Will I benefit more if I switch to EOD

[carkrazy]

I wanted to start another thread so not to get off topic with another thread I started. About 8 weeks ago I switched to 50mg of test every 3.5 days and feel pretty good on that protocol but feel there is room for Improvement. On this protocol I have not needed any AI’s which is one of the main reasons I switched to begin with along with more stable serum levels. My question is should I switch protocols to EOD since I had good results with every 3.5 days? Here are my labs from my 50mg of test every 3.5 days:

Testosterone: 615.9 ng/dl 264 - 916
Free Test: 17.0 pg/ml 6.8 - 21.5
estradiol: 28.6 pg/ml 8.0 - 35.0
SHGB: 17.2 nmol/L 16.5 - 55.9
PSA: 0.9 ng/ml 0.0 - 4.0
Hematocrit: 44.8 % 37.5 - 51.0

Do you guys think I would benefit any more by switching to EOD? Or should I just stay the course. I do notice a slight drop in test by injection day but it’s not as bad as 200 mg 1x per week. Will going to EOD help keep E2 even lower? Any input would be appreciated.

 

[Vince]

I would say you should switch to EOD. I'm one who believes that trying different protocols should be done, how else will you find out how good you can feel. When I first started trt I changed my protocol every 6 months. It took me about three years to get it just right.

 

[Whatzup]

I wanted to start another thread so not to get off topic with another thread I started. About 8 weeks ago I switched to 50mg of test every 3.5 days and feel pretty good on that protocol but feel there is room for Improvement. On this protocol I have not needed any AI’s which is one of the main reasons I switched to begin with along with more stable serum levels. My question is should I switch protocols to EOD since I had good results with every 3.5 days? Here are my labs from my 50mg of test every 3.5 days:

Testosterone: 615.9 ng/dl 264 - 916
Free Test: 17.0 pg/ml 6.8 - 21.5
estradiol: 28.6 pg/ml 8.0 - 35.0
SHGB: 17.2 nmol/L 16.5 - 55.9
PSA: 0.9 ng/ml 0.0 - 4.0
Hematocrit: 44.8 % 37.5 - 51.0

Do you guys think I would benefit any more by switching to EOD? Or should I just stay the course. I do notice a slight drop in test by injection day but it’s not as bad as 200 mg 1x per week. Will going to EOD help keep E2 even lower? Any input would be appreciated.

I think the results are great especially considering you have low SHBG. I just started 80 mg every 5 days and I too have low SHBG. I will get my first set of labs in 6 weeks or so. Did you get tested on injection day prior to injecting?

 

[MarkM]

Your E2 is in a healthy range but EOD would lower it a little more and put it closer to your SHBG where some low SHBG individuals, like @Vince Carter, a long time forum member, recommend. He also has low SHBG.

 

[Vince Carter]

EOD *could lower your E, just stay on 100 and divide it, round it up n around to 30mg/EOD. On your next set of labs you need to add to the LC/MS/MS test, add "Estradiol, Free". you need to see that number with your low SHBG. Ultimately your dosing needs to place your Free T at or a little above the lab range of 21.

 

[carkrazy]

EOD *could lower your E, just stay on 100 and divide it, round it up n around to 30mg/EOD. On your next set of labs you need to add to the LC/MS/MS test, add "Estradiol, Free". you need to see that number with your low SHBG. Ultimately your dosing needs to place your Free T at or a little above the lab range of 21.

What is LC/MS/MS test?

 

[carkrazy]

Thanks for the input guys!

 

[Systemlord]

What is LC/MS/MS test?

The LC/MS/MS test is the correct estrogen testing for men.

 

[Vince Carter]

What is LC/MS/MS test?

Though what you posted in post #1 with your labs, you have the correct test it just doesn't say LC/MS/MS next to what you pasted in there, we know you have the correct test because the range you showed there is 8-35 which is the LabCorp range for the Sensitive LC/MS/MS test.

 

[MarkM]

I believe there are 15 or so metabolites/hormones that can be tested with the LC.MS/MS assay. In particular reference to Estradiol (E2) be sure to ask for the Estradiol Sensitive LC/MS/MS assay whenever you need your E2 tested. As VC stated, you did have the correct test for E2 run.

LC/MS/MS = Liquid Chromatography-Tandem Mass Spectrometry. This high performance test is recommended for clinical situations in which increased sensitivity of E2 levels is appropriate, including postmenopausal women, men, children and adolescents.

 

[carkrazy]

Thanks guys. I used discountedlabs which uses the estradiol sensitive test.
Any downside to the EOD protocol like high Hematocrict issues or anything like that?

 

[Systemlord]

Thanks guys. I used discountedlabs which uses the estradiol sensitive test.
Any downside to the EOD protocol like high Hematocrit issues or anything like that?

It's likely hematocrit will be better controlled on smaller more frequent dosing. Remember naturally men produce 5-7mg of testosterone per day and we have more in our system at any given time do to injecting large doses of testosterone.

 

[MarkM]

Some have had success with more frequent injections helping lower and stabilize their hematocrit. I know one forum member, @HealthMan, dropping down to ED injections made his hematocrit go up but I think he might be an outlier.

 

[carkrazy]

Ok then, I'm going to give EOD a go at 30mg. Thanks for the input guys.

 

[carkrazy]

Oh, one more question. what syringe and gauge are you guys using for these small doses?
i currently use a 1ml easy touch luer lock syringe but i have to use a 18 gauge to draw then switch to a 25 gauge to inject. I can never get the test out of the vial with the 25 gauge.

 

[MarkM]

I am using Easy Touch 28 gauge 1/2" 0.5 ML insulin syringe with permanent needle attached for drawing and injecting.

Easy Touch 28 G 0.5 cc 1/2 in Insulin Syringes - 100 ea

 

[carkrazy]

I am using Easy Touch 28 gauge 1/2" 0.5 ML insulin syringe with permanent needle attached for drawing and injecting.

Easy Touch 28 G 0.5 cc 1/2 in Insulin Syringes - 100 ea

Thanks for the link.

 

[carkrazy]

@MarkM, I just used the syringe you recommended. What a difference man. Totally painless. Thanks again.

 

[carkrazy]

what kind of total testosterone levels could i expect injecting 30mg EOD? i was in the low 600 injecting 50mg every 3.5 days. just curious if the more frequent shots will raise my total T.

 

[Systemlord]

what kind of total testosterone levels could i expect injecting 30mg EOD? i was in the low 600 injecting 50mg every 3.5 days. just curious if the more frequent shots will raise my total T.

A 25mg EOD protocol would put me well over 900 ng/dL and I'm a low SHBG guy (16-18). If I drop the dosage down to 20mg EOD, levels drop by half. It's definitely not linear.