Is there any reason someone would NEED hcg on a trt program?

[aceox]

I have been trying to include it and notice some clear benefits like improved libido, mood, mental clarity, etc. But it makes my E2 skyrocket and some softer erections. Is there a reason someone would NEED hcg on a protocol and couldn't get those benefits and dialed in otherwise on T alone? Is it worth using if I need to include anastrozole? Libido and erections are my biggest struggles on TRT btw.

 

[Systemlord]

Is there a reason someone would NEED hcg on a protocol and couldn't get those benefits and dialed in otherwise on T alone?

Some guys get ejaculation problems after TRT is initiated and testicle pain, HCG can correct these issues. It doesn't sound like HCG is working out for you, maybe the protocol isn't appropriate, but from the sound of it your TRT protocol probably isn't yet dialed in.

I suggest you detail your current protocol and post your most recent labs.

HCG plus TRT to Prevent / Reverse Testicular Shrinkage and Decreased Fertility

When Testosterone Doesn’t Lead to Better Erections

 

[aceox]

Some guys get ejaculation problems after TRT is initiated and testicle pain, HCG can correct these issues. It doesn't sound like HCG is working out for you, maybe the protocol isn't appropriate, but from the sound of it your TRT protocol probably isn't yet dialed in.

I suggest you detail your current protocol and post your most recent labs.

HCG plus TRT to Prevent / Reverse Testicular Shrinkage and Decreased Fertility

When Testosterone Doesn’t Lead to Better Erections

I'm most certainly not dialed in yet. I've been trying different protocols for years. I didn't have pain and I don't think I had ejaculation problems, I started HCG because I was told most guys do better with it. I feel like I have some benefits like much increased penis sensitivity but not sure if it's worth it.

My current protocol is 70mg Cyp and 400iu HCG twice per week. Last labs had my total T 1097, e2 68, shbg 34.5.

 

[slicktop]

I'm going to sound like a broken record here, but I'll do it anyways...
There's much debate on this forum regarding E2 levels and what they need to be based on regarding different metrics... E2:SHBG vs E2:total T being the main two "camps". There's plenty of men on here that do just fine in one camp but not the other, and I personally would prefer we don't attack each other for finding what works best for each of each us. I absolutely do NOT feel good maintaining my E2 via the total T ÷ E2 ratio. I've tried it, I don't get used to it, I'm not doing it anymore, period. Whether there's current scientific evidence supporting it or not, I do best to keep my E2 around my SHBG level. I take HCG as well and will continue to do so for all the offered benefits, and don't mind having to control E2 a little bit as a "side effect". Having gone to daily T shots has dropped my aromatization significantly, and I now only take maybe .25mg of anastrazole once every week or two these days.

 

[AdamYoung]

I personally feel that if ur testosterone is in optimal level, then Estrogen should not matter provided its in optimal level(not low). Did u guys know transgender has no issue getting an erection even though they take estrogen hormones. So if ur erection is soft inspite of high testosterone, then its something else. Check ur cholestrol n blood circulation.

 

[AdamYoung]

Btw, HCG doesnt restore fertility. Its traditionally used by athletes to not to shrink their testicles while doing steroids so that they wont get caught.

 

[Systemlord]

I'm most certainly not dialed in yet. I've been trying different protocols for years. I didn't have pain and I don't think I had ejaculation problems, I started HCG because I was told most guys do better with it. I feel like I have some benefits like much increased penis sensitivity but not sure if it's worth it.

My current protocol is 70mg Cyp and 400iu HCG twice per week. Last labs had my total T 1097, e2 68, shbg 34.5.

There are some guys that just don't do well with E2 <35 regardless of their Total T and Free T levels. I do very well with E2 35> and Total T 400-500. I have tried a Total T 829 and E2 at 70 and just feel like garbage. My penils sensitivity is higher when I drop my dosage down.

I see a particular group of men unable to lower their dosage enough because they are afraid to do so, have you tried to significantly lowering your dosage?

It may also be your erections issues aren't hormonal related, you are allowed to have other undiagnosed medical problems. Thyroid hormones are important, testosterone is metabolized in the liver and thyroid hormones (Free T3) drives metabolism of every organ in the body.

You need cortisol to drive thyroid hormones into cells and for TRT to work. A lot of guys never get a complete workup by their doc and spend years struggling.

 

[AdamYoung]

There are some guys that just don't do well with E2 <35 regardless of their Total T and Free T levels. I do very well with E2 35> and Total T 400-500. I have tried a Total T 829 and E2 at 70 and just feel like garbage. My penils sensitivity is higher when I drop my dosage down.

I see a particular group of men unable to lower their dosage enough because they are afraid to do so, have you tried to significantly lowering your dosage?

It may also be your erections issues aren't hormonal related, you are allowed to have other undiagnosed medical problems. Thyroid hormones are important, testosterone is metabolized in the liver and thyroid hormones (Free T3) drives metabolism of every organ in the body.

You need cortisol to drive thyroid hormones into cells and for TRT to work. A lot of guys never get a complete workup by their doc and spend years struggling.

Check Free T3, T4, TSH, IGF-1, GH, LDL, Tryglycerides, blood pressure, HbA1c

 

[aceox]

There are some guys that just don't do well with E2 <35 regardless of their Total T and Free T levels. I do very well with E2 35> and Total T 400-500. I have tried a Total T 829 and E2 at 70 and just feel like garbage. My penils sensitivity is higher when I drop my dosage down.

I see a particular group of men unable to lower their dosage enough because they are afraid to do so, have you tried to significantly lowering your dosage?

It may also be your erections issues aren't hormonal related, you are allowed to have other undiagnosed medical problems. Thyroid hormones are important, testosterone is metabolized in the liver and thyroid hormones (Free T3) drives metabolism of every organ in the body.

You need cortisol to drive thyroid hormones into cells and for TRT to work. A lot of guys never get a complete workup by their doc and spend years struggling.

I felt decent on TRT at lower doses when I first started. It was recommended to increase when I went to a clinic.

Upon increasing, I needed to use exemestane to control estrogen. Ended up crashing and feeling pretty bad.

I developed some pretty severe digestive issues at one point that lasted almost 2 years. During that time, I tried returning to those lower doses, and felt pretty bad. Dead dick, no libido, etc. However, I can't say for sure that the digestive issues weren't the cause.

I have since been cured of these issues and haven't attempted lower doses since. I was considering going back to 50mg twice per week but am nervous about dropping and experiencing symptoms I had when my dose was too low, like a lack of penis sensitivity and my penis not really hanging full at rest.

My thyroid came back totally optimal on my most recent blood test, free t3 looked great, rt3 was normal, etc.

 

[aceox]

Check Free T3, T4, TSH, IGF-1, GH, LDL, Tryglycerides, blood pressure, HbA1c

Yeah these are all great. Hence my confusion.

 

[Cataceous]

I personally feel that if ur testosterone is in optimal level, then Estrogen should not matter provided its in optimal level(not low). ...

Btw, HCG doesnt restore fertility. ...

Problems with both of these statements. Estradiol might correctly follow testosterone in the absence of hCG, but hCG acutely stimulates intratesticular aromatization, throwing off the balance for many men. hCG use maintains fertility for many, though not all men.

 

[AdamYoung]

Increase in libido should get u a proper erection provided all ur hormones are right. If not, something to do with circulation, venous leak or porn induced.

 

[Systemlord]

I felt decent on TRT at lower doses when I first started. It was recommended to increase when I went to a clinic.

Upon increasing, I needed to use exemestane to control estrogen. Ended up crashing and feeling pretty bad.

I developed some pretty severe digestive issues at one point that lasted almost 2 years. During that time, I tried returning to those lower doses, and felt pretty bad. Dead dick, no libido, etc. However, I can't say for sure that the digestive issues weren't the cause.

I have since been cured of these issues and haven't attempted lower doses since. I was considering going back to 50mg twice per week but am nervous about dropping and experiencing symptoms I had when my dose was too low, like a lack of penis sensitivity and my penis not really hanging full at rest.

My thyroid came back totally optimal on my most recent blood test, free t3 looked great, rt3 was normal, etc.

It seems like your issues are related to injection frequency which is spiking estrogen, one way to deal with that is smaller more frequent doses which will decrease estrogen and keep testosterone higher effectively changing T/E2 ratios.

I personally feel that if ur testosterone is in optimal level, then Estrogen should not matter

Oh but it does matter for men who are sensitive to estrogen, too much and it throws your body off balance. Too much or too little estrogen wrecks sensitivity for me.

 

[S1W]

Just to add to the discussion, daily injections did not lower E2 for me.

Full disclosure: I did just take my weekly total dose from E3.5D and divide it by 7...and I'm aware many guys say you need to lower overall weekly dose with dailies.

Regardless, after 2 months, TT was as low as it had ever been on any protocol and E2 was higher (by a lot) than it had ever been on any protocol.

I felt like I did feel different with the lower T levels, and not for the better, so not sure lowering total weekly dose on dailies would have worked out any better and it might have been worse.

The only thing dailies seemed to help with was lowering HCT. Just my n=1 experience.

As to the original question - I dropped HCG a long time ago and feel better without it.

 

[DixieWrecked]

Did u guys know transgender has no issue getting an erection even though they take estrogen hormones.

How the hell did you come up with this claim?

Btw, HCG doesnt restore fertility. Its traditionally used by athletes to not to shrink their testicles while doing steroids so that they wont get caught.

This is complete BS. Drug tests are either urine or blood analysis. Not manual testicle inspections.

 

[AdamYoung]

How the hell did you come up with this claim?


This is complete BS. Drug tests are either urine or blood analysis. Not manual testicle inspections.

I know a transgender who is taking daily estrogen and i cant tell u how i know her erections are rock hard.
Yes, I agree they wont do physical for all the athletes but athletes dont want to take a risk. Otherwise there is no reason to take HCG. Its only purpose is to keep ur leydig cells working n keep ur testicles full. I havent seen anyone who is on TRT+HCG and still have normal sperm count. If they want to catch athletes, there are so many options.

 

[antelopers]

Btw, HCG doesnt restore fertility. Its traditionally used by athletes to not to shrink their testicles while doing steroids so that they wont get caught.

Wait, do you think that they check athletes' testicle size?

 

[AdamYoung]

Wait, do you think that they check athletes' testicle size?

Ya i read in some articles that they scan whole body and if they get suspicious then they do physical like lung size, heart size n stuff like that.

 

[DixieWrecked]

@AdamYoung you have quite the imagination. Nothing you are writing is making one sliver of sense. From your personal trasngender erection study to your theories on PEDs in sports.

 

[DixieWrecked]

Wait, do you think that they check athletes' testicle size?

Bro this is cracking me up. I am imagining some inspector checking the size of men's genitals and disqualifying them based on size. Sounds like a comedy sketch.