hCG and Primary Hypogonadism

[JWSimpkins]

Are there any benefits from taking hCG for someone who has primary hypogonadism (i.e. well-being, libido etc.)

 

[Gene Devine]

Absolutely.

HCG (an LH analog) attaches to receptors throughout the body including blood vessels and the brain so there is need beyond just the receptors on the testes when a man is HPTA suppressed.

Many Primary men who use HCG claim a much better sense of well-being and increased libido...there's a reason for that!!!

 

[JWSimpkins]

That's good to know Gene. Because of the LH receptors throughout the body, I assumed that there would still be benefits beyond preserving testicular size and function.

 

[Vettester Chris]

Gene hit it spot-on as usual!!

Good stack with that HCG would be B12 Methyl.

 

[Bass]

I agree with above.

 

[Chris Morrow]

Are there any benefits from taking hCG for someone who has primary hypogonadism (i.e. well-being, libido etc.)

Though HCG can work wonders. I would tend to disagree with the rest here. Generally, if you have primary hypogonadsim your LH should already be high. Thus, taking HCG wouldn't help in producing results. Now if your LH is low or normal HCG might be an option for you. This was all under the assumption you plan to use HCG only and you aren't already on TRT.

 

[paco]

Though HCG can work wonders. I would tend to disagree with the rest here. Generally, if you have primary hypogonadsim your LH should already be high. Thus, taking HCG wouldn't help in producing results. Now if your LH is low or normal HCG might be an option for you. This was all under the assumption you plan to use HCG only and you aren't already on TRT.

For someone who is primary and is not on testosterone replacement therapy, the above in bold would be true. However, I would presume that anyone on TRT (including primary or secondary hypogonadal men) would have very low LH due to the HTPA suppression caused by administration of exogenous testosterone. Someone jump in if I don't have this right. : )

 

[Gene Devine]

For someone who is primary and is not on testosterone replacement therapy, the above in bold would be true. However, I would presume that anyone on TRT (including primary or secondary hypogonadal men) would have very low LH due to the HTPA suppression caused by administration of exogenous testosterone. Someone jump in if I don't have this right. : )

^^^^This is totally correct.

 

[Nelson Vergel]

I agree with Paco. Once you have optimum amounts of testosterone in your blood after starting testosterone treatment due to a diagnosis of primary or secondary hypogonadism, HCG is valuable to keep Leydig cells full and intratesticular testosterone production adequate for sperm production even in the absence of FSH. When everyone starts TRT their LH and FSH production shut down. We know FSH is important for sperm production. But what was interesting from Dr Lipshultz's study is that even in the absence of FSH, the LH mimicking effects of HCG can sustain fertility while used with TRT (gels and injections were used in the study). It seems that as long as intratesticular testosterone is good (which LH can accomplish), then sperm production is not impaired even in the absence of FSH. One day mainstream medicine will pick on this new fact and make the addition of HCG part of current guidelines for the treatment of hypogonadism. I am trying to get an interview set up with the head of important guidelines (Dr Bhasin) to see what he thinks about this. We are also approaching Dr Shippen now for an interview on the subject.

More on this study on this link: https://www.excelmale.com/forum/thr...se-Testicular-Shrinkage-and-Improve-Sex-Drive

 

[Pacman]

But what about in the case of primary hypogonadism accompanied with azoospermia, and both LH + FSH levels are both HIGH even after 14 months of TRT? Is there any benefit whatsoever for someone in that situation (i.e. me)?

 

[Vince]

Pacman I guess that would mean your testosterone levels are too low

 

[HarryCat]

Pacman I guess that would mean your testosterone levels are too low

From my understanding (could be wrong) the goal of TRT is not to increase T levels until your LH and FSH levels get to zero, it's to increase your T levels until you feel well. I've seen several studies where guys who are primary still have significant levels of LH and FSH after being on TRT. Sometimes their levels are still above the maximum reference range for those hormones.
IMO, if you have your T levels in a range where you feel good and your LH and FSH labs are still within normal range there would be no additional benefit (and a significant cost $$) to adding HCG. Your LH receptors are being stimulated by your naturally produced LH.
But everyone reacts differently, so you could do a trial run of HCG for a couple of months and see if you feel a subjective benefit.

 

[Pacman]

From my understanding (could be wrong) the goal of TRT is not to increase T levels until your LH and FSH levels get to zero, it's to increase your T levels until you feel well. I've seen several studies where guys who are primary still have significant levels of LH and FSH after being on TRT. Sometimes their levels are still above the maximum reference range for those hormones.
IMO, if you have your T levels in a range where you feel good and your LH and FSH labs are still within normal range there would be no additional benefit (and a significant cost $$) to adding HCG. Your LH receptors are being stimulated by your naturally produced LH.
But everyone reacts differently, so you could do a trial run of HCG for a couple of months and see if you feel a subjective benefit.

Do you remember where you read those studies? Can you link some of them here? I would love to read them!! Thank you!!

 

[HarryCat]

Do you remember where you read those studies? Can you link some of them here? I would love to read them!! Thank you!!

I linked to one here: Is HCG necessary for guys with primary hypogonadism?

But remember all I'm suggesting is that not every guy who is primary will benefit from HCG if their LH levels are still normal after achieving an optimum (for that individual) dose of testosterone.

 

[Vince]

this what Nelson said

I agree. They undertreated many of them (the ones getting 250 every 4 weeks) and that is why LH and FSH levels are still not suppressed like we see them with optimum replacement doses. They also saw that the lower their FSH and LH at baseline, the higher the total testosterone level achieved on TRT (no brainer).

 

[PAUL-E]

I just wanted to post an idea on this topic from my experience. I was thinking those of use with primary hypogonadism would do better with lower more frequent dosing of HCG my thinking is as we are primary hypogonadism our testicles are unable to produce that much testosterone and with higher doses of HCG that would lead to excessive estrogen production (we be more vulnerable to excessive inner testicular atomization). what do you guys think?