Combining cream and injection

gallant · Jul 25, 2022

I'm seeing lots of guys are really liking doing this. They are typically lowering their injection dosage and doing 50mgs of cream in the morning. Anyone here doing this with good results and will Defy be agreeable to this approach?

Dicky · Jul 26, 2022

I do both cream and injections and I use Defy. It was one of Defy's PA's that suggested cream to me. I often have low or lowish E2 in relation to my testosterone levels. She suggested that the cream might aromatize better and give me better E2 levels without having to increase my T levels. She was right. But I ended up adding back a low level of T Cypionate, just to give me a baseline level of T. I was feeling just a little bit off with the cream only.

BTW, Defy has never once turned down an idea I wanted to explore. They have talked me out of one idea that they didn't think would help me. But they would have let me do it if I had wanted to. I love those people to death. They are what a true medical relationship should be. You tell them your goals and ideas and they work with those and turn them recommendations for treatment. If you don't have any ideas of your own, they are very skilled at recommending things for you. Most people on here are fairly detail oriented. So lots of us come to them with ideas to better our treatment. Defy welcomes that kind of thing. I can't say enough good things about them

Smokey · Jul 27, 2022

Dicky said:
I do both cream and injections and I use Defy. It was one of Defy's PA's that suggested cream to me. I often have low or lowish E2 in relation to my testosterone levels. She suggested that the cream might aromatize better and give me better E2 levels without having to increase my T levels. She was right. But I ended up adding back a low level of T Cypionate, just to give me a baseline level of T. I was feeling just a little bit off with the cream only.

BTW, Defy has never once turned down an idea I wanted to explore. They have talked me out of one idea that they didn't think would help me. But they would have let me do it if I had wanted to. I love those people to death. They are what a true medical relationship should be. You tell them your goals and ideas and they work with those and turn them recommendations for treatment. If you don't have any ideas of your own, they are very skilled at recommending things for you. Most people on here are fairly detail oriented. So lots of us come to them with ideas to better our treatment. Defy welcomes that kind of thing. I can't say enough good things about them

Can you share your cream plus injection protocol in terms of amounts? Thanks!

Dialingitin · Jul 29, 2022

I am dialing in my sweet spot protocol using the "how I feel" method. I started with cream only (100mg/week equivalent), which I liked a lot (50% scrotal, 50% collarbone area) but my skin did not like it (itchy bumps and rashes). I then switched to once/week 100mg Test E injection (xyosted), which is "ok" but noticed diminished energy in the gym and recovery was not what it was on cream towards the end of the 7 day interval.

I am now "supplementing" my weekly injection with scrotal cream as follows: inject Saturday morning, top up with cream on the following Wed morning and Friday morning. Those top up doses are pretty low, each at 50% of the standard daily dose (so, roughly 7-8mg equivalent for each day).

This seems to be keeping my gym time at a consistent good energy level, no ligament/tendon/joint pain and speedy recoveries. I am still experimenting with the cream (days and amounts) but I like what seems to be a DHT bump while the Test E winds down.

No numbers on any of this - I am purely going off of how I feel and my doc enjoys hearing about my experimentation.

Smokey · Jul 30, 2022

Thanks for the feedback. I am going to try a protocol but with 150 per week and daily cream at 50 mg scrotum application. Will provide feedback

Dicky · Jul 30, 2022

Smokey said:
Can you share your cream plus injection protocol in terms of amounts? Thanks!

1.5 clicks of cream to the scrotum every day (IIRC 1 click = 50mg test)
20 mg cypionate 2X/week
.15 ml HCG 2X/week

Smokey · Jul 30, 2022

Thanks for sharing

Forty2 · Aug 5, 2022

Ho

Dicky said:
1.5 clicks of cream to the scrotum every day (IIRC 1 click = 50mg test)
20 mg cypionate 2X/week
.15 ml HCG 2X/week

How many iu of HCG is in 0.15ml?

Dicky · Aug 6, 2022

Forty2 said:
Ho

How many iu of HCG is in 0.15ml?

Now that you mention it, i don't really know. I had always thought that .15ml = 150 IU. But now that you ask I can't say for sure

Tman · Aug 7, 2022

I tried the cream and injection protocol after 2 years struggling with injections only at a variety of doses and timing. Finally took the plunge and switched to a clinic that focused on creams. Before, conversations were more about how low SHBG impacted the benefits and trying to manage E2. For the last 2 months...apply and forget. I've finally found a process that works. It's been so much easier.

Fortunate · Aug 7, 2022

Tman said:
I tried the cream and injection protocol after 2 years struggling with injections only at a variety of doses and timing. Finally took the plunge and switched to a clinic that focused on creams. Before, conversations were more about how low SHBG impacted the benefits and trying to manage E2. For the last 2 months...apply and forget. I've finally found a process that works. It's been so much easier.

How long have you been on this protocol? How many mg? Once a day?

Willyt · Dec 4, 2022

Dicky said:
I do both cream and injections and I use Defy. It was one of Defy's PA's that suggested cream to me. I often have low or lowish E2 in relation to my testosterone levels. She suggested that the cream might aromatize better and give me better E2 levels without having to increase my T levels. She was right. But I ended up adding back a low level of T Cypionate, just to give me a baseline level of T. I was feeling just a little bit off with the cream only.

Are you still on same cream + injections protocol? Is it continuing to work well?

Dicky · Dec 12, 2022

Willyt said:
Are you still on same cream + injections protocol? Is it continuing to work well?

I just saw this. I haven't been on here as much since the weekly reminder email doesn't get sent out anymore. Yes I am still on this protocol. Still doing well. I did have to bump the daily cream dose up to 2 clicks a day from 1.5 a day and increased my injection dose from 20mg 2x/week to 25mg 2x/week. I was getting low estrogen symptoms, which have now been taken care of by the increased dosage.

Willyt · Dec 13, 2022

Dicky said:
I just saw this. I haven't been on here as much since the weekly reminder email doesn't get sent out anymore. Yes I am still on this protocol. Still doing well. I did have to bump the daily cream dose up to 2 clicks a day from 1.5 a day and increased my injection dose from 20mg 2x/week to 25mg 2x/week. I was getting low estrogen symptoms, which have now been taken care of by the increased dosage.

Nice. Any ideas what you T levels are on this protocol?

Dicky · Dec 15, 2022

Willyt said:
Nice. Any ideas what you T levels are on this protocol?

Depends on when I test. The last set of labs I did, I went in at my trough, right before I was supposed to inject and before I applied the cream. My total T was 473 (264-916). My free T was 4.0 (7.2-24.0). I'm sure these would be higher if I tested after I applied the cream and did my injection.

eli · Dec 16, 2022

Dicky said:
I do both cream and injections and I use Defy. It was one of Defy's PA's that suggested cream to me. I often have low or lowish E2 in relation to my testosterone levels. She suggested that the cream might aromatize better and give me better E2 levels without having to increase my T levels. She was right. But I ended up adding back a low level of T Cypionate, just to give me a baseline level of T. I was feeling just a little bit off with the cream only.

BTW, Defy has never once turned down an idea I wanted to explore. They have talked me out of one idea that they didn't think would help me. But they would have let me do it if I had wanted to. I love those people to death. They are what a true medical relationship should be. You tell them your goals and ideas and they work with those and turn them recommendations for treatment. If you don't have any ideas of your own, they are very skilled at recommending things for you. Most people on here are fairly detail oriented. So lots of us come to them with ideas to better our treatment. Defy welcomes that kind of thing. I can't say enough good things about them

They just rape you on the prices. Lol they better cooperate

Bennytrt · Dec 26, 2022

eli said:
They just rape you on the prices. Lol they better cooperate

They sure do. Their 10 ml compounded test cyp went from 75 to 130. Ouch!!! Their hcg went up as well.

bruin · Dec 27, 2022

My Test cyp is approx 75 from CVS
just scheduled my ov and will request a tcream rx as a supplement for the injectable.
Prior to injecting while using cream, I would apply to sides of toros, scrotum, inner arm, abdomen.....all areas different docs had told me in the past were applicable sites, but never applied to the shaft.

I see where there is just not one singular rule for administration. Not to go off topic, but i recall years ago in another forum some guy was injecting his HCG directly into his sack, he said it was saving his boys.....hmmm..............different strokes.....no pun intended

Systemlord · Dec 27, 2022

gallant said:
Anyone here doing this with good results and will Defy be agreeable to this approach?

I doubt Defy would put up much resistance to combining injections and creams which they have done before to address subpar DHT conversion.

eli · Dec 28, 2022

bruin said:
My Test cyp is approx 75 from CVS
just scheduled my ov and will request a tcream rx as a supplement for the injectable.
Prior to injecting while using cream, I would apply to sides of toros, scrotum, inner arm, abdomen.....all areas different docs had told me in the past were applicable sites, but never applied to the shaft.

I see where there is just not one singular rule for administration. Not to go off topic, but i recall years ago in another forum some guy was injecting his HCG directly into his sack, he said it was saving his boys.....hmmm..............different strokes.....no pun intended

I wouldn't believe everything online lol.

Systemlord said:
I doubt Defy would put up much resistance to combining injections and creams which they have done before to address subpar DHT conversion.

Defy allowed me to do injections and cream but only 50mg max per day for cream instead of 200mg solo