersGlasses]

Good morning from New Zealand.

I have been researching around on testosterone replacement and this forum tended to come up more often than any other results, so I wanted to join and be a part of what is happening here.

I'm a 31 year old male who has been diagnoses with hypogonadism. I won't post all my blood but my testosterone result was 4.1nmol/L (Ref range 9-25).

In New Zealand we are very limited in TRT options, even with proper diagnoses and tests etc, not sure why, I just figure we are behind in the times.

I have been prescribed 20% testosterone compounded cream, 1ml applied daily.

A few questions if anyone can chime in...

1) 20%, how do I figure out what this dosage is? I see people saying they are on 50mg-200mg daily, how do I know this? Can i figure it out with this info?
2) I understand scrotal application is the best place for absorption? Providing no alcohol in the product.
3) Creams work different for everyone, I have heard amazing reviews, and some terrible reviews. I am approaching realistically as if cream doesn't work it is a case of going illegal for injections. Anyone from New Zealand having this same experience with the healthcare system over here?
4) Anything else you think I need to know.

If you've read this, thank you.

 

[Cooper]

Cream works very well for many people. Creams typically have the best absorption when applied to the scrotum.

 

[Wolverine]

Ive tried cream, pellets, injections and now compounded gel. When you apply to scrotum your numbers will go up, but watch DHT levels. Mine were very high. Now trying on biceps and inner forearm.

 

[tareload]

Anyone have shaved / waxed anus results? Viable alternative to shaved scrotum? Lab results?

I would guess the absence of hair would just aid ease of application on either site. Probably does little on the absorption kinetics?

 

[Jerajera]

Ive tried cream, pellets, injections and now compounded gel. When you apply to scrotum your numbers will go up, but watch DHT levels. Mine were very high. Now trying on biceps and inner forearm.

How long have you been doing it? Which dose? How are you feeling so far?

 

[MDavidW76]

Anyone have shaved / waxed anus results? Viable alternative to shaved scrotum? Lab results?

I would guess the absence of hair would just aid ease of application on either site. Probably does little on the absorption kinetics?

I’m in a ******** group where someone mentioned their Urologist would “Boof” one pump of their cream, then externally apply one pump of their cream, said it worked crazy well for them, I can imagine it would if they were putting it in their butt like that. When I was using Atrevis Hydrogel based cream I was applying it to my shaved ball-sack, it worked very well.

 

[tareload]

I’m in a ******** group where someone mentioned their Urologist would “Boof” one pump of their cream, then externally apply one pump of their cream, said it worked crazy well for them, I can imagine it would if they were putting it in their butt like that. When I was using Atrevis Hydrogel based cream I was applying it to my shaved ball-sack, it worked very well.

If I was a PI in this field that would be a great study...absorption kinetics, E2 and DHT levels with anus vs scrotal application. "Breaking the plane" with rectal injection going above and beyond call of duty. Thanks for the anecdote.

Anus and scrot have got to be the two best external application sites for rapid absorption. I would not be surprised if anus is faster and led to less HPTA suppression. Labia similar.

 

[Wolverine]

How long have you been doing it? Which dose? How are you feeling so far?

Ive been doing it for a couple of weeks now. 4 clicks (50mg each/200mg total). Feeling less wired. I assume it's because of less DHT. I'll get some labs done in the next few weeks.

 

[Jerajera]

Ive been doing it for a couple of weeks now. 4 clicks (50mg each/200mg total). Feeling less wired. I assume it's because of less DHT. I'll get some labs done in the next few weeks.

That'll be very interesting, the protocol you're on will probably be my next try if my Prop experiment falls through.

I think we have a similar response to the cream in terms of DHT levels. On 50mg AM and PM (100mg/day) scrotal application, my DHT was ~350. On 2 clicks AM + PM (200mg/day), it was at 500.

I can't really justify running those levels for decades.

 

[MikeMentzersGlasses]

I didn't really get any answers and my intro post turned into people discussing sticking cream in thier ass. What an interesting forum.

 

[tareload]

Good morning from New Zealand.

I have been researching around on testosterone replacement and this forum tended to come up more often than any other results, so I wanted to join and be a part of what is happening here.

I'm a 31 year old male who has been diagnoses with hypogonadism. I won't post all my blood but my testosterone result was 4.1nmol/L (Ref range 9-25).

In New Zealand we are very limited in TRT options, even with proper diagnoses and tests etc, not sure why, I just figure we are behind in the times.

I have been prescribed 20% testosterone compounded cream, 1ml applied daily.

A few questions if anyone can chime in...

1) 20%, how do I figure out what this dosage is? I see people saying they are on 50mg-200mg daily, how do I know this? Can i figure it out with this info?
2) I understand scrotal application is the best place for absorption? Providing no alcohol in the product.
3) Creams work different for everyone, I have heard amazing reviews, and some terrible reviews. I am approaching realistically as if cream doesn't work it is a case of going illegal for injections. Anyone from New Zealand having this same experience with the healthcare system over here?
4) Anything else you think I need to know.

If you've read this, thank you.

Answer to Q1:

Dr. Nichols/Rouzier Recommending 400mg per day?

I was going to let someone else spill the beans but why not let Nichol’s biggest fan (or used to be) answer the question. EDIT: [link was removed by Admin] Jay Campbell wrote “Testosterone Cream For Your “Sack”: A Superior Testosterone Optimization Therapy Alternative To Injections?!” 150-200...

forums.t-nation.com

Q2: see this thread with examples on the pharmacokinetics.

Edit: sorry link did not go through first time.

Newbie confused by prescription, help please

My new testosterone cream prescription reads - 200mg/ml. Apply 1ml twice a day. Does this mean I would be taking 400mg per day, total?? Maybe I'm wrong, but that seems like a massive amount for someone just starting out. Am I wrong?

www.excelmale.com

That was the point we were discussing...absorption on various locations.

 

[MikeMentzersGlasses]

Answer to Q1:

Dr. Nichols/Rouzier Recommending 400mg per day?

I was going to let someone else spill the beans but why not let Nichol’s biggest fan (or used to be) answer the question. EDIT: [link was removed by Admin] Jay Campbell wrote “Testosterone Cream For Your “Sack”: A Superior Testosterone Optimization Therapy Alternative To Injections?!” 150-200...

forums.t-nation.com

Q2: see this thread with examples on the pharmacokinetics. That was the point we were discussing...absorption on various locations.

That's great. Thank you very much

 

[tareload]

That's great. Thank you very much

See the link to second thread I just posted. Much more extensive answers to the original poster with example profiles of testosterone vs time for various dosing protocols. Very detailed.

 

[tareload]

Also see this post and thread for more info on Q2:

Testosterone no ester in DMSO experiment

Hi guys. I am experimenting right know with an unconventional method for TRT. I made a solution of testosterone base in dmso and ethanol. I am applying it on wrist. My goal is to reproduce the effects of Natesto. The solution is 40mg/ml of testosterone in 80%dmso and 20% ethanol. I started...

www.excelmale.com

Sorry, I have no anus absorption data to compare ro scrotal.

Does this help? Questions?

For those curious, labial absorption is rapid and faster than scrotal. Probably better to discuss in separate thread. But I guess anal would be similar to labial. So many experiments.

 

[Willyt]

That'll be very interesting, the protocol you're on will probably be my next try if my Prop experiment falls through.

I think we have a similar response to the cream in terms of DHT levels. On 50mg AM and PM (100mg/day) scrotal application, my DHT was ~350. On 2 clicks AM + PM (200mg/day), it was at 500.

I can't really justify running those levels for decades.

Are you using Defy/Empower's cream? Mine is 25mg per click, not 100mg

 

[Jerajera]

Are you using Defy/Empower's cream? Mine is 25mg per click, not 100mg

Yes, Empower's compounded cream, what they call "HRT" base, I think same as Versabase not Atrevis hydrogel. Mine is 200mg/mL, so 1 click is 50mg

 

[Willyt]

Yes, Empower's compounded cream, what they call "HRT" base, I think same as Versabase not Atrevis hydrogel. Mine is 200mg/mL, so 1 click is 50mg

Do you feel any side effects from the above range DHT?

 

[Jerajera]

Do you feel any side effects from the above range DHT?

I'm not on it right now, but at the time it made me hyper confident but also very aggressive and confrontational. I would always speak my mind regardless of the situation and instantly call people out on what I perceived to be bullshit or the slightest attempt to pressure me.

Libido and EQ were great, I'd say about the same as daily Prop, but I became much more aggressive sexually, which to me (and my gf) is a good thing.

Those things are natural tendencies for me so I don't know that it would take someone from the opposite end of the spectrum to this point. It just made me more of who I already was, but a lot more than other formulations of Test already did.

Sleep was terrible on AM/PM applications, I felt overstimulated, and barely ok when I applied everything in the morning. But my sleep has never been good since I was 10 years old or so.

I've never felt mentally as sharp on TRT as I did naturally, and unfortunately the cream was no better (but no worse either) in that respect.

In the gym I felt a better mind-body connection subjectively but objectively wasn't as strong as I was with similar trough Test levels on Cypionate. I felt more desire to push myself though, and perhaps started losing water weight relatively quickly.

Keep in mind though that I bailed after 3 weeks or so when I saw that my DHT had left the atmosphere and was flying with the stars, so a lot of those symptoms might've subsided over time. The potential risks associated with running space-high DHT levels for decades on end just didn't seem worth it to me.

 

[MikeMentzersGlasses]

Also see this post and thread for more info on Q2:

Testosterone no ester in DMSO experiment

Hi guys. I am experimenting right know with an unconventional method for TRT. I made a solution of testosterone base in dmso and ethanol. I am applying it on wrist. My goal is to reproduce the effects of Natesto. The solution is 40mg/ml of testosterone in 80%dmso and 20% ethanol. I started...

www.excelmale.com

Sorry, I have no anus absorption data to compare ro scrotal.

Does this help? Questions?

For those curious, labial absorption is rapid and faster than scrotal. Probably better to discuss in separate thread. But I guess anal would be similar to labial. So many experiments.

Thank you for all the information. Really appreciated.

 

[Cooper]

I'm not on it right now, but at the time it made me hyper confident but also very aggressive and confrontational. I would always speak my mind regardless of the situation and instantly call people out on what I perceived to be bullshit or the slightest attempt to pressure me.

Libido and EQ were great, I'd say about the same as daily Prop, but I became much more aggressive sexually, which to me (and my gf) is a good thing.

Those things are natural tendencies for me so I don't know that it would take someone from the opposite end of the spectrum to this point. It just made me more of who I already was, but a lot more than other formulations of Test already did.

Sleep was terrible on AM/PM applications, I felt overstimulated, and barely ok when I applied everything in the morning. But my sleep has never been good since I was 10 years old or so.

I've never felt mentally as sharp on TRT as I did naturally, and unfortunately the cream was no better (but no worse either) in that respect.

In the gym I felt a better mind-body connection subjectively but objectively wasn't as strong as I was with similar trough Test levels on Cypionate. I felt more desire to push myself though, and perhaps started losing water weight relatively quickly.

Keep in mind though that I bailed after 3 weeks or so when I saw that my DHT had left the atmosphere and was flying with the stars, so a lot of those symptoms might've subsided over time. The potential risks associated with running space-high DHT levels for decades on end just didn't seem worth it to me.

What are the potential side effects of running high DHT for extended time? I have never seen anything identified though I agree it would not seem like good idea.