Concerned over the rise in estradiol

[Ruffdogster]

06/28/18 Testosterone, Serum 874 ng/dL 264 - 916 01
Free Testosterone(Direct) 27.9 High pg/mL 6.6 - 18.1 02
Estradiol, Sensitive 57.7 High pg/mL 8.0 - 35.0 02

01/22/18 Testosterone, Total, LC/MS 764.4 ng/dL 264.0 - 916.0 02
Free Testosterone(Direct) 31.2 High pg/mL 6.6 - 18.1 02
Estradiol, Sensitive 52.8 High pg/mL 8.0 - 35.0 02

Protocol TC .35 cc/ml 3.5 days
HCG .40 cc/ml 3.5 days
AI 0.125 ( have not been using it this 6 mo period)

Been on this protocol since Oct 2017, feel pretty good, a bit moody though, have a short temper, Mr. Happy still a no show.
Will have a consult with Defy in September, until then would appreciate the knowledgeable folks here to give opinions or guidance if you would.

Thanks in advance
TIM

 

[Nashtide]

06/28/18 Testosterone, Serum 874 ng/dL 264 - 916 01
Free Testosterone(Direct) 27.9 High pg/mL 6.6 - 18.1 02
Estradiol, Sensitive 57.7 High pg/mL 8.0 - 35.0 02

01/22/18 Testosterone, Total, LC/MS 764.4 ng/dL 264.0 - 916.0 02
Free Testosterone(Direct) 31.2 High pg/mL 6.6 - 18.1 02
Estradiol, Sensitive 52.8 High pg/mL 8.0 - 35.0 02

Protocol TC .35 cc/ml 3.5 days
HCG .40 cc/ml 3.5 days
AI 0.125 ( have not been using it this 6 mo period)

Been on this protocol since Oct 2017, feel pretty good, a bit moody though, have a short temper, Mr. Happy still a no show.
Will have a consult with Defy in September, until then would appreciate the knowledgeable folks here to give opinions or guidance if you would.

Thanks in advance
TIM

.35 cc is either 70mg or 140mg depending on the concentration of your T cyp. My guess is you're injecting 140mg per week. I'm going to be the only poster who thinks your E2 is too high. Your T levels look good, so reducing T dose to help control E2 might not be the way to go. Why did you stop taking the AI? If I had your E2 numbers I'd have symptoms.

 

[Ruffdogster]

T cyp is 200mg/ml. Been reading here not to take AI unless I really needed too. The only symptoms I notice is being cranky and irritated. Wife thinks I' m an ******* a lot lately. Libido is off the charts but Mr. Happy is not up for the chore.
Nothing seems to work!
I have plenty of energy, sleep well, eat well etc. but, I am tied down by a recent back surgery that is not allowing me to function and recover to where I was prior to this.

 

[Nashtide]

T cyp is 200mg/ml. Been reading here not to take AI unless I really needed too. The only symptoms I notice is being cranky and irritated. Wife thinks I' m an ******* a lot lately. Libido is off the charts but Mr. Happy is not up for the chore.
Nothing seems to work!
I have plenty of energy, sleep well, eat well etc. but, I am tied down by a recent back surgery that is not allowing me to function and recover to where I was prior to this.

Have you tried cialis or viagra? Most people on here are going to tell you to avoid an AI, but they will grudgingly admit that some guys need a small dose to control their E2. I've taken 0.125mg E3.5D for three years with great results. I feel best when my E2 is in the mid 30's.

 

[MarkM]

I am guessing that your SHBG is low. Do you know what it is? If not you really need to find out because your SHBG will dictate what type of protocol you should have; dosage and number of injections per week. Low SHBG individuals typically need EOD injections or one small injection every day. Your Free T is high and it is likely that you have high Free E2 (Estradiol). "E" follows "T". High Free E2 will probably give you the high libido but no "wood". I think your E2 is on the high end but my real concern would be the likelihood of high Free E2.

Cranky and irritated aren't the only symptoms, Mr.Happy not being "happy" is also a symptom. Are you bloated and putting on a little weight?

 

[OMI100]

GREAT article onE2 – A MUST READ
http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Hdr_Estrogen.aspx

 

[Ruffdogster]

I have tried both with negative results, Tri mix did nothing for me (4x). I may be one of those that needs a small AI. I come here to see what the experts think and give me questions for the Doc.

 

[OMI100]

And the rest of the story
My Mantra...
Take what you need.....
********************************
First step is education....
********************************
Cannot tell how much research you have done on TRT.
If not a lot, I recommend you get a few books.
Get a few good books and educate yourself now:
1. Get Nelsons book "Testosterone: A Man's Guide".
2. Get Lee Myer's book "Natural Versus Testosterone Therapy".
3. Get “Testosterone for life - Dr. Abraham Morgentaller “.
4. Get “The Definitive Testosterone Replacement Therapy MANual: How to OptimizeYour Testosterone For Lifelong Health And Happiness” by Jay Campbell.
These books will give you a much better understanding of TRT....
********************************
ExcelMale.comGuide to Testosterone Replacement
https://www.excelmale.com/forum/showthread.php?5823-ExcelMale-com-Guide-to-Testosterone-Replacement
**********************************
One other forumthat has great info that might be useful to you is:
http://www.peaktestosterone.com/
GREAT article onE2 – A MUST READ
http://www.peaktestosterone.com/Hdr_Estrogen.aspx
********************************
Dr Saya's Videos on Testosterone Therapy and Side Effect Management
https://www.excelmale.com/forum/showthread.php?15207-Dr-Saya-s-Videos-on-Testosterone-Therapy-and-Side-Effect-Management
**********************************
Second step might be to have a look at your thyroid and see if any issues there.
********************************
Do some research.
I do like Tiredthyroid as a starting point.
Easy to read sections.
References at the bottom of each section (and NOT from people wearing "tinfoil" hats)
See below:
Basic sources to research Thyroid issues and testing:
******************************************
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/
Spend time here and get the 2 books, “STTM: The Revised Book” and “STTMII:Authored by Doctors”.
*******************************************
http://www.tiredthyroid.com/
Great simple to understand articles.
Get her book.... “Tired Thyroid: From Hyper to Hypo to Healing—Breaking the TSHRule”, https://read.amazon.com/kp/embed?asi...Channel=system
A lot of clear researched information that is easy toread and understand.
***************************
https://hypothyroidmom.com/
Good info here. Look around.
*************************
https://www.restartmed.com/?s=thyroid
A LOT of good articles and a youtube page.
Spend time here looking around and reading after getting labs back.
************************************
Do you have Hypothyroidism?
The CompleteHypothyroidism User Guide for Patients (2018 Edition)
https://www.restartmed.com/hypothyroidism/
*********************************
Need information on thyroid testing....
Read here:
http://www.tiredthyroid.com/what-labs.html
And here:
http://www.tiredthyroid.com/optimal-labs.html
and here:
https://stopthethyroidmadness.com/recommended-labwork/
and here:
https://www.restartmed.com/thyroid-tests/
and here:
https://www.restartmed.com/hormone-testing/
And here:
https://www.restartmed.com/normal-thyroid-levels/
**************************************
Some additional links to read before you receive the books you have already ordered
Go here:
http://www.allthingsmale.com/publications.html
and download:
TRT: Recipe For Success
Print out.
and
HCG Update.
and the TRT Power Point presentation.

Dr. Crisler is one of the "TRT Cutting Edge DR's" here in the states....
Also go here:
http://www.drjohncrisler.com/the-cri...part-deux.html
and also print out the article.
***************************
ALSO look at the videos that are posted on this site. A LOT of great info to take in....
******************************
Now you will have a great reference library and knowledge base to go forward on!

 

[Vince Carter]

Where is your SHBG? Did Defy run that?

Key indicator your SHBG is low is right here...see how high your Free T is way over the lab range? Pending SHBG labs you can't run TT and Free T like this. Low SHBG=(Very) high Free T = (Very) high Free E.
Next set of labs if money permits add to your testing "Estradiol, Free". My hunch is youre low SHBG and your Free E is going to be astronomically high.

 

[Ruffdogster]

My SHBG was 15.1 in JAn 2018, I will be doing a full blood work in the next week, which is covered under my insurance. I did these tests because the lab Dr. uses wont do estradiol and Test the way it should be so I paid out of pocket to get these done.

 

[MarkM]

I am not surprised your SHBG is that low based off the other lab work. Knowing that you can now establish a proper protocol. You might consider anywhere from 16 mg to 18 mg per day and aim for a Total T of somewhere around 650 and Free T in the 16 to 18 range. This will pull your Estradiol and Free Estradiol down as well. People with low SHBG can not have high Total T and high Free T because your E will follow the same path and be too high. The only way that 90% plus of people with low SHBG can be successful on TRT is following a protocol close to what I've indicated above. I'm sure others with low SHBG will add their input and experiences to help you.

 

[Vince Carter]

I am not surprised your SHBG is that low based off the other lab work. Knowing that you can now establish a proper protocol. You might consider anywhere from 16 mg to 18 mg per day and aim for a Total T of somewhere around 650 and Free T in the 16 to 18 range. This will pull your Estradiol and Free Estradiol down as well. People with low SHBG can not have high Total T and high Free T because your E will follow the same path and be too high. The only way that 90% plus of people with low SHBG can be successful on TRT is following a protocol close to what I've indicated above. I'm sure others with low SHBG will add their input and experiences to help you.

You're spot on accurate...thanks, great post.

 

[Systemlord]

My SHBG is 16 and injecting twice weekly doesn't produce Mr. Happy, however injecting 15-20mg EOD and Mr. Happy is more than happy to show himself. Estrogen levels are also not helping Mr. Happy.

 

[Ruffdogster]

Thanks guys, I will try an EOD protocol and see where I end up. I've been lurking here for over a year and a half, before I pulled the trigger and joined Defy out of my own pocket for help. I read so much on here that it makes my head swim.So I ask for some of you most knowledgeable folks for a little guidance between consults with Defy. I appreciate all your feed back.

Have a Happy 4th of JUly