3 month labs

[RocDawg]

Thoughts Please

 

[RocDawg]

my protocol is 200mg weekly in split doese

1,000iu HCG weekly in split doses

 

[ERO]

The big question is how do you feel now that you are 3 months in? Better than before starting? worse? no change?

 

[RocDawg]

I basically feel like a new man at this point.

 

[Gene Devine]

Roc - Sorry, I removed my post; it was meant for another thread.

Your E2 Sensitive lab is elevated; you need to be in high 20's to low 30's.

Your Testosterone labs are all very elevated as well.

Remember, E follows T and with your elevated Testosterone labs so will E2.

You need to reduce your dosage of Testosterone to get these labs back in the physiological range.

 

[CoastWatcher]

I basically feel like a new man at this point.

You may feel even better if you bring your estradiol level down. Gene's point is on the money - just lower your dose and you will pull your total testosterone and e2 into a reasonable range.

 

[RocDawg]

Any thoughts on my Red Blood Cell Count?

At what point does one need to be concerned about prolactin? What test most accurately measusers it?

With the E2, what about using an AI to get it under control?

 

[ERO]

I would recommend lowering your T dose, waiting for it to stabilize and then check again. Your E2 may be fine without an AI at a lower T dose and it is best to change only one variable at a time

Also, remember that the idea of the "idea range" of E2 being in the upper 20s to low 30s is based on a relatively low total T level.

As Nelson points out, the ratio of T to E2 is more important than a static number, and the ideal ratio is between 14 and 20. So, for example, if your total testosterone was 1000, then an E2 level of between 50-71 (divide 1000 by 14 and 20) is in-range.

 

[CoastWatcher]

If you can avoid an AI you should. Why add a very potent medication to your protocol when you can get the same results by moderating your dose?

As as for prolactin, what was your level before starting TRT?

 

[RocDawg]

Im picking things up as I go here.....

Im not too clear as to why we would want to avoid using the AI. Ive read in many places that its common practice to use an AI

My thought with the AI was to administer the AI and get the E2 under control then adjust the T dose as needed and come off the AI

Without the use of an AI, and only lowering the T dosage, how quickly would my E2 be adjusted?

I dont have a prolactin baseline. PRL=prolactin....correct?

 

[RocDawg]

I would recommend lowering your T dose, waiting for it to stabilize and then check again. Your E2 may be fine without an AI at a lower T dose and it is best to change only one variable at a time

Also, remember that the idea of the "idea range" of E2 being in the upper 20s to low 30s is based on a relatively low total T level.


As Nelson points out, the ratio of T to E2 is more important than a static number, and the ideal ratio is between 14 and 20. So, for example, if your total testosterone was 1000, then an E2 level of between 50-71 (divide 1000 by 14 and 20) is in-range.

Good info on the ideal range!

 

[ERO]

A couple of things to keep in mind:

1) You feel awesome on your protocol - feeling awesome on TRT takes many of us months or years of adjustments to do and you are already there.

2) It is common to use an AI, but if one can avoid using one, one should. Anastrozole is strong stuff and its very, very easy to drop your E2 too low, which feels awful (no libido, ED that may not be helped by PDE-5 inhibitors, achy joints) and takes weeks to recover from. Additionally, AIs are difficult to dose properly. For example, in some guys 0.25mg twice a week might tank their E2 to zero, and 1/8mg twice a week might not be enough - so then you end-up chasing the dosing for weeks or months. In your case your total T is very high, but your E2 when calculated is not far out of range According to the ratio yours is as follows: 1550/59.5 = 26, which is out of the 14 to 20 range, but not out by very much. Therefore if you cut down your T dose, your E2 is very likely to fall in-range and you wont have to deal with an AI at all.

Since you feel like a new man, it is unlikely your have any Prolactin issues, but if you want to test, go to discountedlabs.com and scroll down to the Prolactin test. http://www.discountedlabs.com/prolactin/

 

[RocDawg]

1. I do feel great compared to where is was at in the past. Im going to assume that it will only get better once im dialed in.

2. Ive heard of the horror stories of men that crash their E2. Thats really a place that I wouldnt want to be. My protocol is not self perscribed, Im under doctor supervision. Ill be seeing him next week. Regardless, I still need solid info so I can give a respectable opinion and have a base of knowledge for myself.

 

[Nelson Vergel]

RocDawg

Your numbers look good. However, you need to clean up your diet by limiting sugar, alcohol and processed carbohydrates. Your HDL is very low (this may be due to your T+HCG dose or some oral supplement or anabolic you are taking). Your free T is high (not a bad thing) which may also be due to the T+HCG dose or an anabolic.

I would not take an AI. Your T/E2 ratio is 1550/59 is 26.

Can you tell us what else you are taking?

 

[RocDawg]

My protocol is 200mg weekly T in split doses

HCG 1000iu weekly in split doses

I also take different over the counter pre-workout supplements.

I take saw palmetto and milk thistle daily

I use asthma meds as needed

I've had a cholesterol issue for a long time. That is the reason I found out about my testosterone problems. These lipid panels are they best they have ever been. My HDL has always been low, however I believe it is now at its highest point. For cholesterol I take Gemfibrizol daily.