Maximus: Oral TRT+ (native T + enclomiphene + pregnenolone)

[madman]

Today we’re excited to announce a breakthrough in men’s hormone optimization: Maximus' Oral TRT+ Protocol. Testosterone, without injections or messy creams, all while maintaining fertility markers.

Timestamps:

0:00 - 0:09 - Introduction
0:10 - 3:54 - What is Maximus Oral TRT+?
3:55 - 4:44 - Maximus' Clinical Study Results & Findings
4:45 - 8:09 - Benefits Of Oral TRT+
8:10 - 9:54 - Getting Started On Oral TRT+
9:55 - 10:36 - Is Oral TRT+ Liver & Kidney Safe?
10:37 - 11:41 - How is Oral TRT+ Safe on Fertility Markers?
11:42 - 15:53 - Oral TRT+ Vs Injectable TRT
15:54 - 17:04 - How long does it take Oral TRT+ to start working?
17:05 - 18:18 - Do I need to donate blood on Oral TRT+?
18:19 - 19:37 - Will Oral TRT+ Give me Gynecomastia?
19:38 - Why This Is A Game-changer in mens TRT.

• 00:00 Overview of Maximus Oral TRT+ Protocol
  • Introduction to Maximus Oral TRT+ Protocol, a combination of oral native testosterone and enamine.
  • Explanation of native testosterone and its distinction from testosterone esters used in traditional TRT.
  • Description of enamine as a selective estrogen receptor modulator (SERM) and its benefits in increasing testosterone levels without the side effects of other medications.
• 02:18 Synergy and Benefits of Maximus Oral TRT+ Protocol
  • Explanation of the synergy between native testosterone and enamine in mitigating the suppression of LH and FSH levels.
  • Benefits of the protocol include significant increases in testosterone levels, improvements in energy, mood, sexual functioning, body composition, and recovery.
  • Clinical trial results showing multiple-fold increases in testosterone levels and improvements in various aspects of well-being for participants.
• 04:55 Side Effects and Management
  • Discussion on rare and mild side effects, including increased DHT levels and potential hair loss or acne exacerbation.
  • Introduction of dutasteride as a solution for managing DHT-related side effects.
  • Offer of oral dutasteride as an adjunct to the Maximus Oral TRT+ Protocol.
• 08:21 Process for Getting Started
  • Explanation of the process for starting the protocol, including filling out an online assessment, receiving an at-home blood test kit, and consultation with a doctor.
  • Overview of ongoing monitoring and support provided by the clinical care team.
  • Assurance of safety regarding liver, kidney, and testicular function, with explanations supported by research studies.
• 10:38 Frequently Asked Questions
  • Addressing common questions about the protocol, including its effects on liver and kidney function, testicular function, and fertility.
  • Explanation of why the protocol is considered superior to traditional TRT in terms of convenience, hormonal balance, and long-term health considerations.
  • Reassurance regarding the low likelihood of side effects such as polycythemia and gynecomastia with the Maximus Oral TRT+ Protocol.

 

[madman]

https://www.maximustribe.com/testosterone/testosterone-replacement-therapy

 

[FunkOdyssey]

Wtf is "native testosterone"?

 

[Systemlord]

I’m unable to believe the claim that oral testosterone together with enclomiphene is able to maintain LH and FSH levels while preventing the HPTA axis from being shutdown.

 

[DixieWrecked]

I’m unable to believe the claim that oral testosterone together with enclomiphene is able to maintain LH and FSH levels while preventing the HPTA axis from being shutdown.

I actually believe we are going in the right direction here. People are digging up old research and applying it today. I've seen people using proviron, anavar and even halotestin to improve their natural hormone profiles or at a minimum being "on" and not shutdown at the same time.

 

[DixieWrecked]

I'd like to follow up on my previous post with a disclaimer. I'm not saying those compounds I mentioned have a place in TRT. I was just just mentioning that people are apparently utilizing them without getting shutdown. From my limited research it seems clomid is making a comeback as well. At least according to Dr Mark Gordon.

 

[Cataceous]

I'm curious what changed their minds to now consider enclomiphene a viable component of the protocol. They were looking for alternatives after the FDA declined to add it to the 503A Bulks List. Maybe they are emboldened by Empower Pharmacy's continued production?

Overall they give the sense of knowing what they're doing. I wonder what the cost of treatment is?

Wtf is "native testosterone"?

They just mean testosterone without an ester attached. That's a small low point in the video where he refers to esterified testosterone as "Franken-molecules". That's unnecessary fear-mongering.

 

[madman]

I'm curious what changed their minds to now consider enclomiphene a viable component of the protocol. They were looking for alternatives after the FDA declined to add it to the 503A Bulks List. Maybe they are emboldened by Empower Pharmacy's continued production?

Overall they give the sense of knowing what they're doing. I wonder what the cost of treatment is?

They just mean testosterone without an ester attached. That's a small low point in the video where he refers to esterified testosterone as "Franken-molecules". That's unnecessary fear-mongering.

​

What is the cost and what’s included?​

The treatment cost for the Testosterone Replacement Protocol is is dependent on whether you're subscribing monthly, quarterly, or annually and whether your subscribe to our Building Blocks Supplement. It includes doctor consultation and medication (if qualified).

Baseline and follow-up lab kits are required in month 1 ($149.99), month 2 ($99.99), and month 3 ($149.99).

The baseline lab charge occurs when you submit your payment information during your onboarding medical questionnaire (month 1).

The follow-up lab charges occur when you submit your payment information during your follow-up medical questionnaires in months 2 and 3, respectively.

Additional labs may be required by your doctor for ongoing treatment, otherwise annually thereafter.

 

[madman]

Wtf is "native testosterone"?

Unmodified T!

Oral native testosterone

Abstract Context: There is no licensed oral Native Testosterone (NT) because of challenges in the formulation. Licensed oral formulations of the ester, testosterone undecanoate (TU), require a meal for absorption and generate supraphysiological dihydrotestosterone (DHT) levels. Objective: To...

www.excelmale.com

 

[madman]

I’m unable to believe the claim that oral testosterone together with enclomiphene is able to maintain LH and FSH levels while preventing the HPTA axis from being shutdown.

From my understanding they are only dosing the oral T once daily.

How do I take this medication?​

To ensure optimal absorption of the oral testosterone, it should be taken with a meal or source that includes at least 30 grams of fat. This aids in maximizing the efficacy of the medication. Alongside the oral testosterone, you should take Enclomiphene/Pregnenolone sublingually, which means placing it under your tongue for absorption. It's recommended to take both the oral testosterone and Enclomiphene/Pregnenolone at roughly the same time for the best results.

 

[madman]

I actually believe we are going in the right direction here. People are digging up old research and applying it today. I've seen people using proviron, anavar and even halotestin to improve their natural hormone profiles or at a minimum being "on" and not shutdown at the same time.

Mesterolone sensible doses would have the least impact.

Other than Natesto all forms of exogenous T let alone AAS will have a strong impact on suppression of endogenous T/hpta.

HRT doses of T let alone the doses used when abusing T/AAS for the sole purpose of muscle/strength gains.




Side Effects (Testosterone Suppression):


Proviron (mesterolone)

Mesterolone has a very weak suppressive effect on gonadotropins and serum testosterone. Studies show that when given in moderate doses (150 mg per day or less), significant suppression of testosterone levels does not occur.574 In studies with higher doses (300 mg per day and above), the agent strongly suppressed serum testosterone.575




Anavar (oxandrolone)

All anabolic/androgenic steroids when taken in doses sufficient to promote muscle gain are expected to suppress endogenous testosterone production. Oxandrolone is no exception. In the above-cited study on HIV+ males, twelve weeks of 20 mg or 40 mg per day caused an approximate 45% reduction in serum testosterone levels. The group taking 80 mg noticed a 66% decrease in testosterone. Similar trends of decrease were noticed in LH production, with the 20 mg and 40 mg doses causing a 25-30% reduction, and the 80 mg group noticing a decline of more than 50%. Additionally,studies on boys with constitutionally delayed puberty have demonstrated significant suppression of endogenous LH and testosterone with as little as 2.5 mg per day.410 Without the intervention of testosterone stimulating substances,testosterone levels should return to normal within 1-4 months of drug secession. Note that prolonged hypogonadotrophic hypogonadism can develop secondary to steroid abuse,necessitating medical intervention.




Halotestin (fluoxymesterone)

Studies administering 10 mg, 20 mg, or 30 mg off fluoxymesterone to nine healthy male subjects for up to 12 weeks have demonstrated the strong suppression of endogenous testosterone levels, with inconsistent effects on gonadotropin levels. Although not fully understood,fluoxymesterone is proposed to have a direct suppressive effect on testicular steroidogenesis that is not mediated by the suppression gonadotropins.514

 

[madman]

Maximus' Clinical Study Results & Findings

• S.C. Sepah et al. "Maximus’ Oral TRT Plus Protocol: A Highly Efficacious and Non-Suppressive Approach to Significantly Enhance Testosterone and Quality of Life in Hypogonadal and Eugonadal Men." Unpublished manuscript, 2024.

*With optimized dosing of the Oral TRT+ protocol, total testosterone levels in both eugonadal and hypogonadal men increased fourfold and free testosterone fivefold (both p < 0.025), surpassing the 99th percentile for both measurements in all participants. Meanwhile, LH and FSH levels remained within normal ranges across all participants (p < 0.025), demonstrating the treatment's ability to preserve fertility markers irrespective of the increased testosterone dosing. Estrogen levels significantly decreased but stayed within normal limits. Subjective health measures improved notably; over 70% of participants reported enhanced energy, strength/endurance, improved work performance, and quality of life according to qADAM scores, with significant reductions in anxiety and depression symptoms evidenced by 97% of participants reporting normal function (both p<0.001). Contrary to initial expectations of an increase in estrogen levels with oral TRT, our experiments showed a significant decrease, with reductions of -18.5% and -7.1% respectively, confirmed as statistically significant through left-tailed Wilcoxon tests.

https://www.maximustribe.com/testosterone/testosterone-replacement-therapy

 

[DixieWrecked]

Mesterolone sensible doses would have the least impact.

Other than Natesto all forms of exogenous T let alone AAS will have a strong impact on suppression of endogenous T/hpta.

HRT doses of T let alone the doses used when abusing T/AAS for the sole purpose of muscle/strength gains.




Side Effects (Testosterone Suppression):


Proviron (mesterolone)

Mesterolone has a very weak suppressive effect on gonadotropins and serum testosterone. Studies show that when given in moderate doses (150 mg per day or less), significant suppression of testosterone levels does not occur.574 In studies with higher doses (300 mg per day and above), the agent strongly suppressed serum testosterone.575




Anavar (oxandrolone)

All anabolic/androgenic steroids when taken in doses sufficient to promote muscle gain are expected to suppress endogenous testosterone production. Oxandrolone is no exception. In the above-cited study on HIV+ males, twelve weeks of 20 mg or 40 mg per day caused an approximate 45% reduction in serum testosterone levels. The group taking 80 mg noticed a 66% decrease in testosterone. Similar trends of decrease were noticed in LH production, with the 20 mg and 40 mg doses causing a 25-30% reduction, and the 80 mg group noticing a decline of more than 50%. Additionally,studies on boys with constitutionally delayed puberty have demonstrated significant suppression of endogenous LH and testosterone with as little as 2.5 mg per day.410 Without the intervention of testosterone stimulating substances,testosterone levels should return to normal within 1-4 months of drug secession. Note that prolonged hypogonadotrophic hypogonadism can develop secondary to steroid abuse,necessitating medical intervention.




Halotestin (fluoxymesterone)

Studies administering 10 mg, 20 mg, or 30 mg off fluoxymesterone to nine healthy male subjects for up to 12 weeks have demonstrated the strong suppression of endogenous testosterone levels, with inconsistent effects on gonadotropin levels. Although not fully understood,fluoxymesterone is proposed to have a direct suppressive effect on testicular steroidogenesis that is not mediated by the suppression gonadotropins.514

I believe that's the study about Halo people are all excited about. It's being interpreted as a temporary reduction of testosterone while Halo is present but that gonadotropins are "unaffected" and that normal test production resumes pretty much immediately once Halo is out of the bloodstream.

This makes me wonder if HCG would have no effect while on Halo

 

[Guided_by_Voices]

I'll be very interested to see the results people get from this. If I was starting down the TRT path again this is what I would want to start with, but likely with a low dose (e.g. 10mg a few times a week) of something like Oxandrolone added in. It would be interesting to see the degree of suppression from a smaller dose than described above along with clomid/enclomiphene.

 

[granger]

Here i thought oral T has ultra low bioavailability and causes the most liver issues esp at 600mg a day im guessing they hope u absorb 1/12 of that or so?

neat but if it was me id make it all sublingual? T included

 

[docc]

Wtf is "native testosterone"?

It's native, unmodified, unesterified testosterone, just like your body makes.

It has several key advantages over testosterone undecanoate (TU) used by the Tlando, Jatenzo, & Kyzatrex:

1) It is bioidentical, so is as close to 'natural' as you can get with an exogenous TRT.
2) It can be consumed without food, unlike TU, but its absorption is enhanced by 30+g of fat.
3) It tends to absorb faster and elevate DHT less than TU.
4) They're solid tablets vs. capsules with TU that that suspend T in castor oil, so causes less GI distress (like fish burps), and can be split if you want to customize dosing.

An oral lipidic native testosterone formulation that is absorbed independent of food - PubMed

This novel oral lipidic native testosterone formulation has potential advantages over oral TU of dosing independently of food and a lower risk of supraphysiological DHT levels. Significance statement There is no licensed oral testosterone because of challenges in formulation, and the oral...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

PS I know you from the old Mind & Muscle discussion forums. We were discussing Clomid back in 2012!

 

[docc]

I’m unable to believe the claim that oral testosterone together with enclomiphene is able to maintain LH and FSH levels while preventing the HPTA axis from being shutdown.

Look at this patient's bloodwork. You ever seen a Total T> 1500 and Free T> 350 with an LH of 5.4 and FSH of 8.9? Remarkable.

The clinical trial is being published on Monday on Maximus' website.

 

[docc]

I'm curious what changed their minds to now consider enclomiphene a viable component of the protocol. They were looking for alternatives after the FDA declined to add it to the 503A Bulks List. Maybe they are emboldened by Empower Pharmacy's continued production?

Overall they give the sense of knowing what they're doing. I wonder what the cost of treatment is?

They just mean testosterone without an ester attached. That's a small low point in the video where he refers to esterified testosterone as "Franken-molecules". That's unnecessary fear-mongering.

On September 29, 2023, the FDA included enclomiphene on its 503A bulks list, which makes it clear that it is legal to compound.

Oral TRT alone starts at $149/month, and Oral TRT+ (with enclomiphene/pregnenolone) starts at $199/month, with a 12 month commitment and multivitamin purchase.

The point wasn't to fear monger but to dispel the myth that injectable testosterone is bioidentical, it is not. Native testosterone is true, bioidentical testosterone.

 

[docc]

I'll be very interested to see the results people get from this. If I was starting down the TRT path again this is what I would want to start with, but likely with a low dose (e.g. 10mg a few times a week) of something like Oxandrolone added in. It would be interesting to see the degree of suppression from a smaller dose than described above along with clomid/enclomiphene.

The results are excellent (see my post above). There's no need to add Oxandrolone, given how effective the testosterone alone is. Enclomiphene is also far superior to Clomid in having less side effects.

 

[docc]

Here i thought oral T has ultra low bioavailability and causes the most liver issues esp at 600mg a day im guessing they hope u absorb 1/12 of that or so?

neat but if it was me id make it all sublingual? T included

Bioavailability can be overridden by dose. The dosage is less relevant than the outcome: serum levels. When total testosterone can go above 1500 ng/dl (see screenshot above), it's plenty potent.

The enclomiphene/pregnenolone is sublingual. Because the oral testosterone need hundreds of mg, it requires a specially formualted tablet to get absorbed by the lymphatic system. Thus, it bypasses first pass liver metabolism and does not elevate liver markers significantly.