Anyone feels better on less frequent injections? for ex.: e7d vs e3.5d

DonaldPump2020

New Member
So I have a lot of trouble dialing in my TRT. Started gel with low T of 260 ng/dl and <5 E2 (non sensitive) , undetectable. SHBG of 23. Felt like HELL.

started androgel, felt the best i have ever felt in life after 4 days, this lasted for 1.5 weeks then I lost all my benefits and slowly became anxious, paranoid, amotivational etc again. not as bad as pre-trt but still bad.

Then tried injections. 6 weeks of subq e3.5d 60mg.
Levels: 630 ng/dl Total T, 51 pg/ml E2 (nonSensitive) felt like shit, way worse than gel.

Then went on another gel. Felt very good at first again, which didnt last too long. There were moments where I had high e2 symptoms (oily skin, acne, red flushed face, etc) but felt very good mentally.

Gel stopped working again after a few months. Started injections. I thought, hm, maybe my low shbg was the reason i did better on gel than injections. Thats why I did everyday subq 20mg injections. for 6-8 weeks.
Felt absolutely the WORST. Felt exactly like pre-trt MINUS the panic attacks.

Then switched back to e3.5d subq, 140-150mg but felt like shit again. Thought, maybe SubQ is the problem, lets to IM.

So i just finished 6 weeks of e3.5d 75mg intramuscular. Dont feel good. will get bloods tomorrow but no e2 test (which is useless anyways as i cant get sensitive).

My symptoms really match low E2. Dry skin, dry eyes (at sleep), lethargy, anhedonia, obsessive thoughts, anxiety,depression, no erections except sometimes at waking up. no libido. insensitive penis, small flaccid. thin hair.

So could it be that I could feel better at less frequent, bigger shots to get more aromatization going?

Anyone noticed they feel better on less frequent shots?
 

Cataceous

Well-Known Member
Though it's less common, we do see the occasional guy who prefers weekly injections to more frequent ones. Personally I think it's going in the wrong direction. At one time or another I've had most of the problems you describe. What's fixed things for me is trying to replicate natural hormonal conditions as closely as I can. The complexity of my protocol makes it impractical for most. But some of the basics, such as strictly physiological TRT dosing and addressing low progesterone should still be considered. Much simpler overall is if you can avoid conventional TRT and keep your HPTA functional. That's the appeal of a product like Natesto. If it works for you then you avoid many possible side effects of regular TRT.
 

madman

Super Moderator
So I have a lot of trouble dialing in my TRT. Started gel with low T of 260 ng/dl and <5 E2 (non sensitive) , undetectable. SHBG of 23. Felt like HELL.

started androgel, felt the best i have ever felt in life after 4 days, this lasted for 1.5 weeks then I lost all my benefits and slowly became anxious, paranoid, amotivational etc again. not as bad as pre-trt but still bad.

Then tried injections. 6 weeks of subq e3.5d 60mg.
Levels: 630 ng/dl Total T, 51 pg/ml E2 (nonSensitive) felt like shit, way worse than gel.

Then went on another gel. Felt very good at first again, which didnt last too long. There were moments where I had high e2 symptoms (oily skin, acne, red flushed face, etc) but felt very good mentally.

Gel stopped working again after a few months. Started injections. I thought, hm, maybe my low shbg was the reason i did better on gel than injections. Thats why I did everyday subq 20mg injections. for 6-8 weeks.
Felt absolutely the WORST. Felt exactly like pre-trt MINUS the panic attacks.

Then switched back to e3.5d subq, 140-150mg but felt like shit again. Thought, maybe SubQ is the problem, lets to IM.

So i just finished 6 weeks of e3.5d 75mg intramuscular. Dont feel good. will get bloods tomorrow but no e2 test (which is useless anyways as i cant get sensitive).

My symptoms really match low E2. Dry skin, dry eyes (at sleep), lethargy, anhedonia, obsessive thoughts, anxiety,depression, no erections except sometimes at waking up. no libido. insensitive penis, small flaccid. thin hair.

So could it be that I could feel better at less frequent, bigger shots to get more aromatization going?

Anyone noticed they feel better on less frequent shots?
So I have a lot of trouble dialing in my TRT. Started gel with low T of 260 ng/dl and <5 E2 (non sensitive) , undetectable. SHBG of 23. Felt like HELL.

started androgel, felt the best i have ever felt in life after 4 days, this lasted for 1.5 weeks then I lost all my benefits and slowly became anxious, paranoid, amotivational etc again. not as bad as pre-trt but still bad.


How long did you stay on the protocol before bailing and where did your TT/FT/e2 levels sit?

Post labs?


Then tried injections. 6 weeks of subq e3.5d 60mg.
Levels: 630 ng/dl Total T, 51 pg/ml E2 (nonSensitive) felt like shit, way worse than gel.

Although your trough TT 630 ng/dL is far from absurdly high seeing as your SHBG is lowish 23 nmol/L (before you started Androgel protocol) and may now be even lower on injections than your FT would be descent and keep in mind that your peak TT/FT/e2 levels will be higher as you are injecting 120 mg T/week (60 mg every 3.5 days).

As you can clearly see your e2 is already high 51 pg/mL.

Although TT is important to know FT is what truly matters as it is the active unbound fraction of testosterone responsible for the positive effects.

It is critical that you not only test TT but more importantly FT and SHBG.

The only way to know where your FT truly sits is to have it tested using the most accurate assays such as the gold standard Equilibrium Dialysis or Ultrafiltration (next best).

Where your SHBG sits will have a significant impact on FT let alone can dictate what injection frequency may suit you best.


Then went on another gel. Felt very good at first again, which didnt last too long. There were moments where I had high e2 symptoms (oily skin, acne, red flushed face, etc) but felt very good mentally.

You only gave your previous protocol 120 mg T/week (60 mg every 3.5 days).....6 weeks then bailed and now on the gel again?

Where did your TT/FT/e2/SHBG levels sit?

Post labs?

DHT let alone the sensitivity of the AR has more to do with acne (genetically prone) than e2.


Gel stopped working again after a few months. Started injections. I thought, hm, maybe my low shbg was the reason i did better on gel than injections. Thats why I did everyday subq 20mg injections. for 6-8 weeks.
Felt absolutely the WORST. Felt exactly like pre-trt MINUS the panic attacks.


2 months on the gel then you jumped back on injections 140mg/week (20 mg daily).

Basically just upped your T dose from your previous injection protocol 120mgT/week (60 mg every 3.5 days) to 140 mg T (20 mg daily) which would be sure to drive your TT/FT/e2 levels up further.

Where did your TT/FT/e2/SHBG levels sit?

Post labs?

Again you only stayed on this protocol for 6-8 weeks.


Then switched back to e3.5d subq, 140-150mg but felt like shit again. Thought, maybe SubQ is the problem, lets to IM.

Now you switched back to injecting 140-150 mg T/week (70-75mg every 3.5 days) strictly sub-q and felt horrible.

How long did you stay on the protocol.....6-8 weeks?

Where did your TT/FT/e2/SHBG levels sit?

Post labs?


So i just finished 6 weeks of e3.5d 75mg intramuscular. Dont feel good. will get bloods tomorrow but no e2 test (which is useless anyways as i cant get sensitive).

Now you switched over to injecting strictly IM same dose T/injection frequency as your previous protocol.

You are only 6 weeks in and have absolutely no idea where your TT/FT/e2/SHBG level sits and you should still be getting estradiol tested even if you do not have access to the LC/MS-MS.


My symptoms really match low E2. Dry skin, dry eyes (at sleep), lethargy, anhedonia, obsessive thoughts, anxiety,depression, no erections except sometimes at waking up. no libido. insensitive penis, small flaccid. thin hair.

You have no idea where your e2 sits and good chances are it will be high on your current protocol as you are injecting 150 mg T/week (75 mg every 3.5 days) as you were clearly hitting high e2 (51 pg/mL) levels on one of your previous protocols using a much lower dose 120 mg T/week (60 mg every 3.5 days) strictly sub-q.

Need to post labs once you get them as you need to know where your trough TT/FT/e2 levels sit let alone SHBG!


So could it be that I could feel better at less frequent, bigger shots to get more aromatization going?

You have absolutely no idea where your E2 let alone SHBG sits and you were hitting a high trough e2 51 pg/mL on one of your previous injection protocols 120 mg T/week (60 mg every 3.5 days).

Need full labs TT/FT/E2/SHBG.

Let alone 6-8 weeks is nowhere near enough time to gauge the effectiveness of a protocol.

Anyone noticed they feel better on less frequent shots?

Comes down to the individual and many factors come into play.

Most on trt are injecting twice weekly (every 3.5 days), M/W/F, EOD, or daily.

Sure some are using once-weekly injections but it is not as common.





Do you see the common theme here?

Only giving a protocol 6-8 weeks before bailing and tweaking things (dose T/injection frequency, injectable--->transdermal, sub-q--->IM)

Not getting full labs done on every protocol.....TT/FT/E2/SHBG let alone other blood markers such as RBCs/hemoglobin/hematocrit.

Unfortunately, this is a complete mess!
 

madman

Super Moderator
my reply from a previous thread:Short vs long esters


As I have stated numerous times the first 6 weeks mean nothing when looking at the bigger picture.

Hormones will be in FLUX during the weeks leading up until blood levels STABILIZE (4-6 weeks when using enanthate/cypionate esters) during this transition the body is trying to ADJUST and even then once blood levels have stabilized it will take another 2-3 months for the body to fully adapt and this is the CRITICAL TIME PERIOD when one should gauge how they truly feel overall regarding relief/improvement of low-t symptoms.

The first 6 let alone 8 weeks are misleading and where many make the mistake of trying to gauge how they feel and whether the protocol was a success or failure!

Unfortunately, most expect to feel great overall 6 weeks in let alone experience the overall beneficial effects of healthy T levels and if such is not the case they go bat shit and start tweaking a f**king protocol (dose T/injection frequency), ester, IM to sub-q or vice versa.....you get the point a complete f**king mess, to say the least.

Top it all off that many have the herd mentality.....more T is better or the sob story.....I need to run absurdly high TT/FT levels to feel good and start jacking up their T-dose 6 weeks in because they do not feel well.

Looking over all your threads on here it is highly doubtful you have ever given your protocol a fighting chance.

On your current protocol, you are running an absurdly high trough TT which would have your trough FT through the roof, and if anything you need to look into lowering your T-dose let alone now you will have to wait another 4-6 weeks for blood levels to stabilize than 2-3 months to gauge how you truly feel overall.

If you are not willing to put in the time then you are going to be chasing your tail endlessly getting caught up on that never-ending merry-go-round.

Bad enough that many of the misinformed are so caught up in chasing/finding that so-called optimal.

See it all the time here on the forum.

People ranting/raving about a protocol and how they feel yet in many cases:

*blood work is done too early (2-3 weeks of starting a protocol)

*switching their protocols (dose T/injection frequency), esters, IM to sub-q or vice versa left and right every 6 weeks if they do not feel good/great.

*blood work is done using inaccurate assays especially when it comes to free testosterone let alone e2.

*neanderthal mindset that more T is better

*high T = raging libido/titanium erections


*high T = OPTIMAL as in that fairytale everyone is chasing.....you know the one with raging libido/titanium erections 24/7, unlimited amounts of energy, stellar mood (Mr. Rogers neighborhood), packing on muscle like the hulk with the recovery abilities of wolverine.....LMFAO.

Last but not least and the one that truly puts the icing on the cake

*Lack the understanding of how exogenous T works.

Hormones will be in FLUX during the weeks leading up until blood levels STABILIZE (4-6 weeks when using enanthate/cypionate esters) during this transition the body is trying to ADJUST and even then once blood levels have stabilized it will take another 2-3 months for the body to fully adapt and this is the CRITICAL TIME PERIOD when one should gauge how they truly feel overall regarding relief/improvement of low-t symptoms.
 

M.J

Active Member
I am on 75mg once weekly +hcg 500eod+ fsh 75 eod I like it, But the problem is testosterone a lone is not enough for me. I am not sure if this is correct but libido needs something else.
I am try’s maca which did actually help. And other herbs. Trying each alone also I am on cialis but not daily I think cialis and maca was “an ok” mix.

I am not sure if anyone in this forum is actually getting high libido of have 100% success from doing testosterone alone I think cialis and other stuff is needed to make you feel “better”
 
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DonaldPump2020

New Member
I can understand that I am impatient, but how does it pharmacologically make any sense that injections will take 5 months to have my body adjust to it while Gel works in 3 days?
the timeframe of 6-8 weeks has only to do with the long ester and its half life, reaching stable levels.

I could switch back to gel in a week and feel better than I have ever felt on 8 weeks on injections. i was on injections for multiple months. with changing protocols, yes. But it doesnt make any sense how that would reset my body, needing to restart the whole cycle of dialing in again?
By that logic every zinc or vitamin D3 tablet, any aromatase inhibitor or promoter (like a couple of beers) would throw off your dialed in steady hormones resetting your whole TRT?

cause drink a couple of beers and now you threw off your e2/aromatase

I had dose changes on gel too. My body didnt have to adjust for 3 months there, worked in 1 day. and its testosterone too. I know theres some talk about hormonal changes need months of wait to change cell signaling and whatever, but thats totally not true for gel, which is also testosterone, just without a long half life ester.

Everyday injections for 8 weeks left me with psychosis due to low E2. Estradiol is the only hormone that protects from psychosis, while testosterone and most likely DHT too promote it.

Also my E2 of 51 pg/ml was non-sensitive, so that wasnt high, as non-sensitive tests overestimate e2. Many people say the non-sensitive e2 test is utterly useless, so I cant see how that would help.

I had moments where I would literally apply Gel while still doing injections.
Is it stupid cause it fucks up my dialing in?`Well, yes, maybe? But it proved to me that I can feel better in just 1 day, which completely contradicts the saying that my body needs to adjust, thats why i still have no libido, erections, dry skin, anhedonia, paranoia, etc after 8 weeks of a steady, everyday (low shbg) protocol
 
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DonaldPump2020

New Member
I am on 75mg once weekly I like it. But the problem is testosterone a lone is not enough for me. I am not sure if this is correct but libido needs something else.
I am try’s maca which did actually help. And other herbs. Trying each alone also I am on cialis but not daily I think cialis and maca was “an ok” mix.

I am not sure if anyone in this forum is actually getting high libido of have 100% success from doing testosterone alone I think cialis and other stuff is needed to make you feel “better”
i agree that not every problem is related to T/TRT and trt is also not the answer to all problems.
But i know its the answer to my current problems cause I have proven myself via application of gel that 90% of all my problems are cured by applying T gel and its conversion to E2.

It doesnt make any sense, its testosterone/e2/dht. Why would the same hormone need 3-4 months of adjustment when doing injections but just 3 days on gel, if we forget about the esther which is cleaved off and then its just pure testosterone in the blood?

only thing left is that gels convert more towards e2/dht than injections
 

DonaldPump2020

New Member
Also worth noting is that me being at 650 ng/dl Total T on Gel, 5 hours after application (which is declining even further every hour. after 8 hours T is back to baseline) felt 1000 times better than me being at 630 ng/dl Total T on injections.Doesnt matter if I was on it for just 6 weeks, its the same hormone in the blood.

Thats why I said this isnt about T, but about E2.
 

M.J

Active Member
i agree that not every problem is related to T/TRT and trt is also not the answer to all problems.
But i know its the answer to my current problems cause I have proven myself via application of gel that 90% of all my problems are cured by applying T gel and its conversion to E2.

It doesnt make any sense, its testosterone/e2/dht. Why would the same hormone need 3-4 months of adjustment when doing injections but just 3 days on gel, if we forget about the esther which is cleaved off and then its just pure testosterone in the blood?

only thing left is that gels convert more towards e2/dht than injections
Easter takes time to start in the system as I know it’s like testosterone on a time after specific time testosterone works.
Gel and cream works immediately with no delay that’s why injections take time and of course u don’t need to do it daily as one injection stays in the system unlike cream “no ester” it leaves the system the next day “more or less”

some esters takes days or weeks or even months in the system.
 

M.J

Active Member
i agree that not every problem is related to T/TRT and trt is also not the answer to all problems.
But i know its the answer to my current problems cause I have proven myself via application of gel that 90% of all my problems are cured by applying T gel and its conversion to E2.

It doesnt make any sense, its testosterone/e2/dht. Why would the same hormone need 3-4 months of adjustment when doing injections but just 3 days on gel, if we forget about the esther which is cleaved off and then its just pure testosterone in the blood?

only thing left is that gels convert more towards e2/dht than injections
Also note that “works” u could mean a honey moon period which everybody go through when changing protocol which doesn’t last it’s something which we all go through for a short time everything works great but then it stops.
 

DonaldPump2020

New Member
Also note that “works” u could mean a honey moon period which everybody go through when changing protocol which doesn’t last it’s something which we all go through for a short time everything works great but then it stops.
I just dont understand how me changing doses too early on injections, like after 6-8 weeks, would somehow make my estradiol disappear leaving me with low e2 symptoms.
 

DonaldPump2020

New Member
I mean I agree that i need to be more patient with more blood work to back it all up, but how does changing protocols reset the whole cycle of dialing in`?

So drinking Milk containing estradiol will also reset full 8 weeks of trt? i dont think so
 

JA Battle

Active Member
I mean I agree that i need to be more patient with more blood work to back it all up, but how does changing protocols reset the whole cycle of dialing in`?

So drinking Milk containing estradiol will also reset full 8 weeks of trt? i dont think so

He’s technically not wrong. However, I totally hear your point. In my opinion there is a large diminishing return on the metabolic changes that coincide with a protocol change over the first few months. You obviously are hinting at this and I agree. It does take significant time for the complete adaptation to take place with a protocol change; But on the medium-long testosterone esters like enanthate/cypionate, the majority of the adaptation and noticeable effects take place within 4-6 weeks. This is a suitable time window to make big decisions on protocols. Our life is passing us by and in order to efficiently get to the place we want to be we can’t wait longer than is absolutely necessary to make decisions on protocols.

Also the dosing amount and schedule are a variable. When I’m just adjusting the propionate portion of my protocol, I found my blood levels stabilize in 5 days. I still have a rule of thumb that I wait 2 weeks for basic blood work related to the major hormones I may test related to the change I made. This is something that I inject 3mg of daily. The smaller the dosage the shorter the half life as the size of the pocket of oil created when an injection takes place also effects half life.

madman, I’m in no way insulting or undermining your knowledge and your record keeping of so much medical literature that has benefited me multiple times and also pricked my interest numerous times.
 

madman

Super Moderator
I just dont understand how me changing doses too early on injections, like after 6-8 weeks, would somehow make my estradiol disappear leaving me with low e2 symptoms.
Every time you tweak a protocol whether increasing/decreasing dose hormones will be in flux during the weeks leading up until blood levels stabilize (4-6 weeks when using enanthate/cypionate ester).

No way your body has fully adapted during this transition let alone getting dialed in.

Most doctors in the know would wait 12 weeks after starting a protocol or tweaking a protocol (dose T/injection frequency).

When blood work is done 6 weeks in we want to know how one reacts to T dose and where said protocol (dose T/injection frequency) has trough TT/FT/e2 levels let alone other blood markers as T levels may be too high or too low.

Of course, how one feels is critical but the first 6 weeks is misleading and is in no way going to dictate how you will truly feel 2 months after the stabilization period (hormones are in flux) as the body needs time to fully adapt to the new levels.

If T levels are healthy at 6 weeks in and one feels descent then you would need to give it a few months to truly gauge how you feel overall regarding relief/improvement of low-T symptoms.

If T levels are too low resulting in a lack of any improvement then the dose of T would need to be increased.

If T levels are too high resulting in one feeling unwell/experiencing sides then the dose of T would be lowered.

Some may even try using ancillaries to control the sides and still run higher T levels.

Sure during the first 6 weeks of starting trt let alone tweaking a protocol, it is common for many during this transition to experience what we call the honeymoon period where there may be a strong increase in libido/erections and overall euphoric feeling due to increasing T levels/dopamine.

Unfortunately, this is temporary and short-lived for most as the body will eventually adjust.

It is also very common for many men to experience ups/downs in energy/mood/libido/erections/recovery during the transition (4-6 weeks) as the body is trying to adjust which can be very misleading.








Read this over and over until it sinks in your dome.

Even when on trt and tweaking a protocol whether increasing or decreasing T dose hormones will be in flux during the weeks leading up until blood levels have stabilized (4-6 weeks when using enanthate/cypionate ester) and the body will need time to fully adapt.....at least another 2 months after levels have stabilized to truly gauge whether the protocol is a success or failure.


26.What is a reasonable timeline to begin to observe improvements in the signs and symptoms of testosterone deficiency?

*Following the initiation of testosterone therapy, serum concentrations of testosterone are known to correct earlier than the symptomatic, structural, and metabolic signs associated with TD.76,77

*As such, patients should be counseled that symptom response will not be immediate. Expectations for treatment response should be established with each patient. Patients can anticipate improvements in many of the common symptoms of TD (libido, energy levels, sexual function) after 3 months of treatment or longer. Metabolic and structural (body composition, muscle mass, bone density) changes may take upwards of 6-months. 77
In addition, patients should be counseled that diet and exercise in combination with testosterone therapy are recommended for body composition changes.

*Appreciating this pattern of response to testosterone therapy is fundamental when determining the impact of treatment and the appropriate timing of follow-up evaluations while on therapy.

*For example, if patients undergo a symptom review and measurement of testosterone levels too early (< 3 months), it may lead both physicians and patients to conclude that the treatment has not been impactful (i.e. normal levels of testosterone without symptomatic/structural/metabolic benefit). However, if the same assessment was scheduled 3-6 months after the initiation of therapy, the clinical response tends to be more reflective of normalized levels of serum testosterone.
 

DS3

Well-Known Member
Also note that “works” u could mean a honey moon period which everybody go through when changing protocol which doesn’t last it’s something which we all go through for a short time everything works great but then it stops.
Then, would it not be logical to make a small change to the protocol, such as a change in esters, every 12 weeks or so to keep the honeymoon or ‘optimal feeling’ period going?

I’m sure I’ll have someone jump on my butt about this, but I find that every time I change esters I feel great for the next 12 weeks and then experience a strong drop off in mood and energy that endures. So, I keep changing esters of brands of T every 12-16 weeks.

It works well for me.
 

madman

Super Moderator
I mean I agree that i need to be more patient with more blood work to back it all up, but how does changing protocols reset the whole cycle of dialing in`?

So drinking Milk containing estradiol will also reset full 8 weeks of trt? i dont think so

Better yet keep on tweaking your protocol every 6 weeks (dose T, injection frequency, transdermal--->IM and vice versa, sub-q--->IM and vice versa.....hell even the ester) let alone without a full set of labs done at trough for TT/FT/E2/SHBG/DHT/Prolactin and get back to me on that one!

You have no clue where your FT or estradiol (other than the one time when you first jumped on the gel.....51 pg/mL) truly sat on each protocol as you never had it tested let alone have no idea if your SHBG was driven down further on injections.

Everyone so caught up in TT yet many have no clue where their FT level truly sits.

Again although TT is important to know FT is what truly matters as it is the active unbound fraction of testosterone responsible for the positive effects.
 

M.J

Active Member
He’s technically not wrong. However, I totally hear your point. In my opinion there is a large diminishing return on the metabolic changes that coincide with a protocol change over the first few months. You obviously are hinting at this and I agree. It does take significant time for the complete adaptation to take place with a protocol change; But on the medium-long testosterone esters like enanthate/cypionate, the majority of the adaptation and noticeable effects take place within 4-6 weeks. This is a suitable time window to make big decisions on protocols. Our life is passing us by and in order to efficiently get to the place we want to be we can’t wait longer than is absolutely necessary to make decisions on protocols.

Also the dosing amount and schedule are a variable. When I’m just adjusting the propionate portion of my protocol, I found my blood levels stabilize in 5 days. I still have a rule of thumb that I wait 2 weeks for basic blood work related to the major hormones I may test related to the change I made. This is something that I inject 3mg of daily. The smaller the dosage the shorter the half life as the size of the pocket of oil created when an injection takes place also effects half life.

madman, I’m in no way insulting or undermining your knowledge and your record keeping of so much medical literature that has benefited me multiple times and also pricked my interest numerous times.
Side note for sustanon I am sure it took maybe two month to reach stable state. Some are very long.
 

M.J

Active Member
Then, would it not be logical to make a small change to the protocol, such as a change in esters, every 12 weeks or so to keep the honeymoon or ‘optimal feeling’ period going?

I’m sure I’ll have someone jump on my butt about this, but I find that every time I change esters I feel great for the next 12 weeks and then experience a strong drop off in mood and energy that endures. So, I keep changing esters of brands of T every 12-16 weeks.

It works well for me.
Yea some people talked about the idea of keep changing protocols. I have no experience in it and I am not sure health wise if it’s good or not. But maybe it will help in symptoms or take another thing to improve ur symptoms like cialis, pt-141 “for libido” maca maybe etc
 

S1W

Active Member
So I have a lot of trouble dialing in my TRT. Started gel with low T of 260 ng/dl and <5 E2 (non sensitive) , undetectable. SHBG of 23. Felt like HELL.

started androgel, felt the best i have ever felt in life after 4 days, this lasted for 1.5 weeks then I lost all my benefits and slowly became anxious, paranoid, amotivational etc again. not as bad as pre-trt but still bad.

Then tried injections. 6 weeks of subq e3.5d 60mg.
Levels: 630 ng/dl Total T, 51 pg/ml E2 (nonSensitive) felt like shit, way worse than gel.

Then went on another gel. Felt very good at first again, which didnt last too long. There were moments where I had high e2 symptoms (oily skin, acne, red flushed face, etc) but felt very good mentally.

Gel stopped working again after a few months. Started injections. I thought, hm, maybe my low shbg was the reason i did better on gel than injections. Thats why I did everyday subq 20mg injections. for 6-8 weeks.
Felt absolutely the WORST. Felt exactly like pre-trt MINUS the panic attacks.

Then switched back to e3.5d subq, 140-150mg but felt like shit again. Thought, maybe SubQ is the problem, lets to IM.

So i just finished 6 weeks of e3.5d 75mg intramuscular. Dont feel good. will get bloods tomorrow but no e2 test (which is useless anyways as i cant get sensitive).

My symptoms really match low E2. Dry skin, dry eyes (at sleep), lethargy, anhedonia, obsessive thoughts, anxiety,depression, no erections except sometimes at waking up. no libido. insensitive penis, small flaccid. thin hair.

So could it be that I could feel better at less frequent, bigger shots to get more aromatization going?

Anyone noticed they feel better on less frequent shots?
Can you please give more details on the obsessive thoughts that you experience? Assuming this is something you never experienced before TRT.
 

Jay Ara

Member
@DonaldPump2020 are you taking AÍ?

I was good with Nebido (very long éster) one shot every 10 weeks and not AI, nothing to complain. Should be going back to that protocol soon after a fertility break.
Another thing, people are different and what really matter is how you feel not the numbers or dosage.

You may have something related to E2. Maybe your test had AÍ in?
I’m not a doctor, just sharing some own experience.
Good luck!
 

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