Feeling pretty sick following this mornings shots ...

[Flexedup]

Gents,

I finally took the leap for TRT about 5 weeks ago with 100mg to testosterone cypionate split into 3 doses per week, 350iu hcg and .125mg Arimidex 3 times per week. I'm prescribed 132mg per week but I started low.

Everything was going great. Began dieting and excersise to restrict BP and water retention. Dropped all sugar and bad carbs and went on a heavy cut which worked and made me feel wonderful.

I had to travel overseas and missed my meds, testosterone, hcg and arimidex. The following morning I tried to follow Nelson's 1 syringe combination of HCG and testosterone to really save on those pokes and be a bit more efficient but I ended up taking the HCG on my right delt and increased the testosterone about 8mg in order to titrate up to where im prescribed and oh my god.

I feel flu like symptoms, body aches, 100BPM, BP is 138/67, took hydrating solution, crazy throbbing headache and just feel sick.

I'm in a good mindset and I always learn from these mistakes but prior to today, everything was a blessing and now need to know the likely cause to make sure I never get here again.

Could increasing the T dose ever so slightly make yiu sick? Do you take HCG in the mornings or nights of you T shot or it has its own day? What is a good injection schedule?

 

[Phil Goodman]

1.) this is a perfect example of why we always recommend that users start out with and only change one variable at a time. Your body is still settling in to a new baseline for testosterone, and it takes five half-lives to reach a steady state(around five weeks for cypionate). It is much different for both HCG and arimidex… which brings me to the second point

2.) you almost certainly don’t need an AI, and even if you are the super rare person that does, you still shouldn’t start out with it. I’m not a doctor but fwiw I would strongly recommend dropping that from your protocol. You should probably also hold off on the HCG for now and revisit in a few weeks or months once you get settled in on testosterone.

3.) as mentioned above, it takes about five weeks to hit a steady state on cypionate. So your levels have been trending upward this whole time and are higher now than they’ve been at any other time up to this point. It’s possible you’ve overshot the mark, but even if you haven’t you’re still at the point where your body is adapting to new levels… and that results in both good and bad things. This is the time when you’re probably most likely to experience mild to moderate anxiety and possible sleep disruptions, among others. The negatives will likely subside(though if they haven’t in 2-3 months you’ll likely need to lower your dose) and the positives won’t seem as shiny over time because you’ll just get used to them. For example, you’ll probably have higher energy levels, but it won’t seem like as much of a big deal because that’ll be your new daily life. Either way, as you try to settle in, you aren’t doing yourself any favors by adding in so many variables at once.

 

[Flexedup]

1.) this is a perfect example of why we always recommend that users start out with and only change one variable at a time. Your body is still settling in to a new baseline for testosterone, and it takes five half-lives to reach a steady state(around five weeks for cypionate). It is much different for both HCG and arimidex… which brings me to the second point

2.) you almost certainly don’t need an AI, and even if you are the super rare person that does, you still shouldn’t start out with it. I’m not a doctor but fwiw I would strongly recommend dropping that from your protocol. You should probably also hold off on the HCG for now and revisit in a few weeks or months once you get settled in on testosterone.

3.) as mentioned above, it takes about five weeks to hit a steady state on cypionate. So your levels have been trending upward this whole time and are higher now than they’ve been at any other time up to this point. It’s possible you’ve overshot the mark, but even if you haven’t you’re still at the point where your body is adapting to new levels… and that results in both good and bad things. This is the time when you’re probably most likely to experience mild to moderate anxiety and possible sleep disruptions, among others. The negatives will likely subside(though if they haven’t in 2-3 months you’ll likely need to lower your dose) and the positives won’t seem as shiny over time because you’ll just get used to them. For example, you’ll probably have higher energy levels, but it won’t seem like as much of a big deal because that’ll be your new daily life. Either way, as you try to settle in, you aren’t doing yourself any favors by adding in so many variables at once.

Hi Phil,

Appreciate the thorough feedback and insights. I want to preface this by saying in no way was I being irresponsible and after seeking the advice of two very prominent doctors in the TRT who recommended between 130-150mgs of T per week as a start, I still chose to start with 100mg/wk and titrate up.

Also, both recommended Arimidex as I weigh 280lbs and my sensitive E2 before starting was at 32 which is 3 points higher that the top range. I think ill work my way down and stick it through, this phenomena is crazy and no matter how much I researched online about test flu seems to be very anecdotal.

 

[Guided_by_Voices]

I agree with Phil. Also, in many years of observing the hormone space, AIs seem to be the single highest risk for causing major hard-to-resolve issues, so doing other things, like splitting dosages, adjusting dosages, changing ester/formulation, and using other things that have a mild AI affect are all prudent to try first. Also, my understanding is that genetics are a much bigger factor than body composition regarding who will tend to over-aromatize.

 

[Systemlord]

42 days to reach steady state, not five weeks.

 

[FunkOdyssey]

Hi Phil,

Appreciate the thorough feedback and insights. I want to preface this by saying in no way was I being irresponsible and after seeking the advice of two very prominent doctors in the TRT who recommended between 130-150mgs of T per week as a start, I still chose to start with 100mg/wk and titrate up.

Also, both recommended Arimidex as I weigh 280lbs and my sensitive E2 before starting was at 32 which is 3 points higher that the top range. I think ill work my way down and stick it through, this phenomena is crazy and no matter how much I researched online about test flu seems to be very anecdotal.

I concur with the others: I would restart with T alone, no hCG, no AI. The prominence of the doctors you consulted with, and your weight, are immaterial with regard to how you should approach this to optimize your chances of success and health outcomes.

The difficulty of dialing in rises in direct proportion to the complexity of the protocol. If you can't handle your prescribed dose of T without the AI, the wisest response would be to take a lower dose until you improve your body composition and metabolic health such that you can handle more. Let the promise of more testosterone be one of the carrots that motivates your efforts.

Required video content for men starting TRT and considering AIs:

 

[Flexedup]

I concur with the others: I would restart with T alone, no hCG, no AI. The prominence of the doctors you consulted with, and your weight, are immaterial with regard to how you should approach this to optimize your chances of success and health outcomes.

The difficulty of dialing in rises in direct proportion to the complexity of the protocol. If you can't handle your prescribed dose of T without the AI, the wisest response would be to take a lower dose until you improve your body composition and metabolic health such that you can handle more. Let the promise of more testosterone be one of the carrots that motivates your efforts.

Required video content for men starting TRT and considering AIs:

Thank you, sir. Great advice and the symptoms have passed butafter dropping the AI, I got intense insomnia. I know this is a process and I have to be patient.