Is there any possible scenario where exogenous test LOWERS e?

[krm]

Hi all, my endo recently made a statement that I believe to be completely untrue, but I need some "proof".
What he said was - "your low E" (pre-TRT and with my initial protocol I had levels that were BELOW what the lab can even measure) "is because you're getting too much test, and that's why we should lower the dose.

Is there ANY possible scenario where this would make sense?

My understanding was: More test => more E?

Studies or anything "scientific" to solidify the argument would be welcome... Thanks!

 

[Vince Carter]

Barring youre the unicorn in how you respond, No.

 

[Airborne Warrior]

Most endo's, and doctors for that matter assume the average joe is totally clueless in regards to their speciality (they're usually correct). The internet has closed that gap a little. A bit like I suppose when the bible first became available in English for the average joe to read and make his own assumptions. This has it's own pitfalls as some people now think they are experts from reading up on the internet and will self diagnose and self treat which can lead to complications, though it also has benefits in that people are generally more clued up and won't be blindly led by those who perform bad practice and give bad advice. We see it often on this forum with those requiring help being told a load of bollox or given bad treatment by their endo's. The likes of Vince, madman, Nelson, etc have no doubt helped hundreds (if not thousands) find a protocol that works and makes their lives so much better.

 

[Vince]

Did you have the right estrogen test, the sensitive test for men? Sensitive LC/MS/MS test. Can you post your results.

 

[lowe2sucks]

it's possible for some... i've seen some threads where guys state their e2 was lower on trt with high T than pre trt

 

[Vince]

it's possible for some... i've seen some threads where guys state their e2 was lower on trt with high T than pre trt

I would like to see the threads or at least the labs. Possible that it was a messed up lab that needed to be redone.

My dad once had labs, that told him he had cancer. He just laughed and said the labs were done wrong. Which they were, done wrong.

 

[Nelson Vergel]

0.2-0.4 % of testosterone gets aromatized to estradiol. The more T, the more E2. Easy fact.

 

[lowe2sucks]

High T/E2 ratio equals low estradiol symptoms
there is also one thread that I can't find where member of this forum started on trt cypionate and dhea hes tt was in 1000s and e2 sinlge digit while before trt his t were half of that on trt but e2 at least twice as much.. can't find that thread for some reason
when I was doing twice as trt dose of test (or it could be 600mg) my e2 was only 36.. on 75 propionate every other day it was 70-80 on ultrasensitive test you can even find my thread where I posted that bloodwork. so it's not always linear increase T > e2 even though that's how we belive things work.. I don't know why but I think some have low aromatise activity and get a lot of dht from high doses which antagonize estrogen at receptor level(if you don't belive this google it thats why dht gel works for gynecomastia)

 

[krm]

Did you have the right estrogen test, the sensitive test for men? Sensitive LC/MS/MS test. Can you post your results.

Sensitive arrays are, unfortunately, not available in Switzerland.

I did a regular E2 test with a ref range of 41-159 pmol/l.
My last 5 measurements, taken across roughly 2 months, came out as:

<18 (below threshold)
<18 (below threshold)
<18 (below threshold)
<18 (below threshold)
31 (below reference range).

These were all with T levels (free and total) below the reference range, and SHBG in the very upper reference range.

 

[Systemlord]

Sensitive arrays are, unfortunately, not available in Switzerland.

I did a regular E2 test with a ref range of 41-159 pmol/l.
My last 5 measurements, taken across roughly 2 months, came out as:

<18 (below threshold)
<18 (below threshold)
<18 (below threshold)
<18 (below threshold)
31 (below reference range).

These were all with T levels (free and total) below the reference range, and SHBG in the very upper reference range.

Dr Crisler has another way of determining estrogen for those without proper E2 testing, I believe it's a 24 hour urine test of some kind that measures what's being excreted into the urine.