Injection Frequency

[blitzen]

Hi,

It seems to be that E3.5D - E3D - M/W/F - EOD - ED are common here on the board.

I started with M/W/F and after the 3 month follow up they want to change me to E3.5D as my SHBG improved. From a practical standpoint that is great as I have to pin less, but .....

How did you arrive at your schedule? If you change it ... Why? Did it work for you?

Can we say low SHBG need more frequent injections / high E might be controlled better with more frequent injections?

Doing E3,5D I feel old style

 

[Vince]

When I did every three and a half days, I like Monday morning and Thursday night. Mainly because I like doing labs Monday morning.

 

[blitzen]

Vince, will need to think about that part too. When is it convenient or at least possible to get to the lab. It is always such an ordeal but what needs to get done will get done.
BTW why did you change. Any specific issue or were you just on the hunt of optimizing your results?

 

[CoastWatcher]

I went from a twice weekly, every 3.5 day, schedule, to a daily protocol in order to deal with somewhat low SHBG, a rising estradiol level, and the hope that a steady-state serum level could be achieved. In my case, all goals were met.

 

[Saul]

I am at E3D and it is a bit of a pain because the day changes every week. I have to have a reminder on my calendar pop up to help with the days and some mornings/days are not very convenient. I like the idea of a fixed schedule at times/days that work best for me and that over time I will remember and build into my weekly schedule. Also, I don't like injecting at night, at least not IM. I don't think there will be much difference in T levels and other factors between every 3.5 days or every 3 days. Half life of T Cyp is 7-8 days.

 

[Vince]

Vince, will need to think about that part too. When is it convenient or at least possible to get to the lab. It is always such an ordeal but what needs to get done will get done.
BTW why did you change. Any specific issue or were you just on the hunt of optimizing your results?

I switch to daily injections hoping it would control my HCT. I was so tired of donating blood every 8 weeks, it worked for me. It's been almost a year since I had to donate blood, but I know it hasn't helped everyone.

 

[blitzen]

Coastwatcher > the SHBG forced your hand and glad that it worked out in the end

Saul > same as you I would not do good on a E3D schedule. I like to set fixed days ... I would definitifely think about E3.5d or M/W/F depending on SHBG, lifestyle, ....

 

[blitzen]

I switch to daily injections hoping it would control my HCT. I was so tired of donating blood every 8 weeks, it worked for me. It's been almost a year since I had to donate blood, but I know it hasn't helped everyone.

My HCT creeped up to 50 .... lets see it might be just a initial reaction to the T or stay high. But in 2 month I'll be flying to Japan (thankfully not in Economy) and will donate blood before the 15h non-stop flight to avoid problems.

 

[CoastWatcher]

Coastwatcher > the SHBG forced your hand and glad that it worked out in the end

Saul > same as you I would not do good on a E3D schedule. I like to set fixed days ... I would definitifely think about E3.5d or M/W/F depending on SHBG, lifestyle, ....

SHBG was certainly a factor, but the desire for e2 control without an AI also played a role.

 

[blitzen]

SHBG was certainly a factor, but the desire for e2 control without an AI also played a role.

My understanding is that if you inject T ED you can get away with using smaller amounts weekly compared to E3.5D > but as a lot of the time people do it because if low SHBG
The "need" for higher E3,5D with low SHBG is due to the fact that more T is wasted by the body and converted to E
>> the above just shows my understanding and I could be totally off

Right now I will change as prescribed and see what happens. I'm between "just increase injection frequency as it has more positives than negatives" and "change only a few things at a time and then test again"
I have the feeling that the more I read the more confused/uncertain I become.

 

[Systemlord]

Everyone's SHBG has a different level of efficiency or stickiness where more T molecules stick to any given SHBG protein, I surmise this is why some low SHBG guys are fine injecting twice weekly. I was perfectly fine injecting twice weekly and switching to an EOD protocol had more to do with impatience than anything else. Starting my EOD protocol and the improvements that followed could have just been what was already going to happen anyway, I never felt low leading up to my next injection on twice weekly and probably would have been fine.

However then after I made the change in protocol I heard members state that keeping their levels even more stable seemed to improve libido with low SHBG guys, my libido has always been insane and didn't want to take any chances so I'm sticking with 20mg EOD. Since lowering my dosage from 25mg EOD (E2 problems) to 20mg EOD about 3 weeks into it all, I've notice much harder erections in the morning that aren't far off from 100 percent fully hard erections.

If it weren't for my phones reminders I don't know how I could manage this EOD protocol.

 

[blitzen]

How often do you guys test your T / FT / E levels? Or are you going by feeling when making changes?

You use 20mg EOD > that is weekly "just" 70mg your body seem to be very efficient in absorbing/using the injected T

 

[Milad Zadeh]

I’m kinda the opposite.
When I started TRT a few years ago I was on 200mg ONCE a week with great results. No E2 issues and massive gains in the gym. A year into the above protocol I got injured, surgery etc and decided to quit TRT, few other reasons contributed to that decision but that’s a different story.

Fast forward to 6 months ago and I decided to start TRT again and signed up with defy for convinience reasons. Defy started me at 160mg split into Monday mornings and Thursday evenings. E2 shot up and less gains in the gym in addition to other nasty side effects. After my first consult I was told to lower the dosage to 140mg split into Monday mornings and Thursday evenings In addition to an AI. Slight improvement but nowhere close to matching the old protocol.
My Point is frequent shots may not always be better. I will discuss other options with Dr. Saya during my next consult, until then I’ll constinue to ride it out.

 

[blitzen]

or in short form .... There is no answer as what works for one fails for another

 

[Blackhawk]

LOL, I chose E3D because it is easier than 3.5 for me. First thing in the AM works great for me, but I would be too inconsistent with the evening injection.

How often do you guys test your T / FT / E levels? Or are you going by feeling when making changes?

The prevailing wisdom is at least 6 weeks after changes. It takes that long for steady state to occur in your body.

 

[CoastWatcher]

How often do you guys test your T / FT / E levels? Or are you going by feeling when making changes?

You use 20mg EOD > that is weekly "just" 70mg your body seem to be very efficient in absorbing/using the injected T

I would never - under any circumstances - make a protocol change on the basis of "feeling." How I feel comes first, certainly, but why guess when testing is available through a doctor or discountedlabs.com? I inject 16mg a day of testosterone enanthate, and test every four months, now going to every six months as remarkable stability has been achieved.

 

[HealthMan]

Stick to whatever frequency makes you feel good. That can be daily, EOD, twice a week, weekly or even bi-weekly. Only way to know is to try. Bloodwork and specially how you feel are the guides.
I am back to E3.5D after trying daily and i am feeling great again (upped the dosage a bit)