Clomid with high shbg

[cigpk]

I am curious if there is any way to have long term success on Clomid despite being prone to high SHBG. I have always been over the range, my SHBG was at 60 (15-55) even on injections.

I tried a Clomid restart and it shot my SHBG up to 90 (15-55).

So after 4 months on Clomid, my total t was at 720 but my free t was 11 (9-26) and my estrogen never got above 16 (8-35) so I had all of the low e2 symptoms and low T symptoms on Clomid.

After I came off clomid, I had bloods at 6 weeks and my T had dropped to 473 and free t was down to 6 (9-26) and e2 around 14.

So essentially, the Clomid restart didn’t work and I continued to feel worse until I restarted injections.

Is there any way to have success on Clomid if you are prone to high SHBG?

 

[cigpk]

Also, that was with 12.5 mg eod Clomid. So yeah, lower Clomid dose prob wouldn’t have helped I’d assume

 

[acslater55]

I am curious if there is any way to have long term success on Clomid despite being prone to high SHBG. I have always been over the range, my SHBG was at 60 (15-55) even on injections.

I tried a Clomid restart and it shot my SHBG up to 90 (15-55).

So after 4 months on Clomid, my total t was at 720 but my free t was 11 (9-26) and my estrogen never got above 16 (8-35) so I had all of the low e2 symptoms and low T symptoms on Clomid.

After I came off clomid, I had bloods at 6 weeks and my T had dropped to 473 and free t was down to 6 (9-26) and e2 around 14.

So essentially, the Clomid restart didn’t work and I continued to feel worse until I restarted injections.

Is there any way to have success on Clomid if you are prone to high SHBG?

I'm not sure. I am in the same boat. Total T 570 - 500 and SHBG around 64. Free T around 6-7. I just started taking Clomid 25 mg a day. I am 2 weeks in and I don't feel much difference yet. Maybe slight improvement in mood.

My understanding is that Clomid can raise E2 levels which will raise SHBG. I just began taking .25 mg of anastrazole to help control this. I also felt like I had some bloating. I will be doing labs at week 4 and will post them here. I wish there was a way to control SHBG! A year ago it was 32 and I felt fine. I have no idea why it shot up so quickly. It's very frustrating, especially in the libido department.

 

[acslater55]

Also, that was with 12.5 mg eod Clomid. So yeah, lower Clomid dose prob wouldn’t have helped I’d assume

You may want to get your thyroid levels checked as hyperthyroidism can raise SHBG. It's a long shot but something that you should know.

 

[cigpk]

Yeah mine has always been high (>60 even on injections which are supposed to lower it)

Clomid never raised my e2. Mine stayed around 14-17 (8-35) the entire 4 months I was on it.

 

[acslater55]

Yeah mine has always been high (>60 even on injections which are supposed to lower it)

Clomid never raised my e2. Mine stayed around 14-17 (8-35) the entire 4 months I was on it.

So here are my labs after 3 weeks on 25 mg of Clomid daily and 0.25 mg of anastrazole 1 x per week.

Baseline labs:

Total T - 495
E2 - 20.6
LH - 4.6
SHBG - 65.2
Calc Free T - 6.48

After 3 wks of Clomid:

Total T - 886
E2 - 13.4
SHBG - 97.0
Calf Free T - 9.18

My SHBG shot up 49% on this dose of Clomid. My suspicion is that it is due to the zuclomiphene portion of Clomid. I looked at the studies done on enclomiphene and there was minimal change in SHBG after 3 months of use (study below). So, for guys with high SHBG Clomid is probably a no go. I am going to let my system clear the zuclomiphene, which takes a month. Then I am going to start toremifine and exemestane. Some studies have shown that exemestane lowers SHBG and that toremifine doesn't increase SHBG. I will keep you posted.

https://www.fertstert.org/article/S0015-0282(14)00537-8/pdf

 

[cigpk]

So here are my labs after 3 weeks on 25 mg of Clomid daily and 0.25 mg of anastrazole 1 x per week.

Baseline labs:

Total T - 495
E2 - 20.6
LH - 4.6
SHBG - 65.2
Calc Free T - 6.48

After 3 wks of Clomid:

Total T - 886
E2 - 13.4
SHBG - 97.0
Calf Free T - 9.18

My SHBG shot up 49% on this dose of Clomid. My suspicion is that it is due to the zuclomiphene portion of Clomid. I looked at the studies done on enclomiphene and there was minimal change in SHBG after 3 months of use (study below). So, for guys with high SHBG Clomid is probably a no go. I am going to let my system clear the zuclomiphene, which takes a month. Then I am going to start toremifine and exemestane. Some studies have shown that exemestane lowers SHBG and that toremifine doesn't increase SHBG. I will keep you posted.

https://www.fertstert.org/article/S0015-0282(14)00537-8/pdf

What about just using enclomiphene instead? Is that not often prescribed by doctors?

 

[YBWV]

My understanding is that Clomid can raise E2 levels which will raise SHBG. I just began taking .25 mg of anastrazole to help control this. I also felt like I had some bloating. I will be doing labs at week 4 and will post them here. I wish there was a way to control SHBG! A year ago it was 32 and I felt fine. I have no idea why it shot up so quickly. It's very frustrating, especially in the libido department.

I used mesterolone (DHT analog) alongside Clomid long term and those 2 pharmaceuticals used as an adjunctive therapy worked well for me.
Usually marketed as Priviron it's not licenced in some countries - including USA.

It lowers SHBG as binds to the receptor with greater (~4x) affinity. The boost to serum DHT helps too as Clomid mono-therapy, even st low dose, can be profoundly "estrogenic".

Worth reading the pharmacokinetics though and the (conflicting) studies on the drug.
It's barely suppressive at moderate dosages and, in my experience, doesn't much affect the stimulation from the SERM - Clomid.

 

[acslater55]

What about just using enclomiphene instead? Is that not often prescribed by doctors?

I wish, but I wouldn't know where to get it, besides those site with research chemicals. I don't trust them at all. I'm so disappointed that the FDA didn't approve it, they are always looking out for us (said with sarcasm, if it wasn't obvious).

 

[acslater55]

I used mesterolone (DHT analog) alongside Clomid long term and those 2 pharmaceuticals used as an adjunctive therapy worked well for me.
Usually marketed as Priviron it's not licenced in some countries - including USA.

It lowers SHBG as binds to the receptor with greater (~4x) affinity. The boost to serum DHT helps too as Clomid mono-therapy, even st low dose, can be profoundly "estrogenic".

Worth reading the pharmacokinetics though and the (conflicting) studies on the drug.
It's barely suppressive at moderate dosages and, in my experience, doesn't much affect the stimulation from the SERM - Clomid.

I'm considering Proviron, but I would need to do more research in terms of side effects.

It's interesting that you bring up DHT, because I think the reason I feel so terrible in the libido department is from the lack of free T to convert to DHT. I saw some information last night that DHEA and pregnenolone can lower SHBG and boost DHT. May give that a try as well, but I try to do one thing at a time so I can know what works.

 

[YBWV]

I'm considering Proviron, but I would need to do more research in terms of side effects.

It's interesting that you bring up DHT, because I think the reason I feel so terrible in the libido department is from the lack of free T to convert to DHT. I saw some information last night that DHEA and pregnenolone can lower SHBG and boost DHT. May give that a try as well, but I try to do one thing at a time so I can know what works.

Be careful of adding anything to a Serm (Clomid or otherwise) that is potentially suppressive of the HPTA.

DHEA, for example, can convert to (edit) estrogens and the resultant suppression could counteract the stimulation from the Serm.

Proviron as pure methylated DHT cannot convert to E2. As it lowers SHBG it will also increase FT. For me Proviron is only minimally suppressive (of TT) at a moderate dosage.

Getting a Clomid protocol to work is an uphill struggle but perhaps worth persevering with in order to potentially avoid shutdown and compromised fertility.

 

[Cataceous]

...
DHEA, for example, can convert to E2 and the resultant suppression could counteract the stimulation from the Serm.
...

Just curious: Do you have any references for this? There are studies showing that even quite large doses of DHEA do not raise E2 in normal—non-HPTA-suppressed—men; E1 does go up a lot.

 

[Marco74]

I used mesterolone (DHT analog) alongside Clomid long term and those 2 pharmaceuticals used as an adjunctive therapy worked well for me.
Usually marketed as Priviron it's not licenced in some countries - including USA.

It lowers SHBG as binds to the receptor with greater (~4x) affinity. The boost to serum DHT helps too as Clomid mono-therapy, even st low dose, can be profoundly "estrogenic".

Worth reading the pharmacokinetics though and the (conflicting) studies on the drug.
It's barely suppressive at moderate dosages and, in my experience, doesn't much affect the stimulation from the SERM - Clomid.

I have taking Clomid with mix results. Higher total t but no real improvement symptoms. There is pharmacy grade Mesterolone available. How much of both drugs would I need to take to improve the low libido and poor energy with difficult to add muscle.

 

[YBWV]

My own dose of Clomid is ~8mg daily (1/6th of a standard 50mg tab). Mesterolone 75mg to 150mg daily - I like to keep levels in flux so vary the dose appropriately.
If improved libido is your goal then give the mesterolone time to work; you maybe need a "reset" in which neurotransmitters are at least as important as hormones.
If your protocol results in higher levels of free hormones then that may help with adding/retaining muscle subject to all the variables in genetics, training, diet and recovery.

As an aside, it might be worth looking into using enclomephene, rather than Clomid, if there is a reliable source available. There are some recent threads here on Excelmale.

 

[acslater55]

About to start, low dose exemestane 6.5 mg daily and low dose tamoxifen 10 mg EOD in about a month. I am hoping the tamoxifen doesn't raise SHBG as much as clomid did. Also hoping that the exemestane can keep the SHBG down. I will keep you all posted on my numbers.