How many mg are we really getting ?

[Rogue702]

So I heard somewhere that 100mg of testosterone isn’t actually 100mg but a lower percentage is this true and how much would it be if it was cypionate in particular ? Thanks you guys !

 

[Cataceous]

Testosterone cypionate is 70% testosterone by weight. Thus 100 mg TC contains 70 mg of testosterone. Other esters include testosterone enanthate, at 72% testosterone, and testosterone propionate at 83.7% testosterone.

Taking 100 mg of cypionate per week is still a somewhat high dose. It means you're averaging 10 mg per day of testosterone. The normal range for natural production in men is 3-9 mg per day.

 

[CanadaJim]

Testosterone cypionate is 70% testosterone by weight. Thus 100 mg TC contains 70 mg of testosterone. Other esters include testosterone enanthate, at 72% testosterone, and testosterone propionate at 83.7% testosterone.

Taking 100 mg of cypionate per week is still a somewhat high dose. It means you're averaging 10 mg per day of testosterone. The normal range for natural production in men is 3-9 mg per day.

Which begs the question why is TRT on average 100mg weekly? A dose of 50mg per week should theoretically place a guy in the higher end range. What else comes in to play when some guys are requiring 150 - 200mg weekly just to have there levels read somewhat normal...complicated beings we are....

 

[tareload]

Which begs the question why is TRT on average 100mg weekly? A dose of 50mg per week should theoretically place a guy in the higher end range. What else comes in to play when some guys are requiring 150 - 200mg weekly just to have there levels read somewhat normal...complicated beings we are....

What kind of levels to expect from 100mg weekly

I'm a new to this entire scene, started with levels of around 320, age 40, doctor started me on 100mg once a week. Curious on what type of levels I should expect to see from this? Thanks

www.excelmale.com

 

[Cataceous]

Which begs the question why is TRT on average 100mg weekly? A dose of 50mg per week should theoretically place a guy in the higher end range. What else comes in to play when some guys are requiring 150 - 200mg weekly just to have there levels read somewhat normal...complicated beings we are....

As I was just arguing in another thread, it's part of the legacy of large and infrequent injections. There's greater focus on trough serum testosterone, so that's typically what drives the dose. But if you're injecting testosterone cypionate only once a week then its five-day half-life means your serum peak could be two to three times higher than the trough. So, for example, you dose to get a trough of 600 ng/dL, which ignores the peak of 1,500 earlier in the cycle. The preferred solution is to increase the injection frequency so that the excursions in serum testosterone are limited to physiological levels. A dose of 50 mg per week would be ok for many men if spread out over the week—I'm on the equivalent of 44 mg, for example. 75 mg would be closer to average. But as a single injection per week it's not likely to work well for most, given the low trough levels they'd experience.

As for the guys seeing only average total testosterone from very high doses, they likely have low SHBG, which has been made more so by the high doses. Their free testosterone is going to be quite high. It's possible some men have higher metabolic clearance rates for testosterone, which amplifies the issue. But my guess is that this isn't so common.

 

[tareload]

it's part of the legacy of large and infrequent injections. There's greater focus on trough serum testosterone, so that's typically what drives the dose. But if you're injecting testosterone cypionate only once a week then its five-day half-life means your serum peak could be two to three times higher than the trough. So, for example, you dose to get a trough of 600 ng, which ignores the peak of 1,500 earlier in the cycle. The preferred solution is to increase the injection frequency so that the excursions in serum testosterone are limited to physiological levels.

Picture to go with Cataceous' excellent commentary.

@CanadaJim

Some various examples for various dosing strategies vs Serum TT levels (peak vs trough) here:

What is TRT and What is NOT TRT

Note: I originally posted this over at T-Nation so hope it's ok if I share it here @Nelson Vergel. Had an interesting and lively exchange over there with one of the proponents of the "TOT" protocol (Testosterone Optimization Therapy as it is called). This short summary gives guys a look of...

www.excelmale.com

Prior model I had without the absorption piece but gives you an idea why guys are so confused when comparing their serum TT levels with same equivalent dose per week (say 100 mg/week in 1 injection) vs some other guy with different injection frequency (50 mg twice a week or 100/7 mg every day). Combine that with various PK parameters at the individual level (the post above) and you can start to see why everyone is in a constant state of confusion.

 

[Gladiator]

Should really cut the tren out as it’s not trt but this is a good indication of what’s in the esters

 

[JimGainz]

Which begs the question why is TRT on average 100mg weekly? A dose of 50mg per week should theoretically place a guy in the higher end range. What else comes in to play when some guys are requiring 150 - 200mg weekly just to have there levels read somewhat normal...complicated beings we are....

Your point is valid / but It also comes down to SHBG and other factors. I’ve seen guys with high doses only getting to mid 500s Total Test when you’d expect them to be over 1200. Also the use of ancillaries like HCG can affect this.

When I was on weekly 100mg shots I had a trough of 900 ng/dl but Free Testosterone was about 11. When I was I split the dose I was about 800 trough but 20 Free Testosterone. I am on daily now and expect Free and Total to be lower because I lowered my dose to 70 per week (10mg per day) but I feel great so I’m no longer chasing numbers.

 

[BillyJ03z]

I tried to lower my dosage to about 8-9mg test per day ed/sq (pure test minus the esters) and I feel like shit.... so I just raised my daily inj of Cyp/Prop blend to 20mg (13mg pure test) and I'm starting to feel a little better than I did on low, still by no means feeling grea... I am a low SHBG guy (avg 20-22 labcorb)..... On low dose test my struggling libido and energy was even worse..... maybe my body handles exogenous test differently than it does naturally produced test and I need a little bit more higher levels... I'm wondering if I should go to 150mg per week (daily inj) for a month as an experiment to see how I feel....

 

[JimGainz]

I tried to lower my dosage to about 8-9mg test per day ed/sq (pure test minus the esters) and I feel like shit.... so I just raised my daily inj of Cyp/Prop blend to 20mg (13mg pure test) and I'm starting to feel a little better than I did on low, still by no means feeling grea... I am a low SHBG guy (avg 20-22 labcorb)..... On low dose test my struggling libido and energy was even worse..... maybe my body handles exogenous test differently than it does naturally produced test and I need a little bit more higher levels... I'm wondering if I should go to 150mg per week (daily inj) for a month as an experiment to see how I feel....

I would allow 6 weeks on your new regiment before you changed anything. 20mg daily /13 pure test - would seem like it would work fine. It builds up in your system over a month or so - so you have to wait it out to assess benefits.