Nandrolone (Deca) Base TRT Trial

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Gman86

Member
@Gman86

It sounds like you had really good results from the nandrolone based protocol.

Why did you stop?
Ya overall it was one of the best protocols I’ve tried so far. I stopped because I was worried about nandrolone suppressing my fertility more so than test. I currently think that theres a chance that nandrolone could suppress fertility more than test, due to it being a progestin, but I’m not completely convinced. I’ve had both of my children while using test alongside 100mg of nandrolone per week, so I’m not sure how suppressing to fertility it is, compared to test. Plus I might be done having kids, so overall I’m just not that concerned about the possibility of nandrolone suppressing fertility more so than test. Even if me and my girl were to want another kid, I wouldnt stop using the nandrolone base for fertility reasons. I would simply see how it goes while on it

Didnt really have a reason to get off the nandrolone base other than my fertility concerns at the time
 

DAbears

New Member
Just checking back in. Morning wood everyday, zero acne, no ED but that was never an issue and most noticeably and important to my situation is I can feel my dick again. Sensitivity is totally restored just by knocking the test down. I have decided to stop the HCG all together as I was only on it to try and restore sensitivity but lowering test accomplished that for me. Muscle gains on 210 Deca are more enhanced for sure than when I ran test at 200. I will continue this until bloods indicate anything negative going on.

If anyone has had similar issues I really recommend this approach or at least try it.
 

Gman86

Member
Just checking back in. Morning wood everyday, zero acne, no ED but that was never an issue and most noticeably and important to my situation is I can feel my dick again. Sensitivity is totally restored just by knocking the test down. I have decided to stop the HCG all together as I was only on it to try and restore sensitivity but lowering test accomplished that for me. Muscle gains on 210 Deca are more enhanced for sure than when I ran test at 200. I will continue this until bloods indicate anything negative going on.

If anyone has had similar issues I really recommend this approach or at least try it.
Thanks so much for the update. It’s so interesting how differently nandrolone reacts when it’s added to a test base, compared to when it’s used as the base, or used by itself. It might as well be a completely different compound with how differently it reacts in some people in each of these scenarios. I can’t think of one other compound where the anecdotes of guys using it vary so drastically. Guys added it to a test base sometimes report erection and sensitivity issues, yet ur reporting that it actually corrected ur sensitivity issue. And I usually hear guys report improved erections, when on a nandrolone based protocol, compared to a test based protocol. Very different than the “deca d*ck” we’ve all heard from guys on the internet. I’ve said it before, but the best erections of my life were while I was using a nandrolone base. Quite the opposite from “deca d*ck”. Yet it’s the same compound. I just find it really interesting how differently this one compound reacts based on the way u use it


But thanks again for this update. Love hearing that things are going so well for ya, especially since I switched back to a nandrolone based protocol 2 weeks ago, and I also believe that reports like this, and threads like this in general, are going to be very helpful, in regards to opening people’s minds and eyes to another option, if getting dialed in on a testosterone based protocol just seems never ending and exhausting.

I had quite a bit of bloodwork when I was using 200mg of nandrolone as my base, and everything always came back looking great. So I don’t foresee u having any issues, blood marker wise. The only thing I never checked is my LDL particle size. I know @Vince has reported that nandrolone threw his ldl particle sizes all out of whack. So that’s one thing I’m gonna try and check next time I have labs done. Sucks that I’ve never checked it before tho, so I don’t really have a reference point to compare it to. But something to maybe look into, just to make sure that what happened to Vince isn’t something that consistently happens when nandrolone is in the mix
 

Gman86

Member
The guy getting interviewed is obv blasting steroids, and not on HRT, but his anecdotal experience using nandrolone by itself, compared to using it with a test base, is still very useful for anyone considering using nandrolone as the base to their protocol. His experience using nandrolone solo is very similar to how most guys feel using a nandrolone based protocol. It’s just a different overall feeling, compared to using a test base, and he describes it very well, imo

Go to 34 mins into the video to hear his experience using nandrolone solo compared to using it with test

 

DAbears

New Member
So I just woke up with a big acne flare up. Big cyst on back and chest and inside my nose? Is this from switching from ED to MWF? I made the change a little over a week ago. Fluctuations and I should wait it out or go back to daily? Thought I had this figured out can’t go back to this acne crap. Morning wood and sensitivity still great.
 

Gman86

Member
Oh wow, this is definitely unusual for a nandrolone based protocol. Hormone fluctuations could be the cause. Can’t really think of any other reason, other than things in ur diet causing the acne.

I rarely ever get acne on HRT. The only times I tend to get it are when I’m in the middle of a protocol change and hormones are fluctuating. When I’m on the same protocol for a while I very very rarely get acne

why did u change from ED to mwf again? Just purely out of convenience?

If I had to guess, I would guess that even if u stayed on the mwf frequency, ur acne would go way once ur body gets used to this new schedule. My money is on it’s just a temporary issue. Cystic acne is no fun tho obv. Sorry to hear about this
 

DAbears

New Member
I changed to MWF because doing 30mg of test daily would be impossible to draw up in syringe so switch to MWF 70mg Deca 10mg test. Prior was 30 Deca daily and 10mg test daily. So maybe the drop in test from 70 to 30mg a week is causing the outbreak and dose schedule change. I was clear as could be the first week of the change and then boom the acne hit.
 

Gman86

Member
Oh u dropped ur test from 70mg/ week to 30mg/ week as well? What was the rationale behind dropping ur test dose? sorry if it’s already been covered. Too lazy to look back lol

sounds like the acne is definitely from hormone fluctuations tho. And should be temporary. I would imagine that a drop in ur test dose should decrease acne, not increase it

with teenagers, I’m pretty sure the acne is mostly due to the hormone fluctuations, not so much having high levels of test and DHT. I’m sure having high levels has something to do with it, but I think it’s mostly the hormones all being in flux that does it. Just because there’s plenty of guys in their twenties that continue to have high levels of test and DHT, but tend to not suffer the acne that teenagers going through puberty get. And girls in their period tend to get more acne than other times of the month. I would imagine this is due to their hormones being so in flux. And I’ve had very high levels of test in my system, as well as DHT, and haven’t really gotten any acne. But I do tend to get some when I’m changing protocols and hormones are in flux. So I tend to think that ur acne issue is simply due to ur hormones being in flux, and once ur levels level out, I think u should most likely be fine. Very curious to see how things end up going for u tho
 
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DAbears

New Member
Dropped from 70 to 30 test in hopes to reduce acne and increase penile sensitivity. It worked for 2 weeks almost immediately now it’s back. But I do typically react 2 weeks after any protocol change.
 

Gman86

Member
Dropped from 70 to 30 test in hopes to reduce acne and increase penile sensitivity. It worked for 2 weeks almost immediately now it’s back. But I do typically react 2 weeks after any protocol change.
ya im pretty confident that the acne is only gonna be temporary. It’s pretty uncommon for guys to report acne being an issue for them when using nandrolone solo and/ or a nandrolone base with very little test. Obviously not impossible, just not super common with there being no DHT in the system on nandrolone solo, and only having DHN floating around, and DHN being around 10x weaker than DHT. And then there being pretty low amounts of DHT in the system when using a nandrolone base with a small dose of test. Plus DHN competes with DHT for receptors, so even less of that small amount of DHT in the system is able to carry out its functions. Long story short, a nandrolone based protocol has the reputation of curbing DHT, E2 and/ or prolactin sides, so I really feel like this acne isnt going to be an ongoing thing for u. Just a temporary hiccup while ur hormones are in flux
 

Gman86

Member
Im sorry but this is the first time I ever heard of Nandrolone used in TRT. And this post is confusing me.
First you say Nandrolone increases aromatization. Then later you say its good to use this for those who aromatize easily naturally. Maybe I should read up on this a lot more before asking stupid questions :). But please if you could explain why some people wish to use Nandrolone? whats the benefits? compared to T? If one is naturally aromatizing T and create side effects easily?
Thank you :)
Ill read on. interesting stuff. :)
Haha theres no stupid questions imo. So nandrolone, WHEN USED WITH TESTOSTERONE, can increase the aromatization rate that the test converts into estrogen. Unlike other steroids, nandrolone is actually produced in our bodies, like test is. In very minuscule amounts, but it’s still a steroid that we produce naturally. Here’s an excerpt from google.

“Nandrolone is an endogenous intermediate in the production of estradiol from testosterone via aromatase in mammals including humans and is present in the body naturally in trace amounts”

So it makes sense that it would increase the aromatization rate that test converts into E2, based on its role in the human body.

When used alone, however, nandrolone converts into E2 at an extremely low rate. It takes roughly 300mg of nandrolone to see ur estradiol level reach around 5-6 pg/ml on a serum blood test. This is why it’s a great alternative for guys that have trouble dialing in E2 on a testosterone base. With nandrolone, u get all the androgens, without the high conversion rates into metabolites like E2 and DHT. So it’s also a great alternative for any guy that struggles with dht sides while using a test base. Hopefully that clears things up a little bit. If not, ask any other questions u have. I know it can be a bit confusing when it’s something u’ve never really heard about before
 

Gman86

Member
The benefits are basically u can use 100mg of nandrolone, get 100mg of androgens, get all the benefits that come with androgens, without having those androgens come with high levels of E2, dht and prolactin. For some guys, using test gives them the benefits of the androgens, but then they have issues from all the E2, dht and/ or prolactin in their system. And in order to lower those metabolites, they try to lower their test dose, but sometimes then lose some of the androgen benefits. So then they’re kind of caught in a rock and a hard place. Keep androgens where they like them, but suffer sides from the metaboites. Or lower their test dose to decrease metabolite sides, but lose some of the androgen benefits

with a nandrolone base, u get the best of both worlds. U use nandrolone as ur base for ur androgens, and then use a tiny bit of test to boost up E2 and dht, since u won’t have much of either with the nandrolone base. But u start low with ur test dose, to get some E2 and dht in ur system, and then u ur test dose up, as needed, until u find the sweetspot where u feel ur best, as far as E2 and dht levels goes. instead of E2 and dht sitting wherever they might on a test base, and only being able to lower them by lowering ur test dose, and losing some of the androgen benefits, u use nandrolone as ur main androgen base, and don’t adjust that dose. U just adjust ur test dose, as needed, to control metabolite levels. So even when ur adjusting ur metabolite levels with the test, ur main androgens from the nandrolone dont change, so ur always getting all the androgen benefits, even whilst dialing in ur metabolite levels, mainly E2

a nandrolone base basically just gives u MUCH more control over where ur metabolite levels sit, mainly E2, dht and prolactin, while on a test base guys will tell u to just let E2, dht and prolactin fall where they may based on ur test dose. If ur experiencing sides, ur just supposed to lower ur test dose basically. That doesnt off much control over things, unfortunately.
 

Gman86

Member
Wauw nice. You made it super clear to me. thank you very much. Im 52 new to TRT and exploring what is out there. I found the video you posted with the MD using Nandrolone and Winstrol?, and I was blown away with the results on inflammation, diabetes, crohns and much more. On top of benefits you just mentioned I dont understand why this isnt a well known protocol. I mean the diabetes results alone is insane.
Its my understanding T becomes much more potent and free with nandrolone. hence the need for much less weekly. This is very tempting and I need to look into this some more. Thank you bro ;)
So Dr Lichten is a huge fan of nandrolone, but doesn’t have any guys on a nandrolone based protocol, as far as I know. He likes to use it in the more traditional way that most of us have seen it be used. A 2:1 ratio of test to testosterone. Here’s the protocol and dosages that he most commonly prescribes, based off of what he says in interviews


120-160mg test cyp

40mg-60mg of deca

25mg of Winstrol (Stanozol) once per week

-likes to see his patients’ peak level at 1000-1200

-likes roughly around 2:1 deca:test ratio
 

Gman86

Member
Dr Lichten also has a bunch of podcast episodes, if u want to check them out. I’ll post pics of the podcasts he has on the apple podcast app. A bunch of great info and anecdotes
 

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Gman86

Member
I am in there. There is "just" 7 episodes correct? (first time im using apple podcast)
So there’s 3 different podcasts that he has. Each one has a certain amount of episodes. Search each podcast from the pics, and episodes will pop up from that specific podcast. Go into one of the episodes and then hit the 3 little dots at the top right, and click on “go to show”. That will bring u to the main menu of the podcast, and list all the episodes in that podcast. One has 7 episodes, one has 16, and the other has 15. Some overlap a little. Like two of the podcasts have some doubles of episodes. But once u get into the main menu of a podcast, hit the 3 dots in the circle at the top right again, and click ”follow show” and then that podcast with all its episodes will save to ur library in the podcast app for easy access. If u have any issues just ask me here and I’ll guide u a bit more. I know it can be a little confusing
 
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Gman86

Member
You just made my day as I was unable to find more of his protocols on YT.
To me those above dosages seems a bit intimidating ha ha.
I would do 60mg test with 20 mg Deca just to dip my toe in :)
If you have the time I would appreciate if you could explain the reasoning for the Stanozol? I did listen the the video you posted with him but I didnt fully understand what he said. Ill dig into the podcasts you shared. This will be a good listen while getting my 10.000 steps in today :)

How do you feel on this combination? vs. just Test alone? whats the difference?
Im very curious. thank you.
So the stanozolol is simply to lower SHBG, and increase free test without having to increase the total test dose. But I personally disagree with using a DHT to lower SHBG to the levels he likes to lower them to. He keeps his SHBG around 11. I personally think it’s more ideal to keep SHBG as close to mid range as u can. Around 20-40 is probably ideal for most men.

But for guys with a very high SHBG, I don’t see it being a horrible thing to use a very very low dose of a dht derivative to lower it a bit. I just don’t agree with him lowering SHBG as drastically as he likes to. But that’s all he uses it for. Simply to lower SHBG

here’s another vid he did with Danny bossa if u haven’t seen it yet

 

Gman86

Member
First of all thank you for all your support. Amazing.

I found this video already and watched it thank you. Yes the interviewer was also kind of asking about his SHBG approach a bit confused as its opposite what he himself has learned. I see not everyone agrees. In fact I see many areas even the experts disagree.
I see experts saying dont worry about estrogen. forget about hematocrit, just drink lots of water etc.
Some say go for how you feel more than numbers in a blood test. Experts. People who do this for a living. I remember 10-15 years ago I was in similar forums and it all became too mechanical and people forget to listen to intuition and their bodies.

Anyway dont want to redirect the threat by rambling.

The apple podcast I need to click some more around to figure this out. I always do in the end. Thank You :)
Have a vial of nandrolone here now along with my Test E. I have decided to try it out as I have so many injuries from martial arts I stopped counting. So with all the other potential benefits I think its worth a try.
here’s the other one he did with Danny bossa. Just want to make sure u saw both


but ya give it a shot and see what happens. U thinking about trying a test base with nandrolone added to it, or a nandrolone base with test added to it?
 

brookseth

Member
The benefits are basically u can use 100mg of nandrolone, get 100mg of androgens, get all the benefits that come with androgens, without having those androgens come with high levels of E2, dht and prolactin. For some guys, using test gives them the benefits of the androgens, but then they have issues from all the E2, dht and/ or prolactin in their system. And in order to lower those metabolites, they try to lower their test dose, but sometimes then lose some of the androgen benefits. So then they’re kind of caught in a rock and a hard place. Keep androgens where they like them, but suffer sides from the metaboites. Or lower their test dose to decrease metabolite sides, but lose some of the androgen benefits

with a nandrolone base, u get the best of both worlds. U use nandrolone as ur base for ur androgens, and then use a tiny bit of test to boost up E2 and dht, since u won’t have much of either with the nandrolone base. But u start low with ur test dose, to get some E2 and dht in ur system, and then u ur test dose up, as needed, until u find the sweetspot where u feel ur best, as far as E2 and dht levels goes. instead of E2 and dht sitting wherever they might on a test base, and only being able to lower them by lowering ur test dose, and losing some of the androgen benefits, u use nandrolone as ur main androgen base, and don’t adjust that dose. U just adjust ur test dose, as needed, to control metabolite levels. So even when ur adjusting ur metabolite levels with the test, ur main androgens from the nandrolone dont change, so ur always getting all the androgen benefits, even whilst dialing in ur metabolite levels, mainly E2

a nandrolone base basically just gives u MUCH more control over where ur metabolite levels sit, mainly E2, dht and prolactin, while on a test base guys will tell u to just let E2, dht and prolactin fall where they may based on ur test dose. If ur experiencing sides, ur just supposed to lower ur test dose basically. That doesnt off much control over things, unfortunately.



So I am curious... Why is this not more mainstream? If anything it seems like this is a more efficient and effective way for therapy no? Just reading this alone makes me want to try it as well.
 

GreenMachineX

Well-Known Member
This is interesting to say the least as I've had issues with overstimulation on test cyp only protocols, but also bloating and sleep disturbances on free test levels that no one should have an issue with. I'm looking at trying test e though first because of so much positive anecdotal feedback on that. But, where are you all getting nandrolone? I'm sure it's a prescription, but does your insurance cover it, or GoodRX coupon, etc?
 
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