Bass's BW as of 1/7/2014 also on T3 Cycle.

[Bass]

TSH has decreased dramatically, usually it averages at about 2.500 uIU/ml, now its 0.832

when I did the BW I was taking 50mcg T3 ed, shouldn't my T3 Uptake be higher? no change from last BW!

my platelets are always on the low side, but this is the first time its below normal. can T3 cause this, and should I be worried about it?

cholesterol looks awesome compared to previous BW

PSA no change, good!

Kidneys keep getting better despite the heavy training and high protein intake.

at 160 mgs test ew along with 0.5 mg AI my E2 is still low, my doc suggested the test increase to see if it helps with shoulder pain. didn't work so i'll ask her to go back to my previous dose of 120mgs ew. no need to have my test that high, also will eliminate the need for AI.


TSH 0.832 0.450-4.500 uIU/mL
Thyroxine (T4) 2.8 LOW 4.5-12.0 ug/dL
T3 Uptake 31 24-39 %
Free Thyroxine Index 0.9 LOW 1.2-4.9

Cholesterol, Total 188 100-199 mg/dL
Triglycerides 97 0-149 mg/dL
HDL Cholesterol 45 >39 mg/dL
VLDL Cholesterol Cal 19 5-40 mg/dL
LDL Cholesterol Calc 124 HIGH 0-99 mg/dL

Platelets 134 LOW 155-379 x10E3/uL

Testosterone , Serum 939 348-1197 ng/dL
Testosterone, Free 33.43 HIGH 5.00-21.00 ng/dL
% Free Testosterone 3.56 1.50-4.20 %

Insulin -Like Growth Factor I 216 HIGH 61-200 ng/mL

Prostate Specific Ag, Serum 0.9 0.0-4.0 ng/mL

Creatinine, Serum 1.18 0.76-1.27 mg/dL
eGFR If NonAfricn Am 70 >59 mL/min/1.73

 

[Bass]

hmmm, didn't know why the format keeps getting screwed up!

 

[Vettester Chris]

Bass, again, good to see and hear from you. You know guys like Gene and myself, and there's some pretty special talent here. Your insight and experiences would be just as valuable.

I'll touch on the thyroid part and probably call it a night. We've got a ride into Carbon Canyon tomorrow, so I think I'll need rested up if I'm taking my R1.

Taking the T3 medication is obviously making sense with why your TSH level is declining via the negative feedback loop system. That can be the normal process, but you don't want to get to a point where the table starts turning 'hyperthyroidism' on you. If it's for just cycling in for a period of time, I get that, but run labs in about 3 weeks after getting off of it.

The problem with the labs you presented is that there's really no way to know how much actual free and unbound T3 is in your system. The T3 Uptake is useless (JMO, not wanting a battle with any physicians that are sold on it). Don't let it deceive you, it's not a T3 assay all, it actually measures proteins to estimate the amount of active FT4. Throw it out the door! What you need is the actual Free T3 assay, and the FT4 assay, not this old school Free Thyroxine Index stuff, which is nothing more than a computation of the Total T4 x T3 Uptake (0.86 rounded up). The correct thyroid labs should be complimented with a complete requisition of Iron Sat, TIBC, Iron Serum & Ferritin, along with Cortisol (really sold on the dynamics of the 4x saliva kit, it's becoming IMO and others the gold standard for true accuracy). These labs and others like Vitamin D & B12 would be essential to know that your FT3 (whatever level it's at) is productive at the cellular level. Antibodies should also be factored if you haven't done so, just so the autoimmune side of it covered (you may have done that in past lab work, not positive?)

Let us know how long you are looking at this program with exogenous T3? If you and your physician are looking at a long-term program for treating hypothyroidism, due to a natural low production of T4 and T3, I highly encourage you to look deeper at Natural Desiccated Thyroid medications (NDT), which is harvested from pigs and works essentially like the natural thyroid. The T4:T3 ratios are a bit different than a human thryoid, but that can be adjusted to work effectively. Plus, NDT provides T2, T1 & Calcitonin, which all plays a role with other variables, and helps keep a steady balance in this department.

Thanks again for making it over, bass. I'm sure others will have some comments on your testosterone, E2 and other lab results. I see you still have a thing for low SHBG!! No worries, I'm in that same boat! Time for me to hit the sack. Good seeing you.

 

[Bass]

Thanks Chris, Thyroid was my concern and you covered it very well as usual.

 

[Vettester Chris]

Bass, there's some great info at stopthethyroidmadness.com, plus detailed lab work reccomedations.

 

[Gene Devine]

Well, well, well....look who is here!

I don't have to tell you Bass how much I respect you and consider you a dear friend.

So good for our forum to have such a knowledgeable member like you.

Welcome aboard mi amigo!!!

BTW, nice set of guns ol' man

 

[Gene Devine]

If these labs were taken at 160 mg each week, for me, I wouldn't change a thing as I think you look great.

IGF-1 looks good B, no HGH for you! You supplementing DHEA?

 

[Bass]

Bass, there's some great info at stopthethyroidmadness.com, plus detailed lab work reccomedations.

Thanks Chris, I did a full thyroid panel a day prior to T3 cycle. I'll try to find it and post it here. another concern I had was my platelets, as mentioned always been on the low side but this is the first time below normal. could this be related to T3 intake?

If these labs were taken at 160 mg each week, for me, I wouldn't change a thing as I think you look great.

IGF-1 looks good B, no HGH for you! You supplementing DHEA?

no DHEA at this point, I have plenty in stock, I stopped due to running the T3 cycle, trying to minimize drugs as much as possible. thanks again for the welcome.

 

[Vettester Chris]

Bass, on your platelets, IMO you need to get a referral to a specialist, especially with this trending pattern you are having. Have you noticed any other noticeable changes with your CBC's? WBC's, RBC's?? Yes, IMO, I'd stop the T3. If it's related then it would more than likely be related on the scale of an autoimmune disease (Hashis, Graves). I can only stress to get your thyroid antibodies tested (TPO, TGAB, & TSI), and get with a specialist to review the whole program.

Mine have decreased over the years as well, but I'm still >200. You need those platelets to clot or life starts to get real difficult. Were your ferritin and iron level high before you started donating blood? If so, check for hemochromatosis. As you probably know, I'm a single gene carrier for that disease. Some get hit mildly with it, some pretty hard ... Me not so good. Anyhow, my medical team believes there's a correlation with the decrease of my platelets. Who knows, but it's worth checking on your end.

 

[Bass]

thanks Chris. my platelets kind of goes up and down but very little and consistent, only this time went way down while on T3. love the effects of T3, but as you have suggested I may have to stop if this is screwing things up. my TRT doc checked for thyroid but not sure exactly what, so i'll get a copy an d post it here. also will do another thyroid BW as you have listed, I don't think my doc will order another one this soon, so ill do it myself. to be honest your explanation went way above my head, I am so amazed with your knowledge, you should be a doctor! I will discuss all these things with my doc. thanks for taking the time helping me with this.

 

[Vettester Chris]

Bass, thanks for the nice words. Honestly, I had zero interest in any educational aspect of the medical arena when I was younger. It was only when my own personal health crisis began that I started to jump-in. When I saw the inconsistencies across the spectrum between all these physicians, I kind of knew the burden was on me to start learning for the sake of my own health.

I definitely don't want to come across as talking over anyone's head, but just hoping to put enough out there that will enable you to perform further research, and hopefully to prompt others who have experiences or scientific data that can compliment, dispute, or enlighten the discussion. The discussion is for the benefit of you having as many options to factor when talking with your doctor, so IMO it's important that ALL angles get expressed. Collaboration is one of the best ways we can learn! I'll wait to see your other labs, then we can take it from there ...

 

[Bass]

Bass, thanks for the nice words. Honestly, I had zero interest in any educational aspect of the medical arena when I was younger. It was only when my own personal health crisis began that I started to jump-in. When I saw the inconsistencies across the spectrum between all these physicians, I kind of knew the burden was on me to start learning for the sake of my own health.

I definitely don't want to come across as talking over anyone's head, but just hoping to put enough out there that will enable you to perform further research, and hopefully to prompt others who have experiences or scientific data that can compliment, dispute, or enlighten the discussion. The discussion is for the benefit of you having as many options to factor when talking with your doctor, so IMO it's important that ALL angles get expressed. Collaboration is one of the best ways we can learn! I'll wait to see your other labs, then we can take it from there ...

Yes I appreciate your knowledge, the over my head comment was meant as a complement, and you are correct, you gave me a reason to do more research. I agree with you regarding doing your own research, my doc thinks below normal testosterone is fine, of course you and I know that's not true. with the info you provided i'll have so much to take with me on my next appointment. much appreciated.

 

[Bass]

Chris, I forgot to answer some of your question. RBC Hemoglobin, etc... are perfect. I never tested for iron, I am assuming its all good there otherwise i'll be turned down at the blood drive.

 

[Vettester Chris]

Chris, I forgot to answer some of your question. RBC Hemoglobin, etc... are perfect. I never tested for iron, I am assuming its all good there otherwise i'll be turned down at the blood drive.

Bass, actually those guys love iron enriched blood. When starting out, my ferritin was >1,400, and I my iron serum was high, lower end on TIBC. They didn't blink. It's great blood for anemic patients. My wife is on the opposite end and can't donate due to low iron. This is also playing a role in her thyroid productivity (another story in itself). Hopefully you have some older iron serum, ferritin and TIBC labs?It would be hard to detect anything at this juncture since you've been giving blood so frequently. You might be able to do a MTHFR-Gene lab if you don't have any previous labs, which could give you some insight, and a specialist could review your HFE gene, which was where it started with me.

 

[Bass]

Chris, I got a copy of the BW my doc ran, its not much but this is how my thyroid looked prior to T3 cycle.

Thyroxine (T4) Free, Direct, 1.22 (0.82-1.77)
TSH, 2.180 (0.450-4.500)
Triiodothyronine, Free , Serum, 2.7 (2.00-4.4)
Cortisol, 17.9 (2.3-19.4)

 

[Vettester Chris]

Bass, thanks for posting. Actually, it helps substantially!

As I've posted in other threads, my opinion for a healthy thyroid level is to be at 50% to 80% of the provided value range on the free/unbound assays.
Your results: FT4 = 42%
FT3 = 29%

I'd still like to see RT3 and compare the ratio to FT3. I don't think pooling is an issue, but it would be good to just make sure everything is in order.
In that respect, I can see why you state that you feel really great on T3 only medication. I'd really like you to look deeper into possibly getting on a Natural Desiccated Thyroid medication instead of T3 only, which would give you the T4, T3, T2, T1 & Calcitonin as you would be getting naturally with your own thyroid. IMO, take a little time to do some detailed research on NDT's, then maybe talk to your physician on it.

The T4:T3 ratios on NDT are little different than what a normal human thyroid would produce, but that can be adjusted, compensated, and titrated accordingly. It would take a little time to get it dialed in, but IMO, I think you will achieve a better overall wellbeing going that route.

Can't really make heads or tails on the Cortisol, just knowing what you presented (probably blood serum), it's at the top of its respective range. Consider a 4x saliva test, I can do a circadian profile on it with you and you will really have a better understanding on your adrenals over the course of a 24 hour period. Canary Club has them and can ship to your house. Hope all of this helps.

 

[Bass]

excellent info Chris, yea i been feeling great since I lowered T3 to 30mcg ed. I will definitely talk to my doc regarding NDT. thanks much Chris!

 

[Vettester Chris]

Anytime chief!

 

[Bass]

Chris, I am assuming NDT needs a prescription, correct?

 

[Vettester Chris]

Chris, I am assuming NDT needs a prescription, correct?

Bass, yeah, NDT meds like Armour are prescribed by the doc.