Why Can't I Tolerate TRT From a Mental Standpoint?

[Charliebizz]

I would like if this discussion doesn’t turn into an “us vs them” type of discussion.

But it seems a small minority of people on these boards can’t tolerate trt from a mental stand point. Trt has very small positive effect on me physically. I feel slightly more energy and less fatigue. But mentally after time goes on on trt I start to feel depressed no motivation do not care about my hobbies. I get generally feel more negative on trt.

I’ve tried trt a few times over the years a bunch of different protocols. I’ve had great labs on trt. I was a patient of dr johns. So I was up with all the latest trt Trends.

Please let’s try to discuss this without arguing. Thanks

 

[Vince]

Testosterone therapy is not the fountain of youth. Even if you do everything right, testosterone just does not work for some men.

 

[Vince Carter]

Most of the guys that you find on the forum that have mental issues or problems while on TRT and struggle with that inspite of TRT, or their hormones, in general. IMVHO when you show up here with anxiety, depression, OCD, ADHD, insecurities, that's not going be bettered with TRT, or Thyroid treatments. This forum is laden with those you can't help because of their insecurities. So they take it as failure. Even discounting bad Dr's and bad treatment protocols you just can't surmount the kind of issues that guys are showing up here with that think TRT is going to fix what's between their ears.

 

[StepbyStep]

I struggled with this as well. I referred to it as emotional flatness. I didn't really get excited about anything, and it felt like the reward system just flat out stopped working in my brain. I however struggled with fatigue since the start of TRT.

In hindsight, I feel like TRT also had a negative effect on my overall mood, and contributed towards depressive thoughts and anxiety. I didn't realize this until a couple of months after I quit.

I'm currently 3 months off of TRT and I feel so much better. I feel normal, no fatigue, good libido, no depressing thoughts, and my erection quality has improved a lot.

IMO these problems are nurotransmitter related, and as of now there's no good way to accurately measure nurotransmitters levels.

 

[CoastWatcher]

Has the lack of interest that you describe been a problem for you in the past, before TRT was even an issue? If so, how did you respond to those emotional feelings?

 

[HarryCat2]

There certainly are those for whom TRT has solved their mental health issues, PeakT always said that TRT cured his lifelong depression. But clearly there are those of us who get little to no benefit and maybe even do a little worse in some respects on TRT. I do think that is it primarily driven by how your neurotransmitters get affected by TRT. I still remember how great I felt during the honeymoon period I had with Androgel, I thought I had hit upon a miracle cure. Of course that didn't last long and I came tumbling back to earth. I have tried a lot of different expertly administered protocols since that time and have never felt any improvement in any of my pre-TRT symptoms.

As has been mentioned on the forum before there is research that shows that there are genetic variations that can affect how guys respond to TRT.

I also think that a lot of us bring a lot of previous medical baggage into TRT, in my case I had taken a saw palmetto supplement for many years and for a 2 year period was put on heavy doses of AD's because no doctor thought of testing my hormones first. I wonder if either one or both of these has caused permanent damage.

The only thing that I have found that makes me feel normal again for a little while is to take a 1-2 month break from TRT and then when I start up again I get a little bit of a honeymoon period again.

 

[StepbyStep]

Has the lack of interest that you describe been a problem for you in the past, before TRT was even an issue? If so, how did you respond to those emotional feelings?

No, I've always enjoyed my hobbies and interests. Always had projects going, always fixing, improving, and learning new things.

 

[Cataceous]

I struggled with this as well. I referred to it as emotional flatness. I didn't really get excited about anything, and it felt like the reward system just flat out stopped working in my brain. I however struggled with fatigue since the start of TRT.
...

On TRT I've experienced the emotional flatness to a degree, along with a dampened "reward system". Dopamine boosters like NALT help some. More recently the switch to daily propionate seems to be helping as well, though it's only been a month. It's possible that a diurnal variation in hormones is more important than we realize.

 

[sh1973]

I just started propionate 3 days ago and I must say I’m very impressed. I’m doing 10mg per day and all I can say is wow, what a difference. I’ve been on trt well over nine years and have tried enanthate, topical and Cypionate in every imaginable dosage and frequency. In my case I think Cypionate by far is the worst ester for treating hypogonadism. The extremely long half life makes changes long and grueling to work through. At least with Propionate, the changes can be made in a quicker manner. I realize my journey with propionate has only begun, but there’s no comparison to the way I feel, none whatsoever! I think that if docs would start guys on this there would be more happy patients.

 

[StepbyStep]

On TRT I've experienced the emotional flatness to a degree, along with a dampened "reward system". Dopamine boosters like NALT help some. More recently the switch to daily propionate seems to be helping as well, though it's only been a month. It's possible that a diurnal variation in hormones is more important than we realize.

I agree 100%, and have suspected this too. I plan to jump of the Propionate band wagon eventually, I've just been feeling so good lately that I want to enjoy life for a while. I just recently took comprehensive 90 day labs off TRT, so I'm excited to see where I'm at and establish a baseline for many hormones off TRT.

 

[StepbyStep]

As has been mentioned on the forum before there is research that shows that there are genetic variations that can affect how guys respond to TRT.

Any links to these? Any idea if there's an affordable way to have our genome sequenced to look for these particular variations?

 

[HarryCat2]

Any links to these? Any idea if there's an affordable way to have our genome sequenced to look for these particular variations?

Your Genetic CAG Repeat Number Determines How Well You Will Respond to Testosterone

I had looked into getting genetic testing for this a couple of years ago and the only lab I could find to do it was in Europe and even if I could get a sample to them it cost something like $1500

 

[Charliebizz]

Most of the guys that you find on the forum that have mental issues or problems while on TRT and struggle with that inspite of TRT, or their hormones, in general. IMVHO when you show up here with anxiety, depression, OCD, ADHD, insecurities, that's not going be bettered with TRT, or Thyroid treatments. This forum is laden with those you can't help because of their insecurities. So they take it as failure. Even discounting bad Dr's and bad treatment protocols you just can't surmount the kind of issues that guys are showing up here with that think TRT is going to fix what's between their ears.

I 100% get what your saying and that’s what leads most of us here to begin with but my question was more geared toward why would it cause a new host of mental isssues. I never had those problems I spoke of even with my t low as 190. It’s like boosting my t after a few weeks just causes a whole new nt imbalance.

Trust me I never got on t with the belief it would make me super man I wasn’t looking for that at all. Hell I still have trouble reading people’s post how one downstream hormone being boosted made them this superhuman. I only tried trt because i messed myself up with underrating and over training and I just couldn’t seem to recover naturally.

 

[Charliebizz]

No, I've always enjoyed my hobbies and interests. Always had projects going, always fixing, improving, and learning new things.

Same with me. I still play competitive ice hockey. And on trt I found myself not wanting to play and even skipping games. Before trt I would do everything in my power not to miss a game. I thought it was maybe cause I had a kid and I’m getting older but now that I’m off I’m feeling very good mentally. Just have a little more bouts with fatigue again. Off trt

 

[equel]

Its so weird. Some people seem to respond extremely well to testosterone, they become motivated, horny, driven, almost get a new life.

Then u have people who feel LESS motivation.

Maybe it has to do with bad protocol for that individual?

 

[fifty]

I found this thread to possibly be relevant
Still not dialed in after 2+ years on TRT. Labs included. Help?

 

[StepbyStep]

Most of the guys that you find on the forum that have mental issues or problems while on TRT and struggle with that inspite of TRT, or their hormones, in general. IMVHO when you show up here with anxiety, depression, OCD, ADHD, insecurities, that's not going be bettered with TRT, or Thyroid treatments. This forum is laden with those you can't help because of their insecurities. So they take it as failure. Even discounting bad Dr's and bad treatment protocols you just can't surmount the kind of issues that guys are showing up here with that think TRT is going to fix what's between their ears.

Maybe, but that's not what we're discussing. Looks like you've possibly experienced similar issues here? Posts #20 and 25.

Still not dialed in after 2+ years on TRT. Labs included. Help?

 

[Charliebizz]

Maybe, but that's not what we're discussing. Looks like you've possibly experienced similar issues here? Posts #20 and 25.

Still not dialed in after 2+ years on TRT. Labs included. Help?

Yeah I wasn’t looking for trt to help me with anything other then low energy,low libido and low eq. Also hoping it helped with brain fog. Brain fog is gone on or off trt. But my original question was why did trt make new mental issues. I wasn’t talking about trt expectations at all.

 

[StepbyStep]

Yea I found his post to be a little insulting, dismissing the symptoms caused by TRT and implying that we all have pre-existing psychological issues.

I got on TRT to fix my ED. Nothing else, plain and simple. I tried for 14 months and wound up feeling awful with nearly complete ED. Lots of protocols, thousands of dollars spent on labs, meds, and appointments. I'd like to know why as well.

 

[Charliebizz]

Yea I found his post to be a little insulting, dismissing the symptoms caused by TRT and implying that we all have pre-existing psychological issues.

I got on TRT to fix my ED. Nothing else, plain and simple. I tried for 14 months and wound up feeling awful with nearly complete ED. Lots of protocols, thousands of dollars spent on labs, meds, and appointments. I'd like to know why as well.

Well that’s why I said I would like this not to turn negative. But it always seems to happen when someone has a problem with trt.

I’m not really that person to be put in that category. Yes I had anxiety back in the day. And I do get obsessed with things to a degree but I would imagine so do all the guys on these forums. Just the shear fact how much time they put into them and fixing there problems. But I know myself and I know I am not making this up. It’s not in my head. Trt has always been a problem for me. I couldn’t even tolerate it at all a few years ago. I have labs to confirm it always lowered my low normal cortisol. By a lot. My morning fasting cortisol was as low as 6 on trt. I felt awful. Then after reading a lot of dr Mariano’s work I tried very low dose lexapro. It helped tremendously with low cortisol symptoms. So much I was able to tolerate trt. But on two different occasions a few weeks in I started to notice subtitle mental changes.