Ive been doing daily injections ever since I switched back to injections 2 weeks ago. In the past, I’ve always injected EOD. I’m going to try injecting E3D starting today, just to see if I notice any benefits. Do you think the body might like slight fluctuations in test levels, opposed to trying to get as stable of levels as possible? Have you tried injecting less frequently than EOD? Just curious, because if you notice improvements with EOD, compared to ED, my mind would tell me that there’s at least a slight possibility that you might feel even better with E3D-E5D injections.
So I tried daily injections...
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Ive been doing daily injections ever since I switched back to injections 2 weeks ago. In the past, I’ve always injected EOD. I’m going to try injecting E3D starting today, just to see if I notice any benefits. Do you think the body might like slight fluctuations in test levels, opposed to trying to get as stable of levels as possible? Have you tried injecting less frequently than EOD? Just curious, because if you notice improvements with EOD, compared to ED, my mind would tell me that there’s at least a slight possibility that you might feel even better with E3D-E5D injections.
Blackhawk
Member
Yes, been there, done that. It took a good 2 years to settle on this QOD protocol and after every attempted variation I return to it.
Most will see minimal hormonal variation with daily cypionate or enanthate. However, recent anecdotal reports are saying that propionate is capable of creating significant, even excessive, daily variation in testosterone.
Your clearly a very intelligent and detail oriented person, what’s your current thoughts. Do you think the body prefers as consistent levels of testosterone as possible, or do you think it may actually like some fluctuations in testosterone levels better?
Ya I always did EOD because I thought it was the best balance of frequency and convenience. Do you mind just quickly telling us what the other injection frequencies are that you’ve tried?
Blackhawk
Member
Man, this is broken record stuff, I have posted this info so many times. And as always, I do not advocate what works for me as valid for anyone else.
Q3D, mood swings and bloating on 3 day cycle.
QOD, the sweet spot
QD constant mild bloating and moodiness
0.07mg anastrozole also QOD and no E2 symptoms, steady mood. I have tried to get off the AI, but I just do better with it, keeping E2 in the high 20s-30
Q3D, mood swings and bloating on 3 day cycle.
QOD, the sweet spot
QD constant mild bloating and moodiness
0.07mg anastrozole also QOD and no E2 symptoms, steady mood. I have tried to get off the AI, but I just do better with it, keeping E2 in the high 20s-30
antelopers
Active Member
On some other boards guys like to put their protocol and lab numbers in their signature, might be good so that you don't have to repost it often.
Appreciate you posting it one more time lol. Last question, what is your SHBG?
The facts are kind of limited. We know that young males can have pretty substantial variation, and they generally have better libido, sexual function, etc. than older males with flatter hormones. But who knows if any of that correlation is causal in nature. We also see a lot of anecdotes where guys get their best results during transitions and fluctuations. But is this meaningful, or is it wrongly neglecting all the times guys feel bad until things settle down? I guess it's a long-winded way of saying "maybe" to the question of whether fluctuations in testosterone are better. My guess is that fluctuations are better if everything stays appropriately balanced for the individual, e.g. relative levels of metabolites such as estradiol and DHT. Otherwise fluctuations can probably make things worse.
My current thinking on daily propionate is that it can provide an appropriate amount of daily testosterone variation, but the rise in testosterone to its peak is unnaturally fast, possibly occurring two to six hours post-injection. Is this a problem? I'm not sure.
Appreciate your insight. So far, I think I’ve felt best on the cream. Hard to pinpoint why though. Could it be the variation in levels throughout the day? Is it the elevated DHT benefits? Is it due to guys reaching higher free T levels on the cream, compared to injections when total was at the same level? Most likely the answer is a mixture of the three. I do wonder how much of the benefits are from the variations in levels throughout the day though.
Most likely some of the benefits are from a mixture of the first two: variation and higher DHT; with fixed total testosterone and SHBG, DHT does not have a large influence on free T.
antelopers
Active Member
Perhaps dopamine as well, since the levels are not constantly elevated?
Blackhawk
Member
Average ~ 50
Quite possible. Here's a nice little article talking about the interplay between dopamine and testosterone: Male Libido, Testosterone, & Neurotransmitters | Sanesco
So you think fluctuating levels might be better for dopamine vs constantly elevated levels?
antelopers
Active Member
I'm just speculating, maybe you get a boost of dopamine with each application of the cream since it's such a quick spike in levels.
Ya it’s all basically speculation at this point. Wish there were a bunch of studies comparing injection frequencies while keeping the dose the same
I wonder if maybe having more of a peak and trough gives the receptors a break and resensitizes them a little or something, consequently making the next peak more effective at the receptor level
I personally think it somehow allows the system to keep a proper balance of the metabolites dht and e2. Thats why i believe natural testosterone fluctuates. It turns the tap on and turns it off when the metabolites are at the required levels. With injections we are leaving the tap on and flooding the system.
Ya it’s just interesting how there’s guys on here that go to daily and their E2 shoots up. And there’s so many guys that don’t get super anal about things, just do the standard once a week injection, and feel great. I actually work with a woman that’s in her 60’s, and just found out last month that her husband takes testosterone. He’s been on it for a few years. She’s a nurse, and is the one that injects him. She said she injects him once every 2 weeks. She said he feels pretty good, and has no complaints.
Obviously everyone is different, and there apparently are some guys that feel optimal on daily injections, which confuses things. I just wish we were all more similar and what worked for one guy worked for every other guy! Lol.
I've been doing 100 mg to 150 mg T-Cyp E3.5D for about a year, with the dosage changes at the doc's recommendation depending on lab results. My Total and Free T are always around the high end of the range, but my E is always up around 50 [8-35]. SHBG ranges 30 - 35. About 3 weeks ago I switched to EOD just to see if I could get my E down a bit. Subjectively I feel no different. My only complaint has been some acne on my forehead since starting T-Cyp. So far the acne is still there, but seems to be getting better. I haven't had to use any acne meds since switching to EOD.
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