Nelson: | Allison, how about the pregnancy category X issue? We were discussing that back a few weeks ago.
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Allison : | Yes, so that's a great point to bring up. With testosterone, it is considered to be pregnancy category X. That just means that if a woman, if she's on hormone replacement therapy and were to become pregnant, she would definitely know that there is risk of causing fetal harm. Before a provider would give a woman testosterone they need to be talking about okay, what is your reliable form of birth control? Have you had a tubal ligation or do you have an IUD in place?
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| | Hopefully it would be a form of birth control that doesn't involve synthetic hormones like oral contraceptives, but that is a discussion that needs to be held between the patient and provider because you would not want to start testosterone if you're a pre-menopausal woman and not on birth control because there would be real concern there.
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Monica: | Now one thing I wanted to ask as well which it peaked my interest because Nelson posted an article about how people starting hormone replacement therapy and making changes to their diet and how diet plays an impact on hormone replacement therapy. Can you elaborate a little bit on that? Because sometimes what happens, what I've noticed with women is we have our habits.
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| | We're accustomed to eating emotionally or whatever this is. When we get hormone replacement therapy sometimes we tend to think oh, well this is going to fix that. I'm not losing weight or whatever it is. What kind of a conversation would you have with a woman with respect to their diet, their lifestyle choices and working together with hormone replacement therapy so we can benefit the most from it?
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Allison : | Yeah, that's a great question as well. It's so true, there's not just one magic pill or cream that's going to solve all of our problems. I have a lot of women who come to me and weight is a big concern of theirs. That's oftentimes one of the main reasons they're coming in. Just balancing hormones is one really important step, but the lifestyle absolutely has to go along with that, like you said.
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| | Regular exercise is very important. The mixture of not just cardio training, but also weight training to build lean muscle mass is important. I think a lot of women have the misconception that more cardio and running is better for you.
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Monica: | Cardio queens.
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Allison : | What's that?
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Monica: | Cardio queens.
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Allison : | Yeah, I was the same way when I was younger. All I would do, I would run and run and run and I would run half marathons. That's all I would do. I never lifted a weight. Then I did some reading and I realized oh no, women, we actually should be doing some weight training as well. We want to develop that lean muscle mass.
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| | When I say lean muscle mass, that's the key point there, you're not going to look bulky and big and huge. You're just going to develop that nice lean muscle mass. It's going to actually increase the amount of calories you burn, your basil metabolic rate just sitting there because you have more muscle as opposed to fat.
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| | Building lean muscle mass is very important. You can keep that toned look and also build that muscle mass without having to have that concern. A little cardio is good, but then also you want to do some weight training. Then in terms of diet, I would say if I had to mention some just basic recommendations, something along the lines I would say of a Mediterranean type diet would be a good recommendation. That's basically just plant-based diet, fresh fruits and vegetables, legumes, nuts, whole grains, fish, olive oil. Occasionally I would say chicken, eggs. You want to have a good amount of protein but then rarely red meat.
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| | Following that diet it actually was found that it reduces the risk of heart disease by up to 47% over a 10 year period. That was actually a study published in the American College of Cardiology in 2015. Just saying that, if I'm going to make some basic recommendations, I would say fresh fruits and vegetables, lean meats, like chicken, turkey, fish. Rarely red meat. Then just making those simple changes can actually reduce your risk of heart disease by almost half, which is incredible.
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Monica: | Right.
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Nelson: | Breakfast is very important and I know women are rushing with their kids and ...
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Monica: | Yeah. The other thing that I've heard time and time again from other women is many women believe that after you have children it's very difficult to obtain a great physique or to be in your optimal shape because having kids just ruins your body. Is there anything that you can say with respect to that? Then maybe even with hormone replacement therapy, how putting that altogether ... Honestly what I've noticed is I'm in better shape now than even before I had kids.
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| | Of course I have excess skin in some areas and some other issues, but I honestly feel better and I feel like I look better than before I had kids. Is there something that you can let people, let other women know about that, about having kids and it not being the end all, be all?
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Allison : | Yeah, that's a great point because I think after having children a lot of women sort of shift their focus as you need to. You're a caretaker now. You have a child as your main concern, but you cannot neglect yourself and your own health. Even though yes, you are the caretaker, you're a mother, your children are your top priority, you can't lose sight of your own health and wellness because you have to take care of yourself if you're going to be there for your children.
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| | That's a good point. Don't just think okay, everything's over. I've had a kid. It's the end of the world. I'm fighting a losing battle here. No. Just know that your health is important. You need to take time to actually exercise. Take the time to make healthier choices. It's not just everything's I would say too late if you've had kids. That's a very important time. I didn't know you before you had children, but you do look amazing. You look great. You're a good example of that. It doesn't have to be over. You're just starting.
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Monica: | Exactly, especially if you pay attention. I think the great part about this whole show is that it's more or less the individual knowing their own body and paying attention to what's going on. Many times we'll go through our days and we just react, we just live. We live off of default. Things are happening and then we react. Things are happening and we react.
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| | If you go to someone like yourself and you're like okay, wait a second. I want to make sure that I know what's going on with my body. Help me be the best that I can possibly be. That's what this is basically about. Hormone replacement therapy is just making sure that we're living optimally, right?
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Allison : | Yeah, absolutely. It's just bringing your hormones into upper end of a normal range to an optimal range so your body can just function at its best. That's I think the simplest way I can think to explain it. We're not trying to give you super physiological doses or hormones. We're not trying to turn people into the Incredible Hulk or change their anatomy. It's just we want to give them an optimal level of hormones so the body can just function at its best in conjunction of course with diet and exercise lifestyle changes. People are just at their healthiest and they have a good quality of life.
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Monica: | Right. When my mom was alive one thing that I remember her saying time and time again was, and I would love to hear your input on this, and I know a lot of people think this way, is oh no, I want to do this naturally. I don't want to take anything. What would you say to somebody like that who's thinking that they want to stay natural, especially living in the environment that we currently live in?
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Allison : | Yeah, and that's difficult because there are a lot of things in even our environment now that can disrupt our hormones. I tell patients even if you try to avoid oh, I was going to say drinking out of plastic water bottles.
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Monica: | Hormone disruptors.
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Allison : | You try to avoid these endocrine disruptors and the CDC has published reports that there truly are endocrine disruptors in our environment, plastic water bottles, PCAs, especially heating things up in a microwave in plastic containers. There's even ...
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Allison : | Yeah, it's true, you want to do everything you can, but we cannot live in a cave. We can't isolate ourselves from the environment. Like I was saying, the CDC has even published reports that there are endocrine disruptors even in our air and in our water. It's not like we can isolate ourselves and avoid hormonal imbalance just living in the society that we live in now.
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| | I would say you want to do your best to do it naturally, but then also just replacing hormones in a very physiologic way which matches very similarly the way your body naturally produces them and just replacing these hormones that would already be present to levels where they should be if the body was making an optimal amount. It's not like we're doing anything that is I would say not physiologic. It's just restoring these hormone levels to their optimal range so you can do your part avoiding the environmental exposures, living a healthy lifestyle, exercising, diet so it can all work for you.
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| | Like I mentioned before, if hormones are out of balance, it can be very difficult to maintain an ideal weight, to lose fat, build lean muscle mass. It's almost like you're doing all you can but it's like fighting a losing battle because internally you don't have that hormonal balance to really see the benefit from what you're doing.
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Monica: | Right, which is why we have a lot of women, especially as they age, I remember Jay and I having a conversation about this as well, I believe this is as the result of a thyroid, many women as they age the thyroid malfunctions and they'll do all these training, these workout regimens and they don't see any results because their thyroid is not functioning, right?
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Allison : | Right. It can be thyroid, yeah. Of course I look at testosterone too. There's a whole lot you can look at but thyroid is a big one, testosterone is a big one. Making sure there's a good balance of estrogen and progesterone, that a woman is not estrogen dominant.
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Monica: | Right. Go ahead.
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Nelson: | Any suggestions on supplements, Allison for women?
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Allison : | Sure. Yeah, so I feel very strongly that if we're going to be recommending supplements we should actually test levels and see what a patient is deficient in. In my personal clinic I do a test called, it's a SpectraCell Micronutrient test. I don't know if you've heard of it, but it's actually testing for intracellular micronutrient deficiencies. It tests over 35 micronutrients. It's looking at vitamins, minerals, aminoacids, fatty acids, antioxidants. It gives you an antioxidant function score, even an immune system score. It's looking at inside of the white blood cells. It's intracellular. It's a lot more accurate than just doing a one time serum test.
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| | If someone is asking me about supplements, and I've had patients come in, they had a table full of supplements. I'm like okay, how did you know you needed all of those? Number one. It's probably pretty expensive to be buying all of those. Also, have you been tested to make sure that you're absorbing them and that you're on the right doses?
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| | I would say going into just High Health or GNC and picking up supplements, are they going to be harmful? No. Are they going to be containing active ingredients? Are they tested for purity and potency and are you going to absorb it and is it actually going to translate into absorption and get intracellularly? That would be a different question.
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| | In a patient like that I would say well, let's just test your SpectraCell Micronutrient test and just see where you're at. Oftentimes they're still deficient in so many areas that they're shocked because they thought that they were taking every supplement to address this. I think with recommending we need to have accurate testing. That's just the one that I use in my clinic which I found to be very helpful. It gives patients a detailed breakdown of are they borderline, are they deficient, are they adequate in each of the nutrients?
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| | It will even make recommendations on dietary changes that can give them more of those nutrient and even supplement dosing protocols for patients if they're deficient. Then after four to six months you retest and you can see where those levels are to make sure everything is optimal. It's very similar to prescribing hormones. I wouldn't just have a patient come in and say okay, well based on your symptoms here's what I recommend. I would need to see blood work to back up that recommendation. Then that way you can retest and see are you absorbing and what was your actual response to therapy. Of course taking symptoms into account on hormonal side, but supplements, I think testing is just cannot be overstated the importance of that.
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Monica: | Right. That's awesome. Now I have a question with respect to your clinic opposed to say somebody's provider. What is the difference and is it something that you would recommend going to someone who specializes more like your clinic versus their primary care physician? Because from my experience the primary care physician that we go to doesn't know anything about hormone replacement therapy. What's your insight on that?
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Allison : | Yeah, I would say that every provider is going to be different and just like you, I've found oftentimes a primary care provider just doesn't have a lot of detailed training outside of just traditional western medicine like synthetic hormones and the Women's Health Initiative Study, we shouldn't be on hormones and that's about it.
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| | They're good with birth control, synthetic hormones. In terms of knowing about how to prescribe more physiologic hormones through compounding pharmacies, that takes a lot of extra training. It's not something that we're even taught in school. Even myself, I'd always been curious about it, but wasn't taught anything about it at all.
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| | After graduating I realized there's a big need for it so I had to do continuing education just to learn how to work with these hormones. Even an endocrinologist, they are typically thought of as a hormone specialist, but oftentimes even with thyroid they're still just testing TSH total, T4, they're only prescribing synthetic T4 which is Levothyroxine.
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| | A lot of times patients aren't converting to T3. They don't check it. Every provider is unique, but I would say you really would want to go to someone who has training in the more physiologic forms of hormone replacement and who also has experience working with compounding pharmacies because you can send any dose, any prescription you want to them. They will make it. It can be a little overwhelming for a new provider to get into this field if they don't have the training and experience because it's all on you.
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| | It's not there's a standard dose at Walgreen's. Go pick it up tomorrow. No, you're the one making the call. It takes time. It takes training and I've been doing it for six years now and I'm still learning all the time. That's the exciting thing about this field is it's sort of a journey. It's a process. The more you learn, like I mentioned before, the more you can help yourself and help others. It's something I'm really passionate about.
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| | A lot of it actually came from my own mom. I don't know if I've told you guys this, but my mom had low thyroid. She actually struggled with the classic symptoms of low thyroid for like over a decade. I remember this when I was a child. She was tired. She was always sleeping. She was gaining weight. Her hair's falling out. She's constipated. She's even depressed. All the classic symptoms of low thyroid.
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| | All of her doctors would say, "Your thyroid's normal. You're on Levothyroxine. It's working well. Your TSH and your total T4 are fine. It's not your thyroid." They would just not, they didn't know what other tests to do. They didn't know how to help her. They just said, "We don't want to discuss it. It's not your thyroid. Just don't even ... We're not addressing it."
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| | This was in the Valley. This was in Arizona. She went to probably 10 different doctors, endocrinologists, specialists, naturopaths. No one was able to help her. Finally she encountered a provider who was trained in hormone replacement therapy. Checked the free T3 level and found she wasn't converting that T4 over to T3. They switched her to a natural desiccated thyroid. It was actual armor thyroid and within I would say the first about month, month and a half, all of her symptoms started resolving. Once her hormones were fully balanced she was fine.
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| | She had to suffer with these issues for over a decade. I think me just having seen her go through that and her telling me how much she suffered and how she feels it was a life changing difference, it's almost like I was meant to go into this field just because her having gone through that. I don't want patients to have to deal with that. That's why I think it's important just, it's great there are webinars like this. There's so much information on the internet now where patients can almost educate themselves and be more proactive and ask these tough questions to their providers.
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| | If they're not willing to check free T3 or even consider a natural desiccated thyroid you really oftentimes have to be your own advocate at this point and find someone who has the right training or else you're just going to suffer and not have a good quality of life.
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Monica: | No, absolutely. Absolutely. Out of curiosity, what is the cost of going to a clinic like yourself there? What is the usual investment for someone?
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Allison : | With Prime Body we actually do an initial consultation for free. It's complimentary. Just so that we can talk with the patient to determine if they're a candidate, can we help them at all. The initial consultation is complimentary. The blood panel, we typically send patients to Lab Corps and the cost of the full hormonal panel for women is around $78.
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| | It's under $80. Then after that, once we come up with the program it's basically, at least the way our clinic does it, it's a monthly subscription-based fee. Each month it's covering your office visits, any patient management, all the prescription medication, shipping to your home of office. You kind of know each month this is going to be the price that covers everything. You don't have to worry am I going to get charged again for my office visit next month? How much are the prescriptions going to cost next month? You know it's a set price.
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| | It just ranges based on how many hormones a patient needs. Starting out is around $150 a month. That would be for one hormone then up through around a couple hundred dollars a month just depending on how many hormones a patient needs. That would be whatever dose is appropriate for the patient. You don't have to worry if we're changing the doses over time is the cost going to change. It doesn't.
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| | At least that's the way our clinic deals with it. That's also because we really don't do any billing of insurance at all. Only because it's considered more preventative, wellness service. I tend to always say we don't really have healthcare or health insurance. We more have sick care, disease care.
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Monica: | Exactly.
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Allison : | Yeah, if you're sick and you're diseased then you go to the doctor, you can get your prescription, that's covered. If you're doing this to be more preventative and wellness-oriented, typically insurance wouldn't reimburse for it so we don't do any insurance billing. I have some patients using their Flex Spending Accounts or HSA account. That's sort of pre-taxed money that can help with some of the cost.
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Monica: | I'm sorry. Is it where people have to go in physically and visit your clinic or is it tele-medicine?
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Allison : | We do require an initial face-to-face visit with one of our providers. We're in multiple cities throughout the country, so most likely we'll be in the state that a patient lives in. If not, Prime Body does provide travel reimbursement for that face-to-face visit, but at least a face-to-face visit once a year would be required. The followups could be through tele-medicine. Only because we're dealing with a controlled substance in most cases, testosterone. We just feel that we should establish that face-to-face relationship.
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Jay: | You don't have to answer this, but why is testosterone a controlled substance again? Okay, hold on. We actually have a really good question here. I just want to read it to you. It says do you suggest a certain blood test for women such as Nelson's company DiscountedLabs.com the female anti-aging blood test or should you test independently and separately for estrogen, progesterone, testosterone and thyroid?
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Allison : | Nelson, if you know what's on your panel I could tell you if that's everything. Or I could just let you know which labs.
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Nelson: | It's pretty much that. It's pretty much what you said. Progesterone, estrogen, testosterone, which one am I missing? Free 3T and TSH.
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Allison : | Perfect. Yeah, so that's exactly what I would recommend. If you want a little more specifics, like definitely you'd want estradiol would be the dominant form of estrogen you want to check. Progesterone, the test is just called progesterone. Testosterone, I do like to look at free testosterone levels in particular. Most of the time probably on your panel you'll see free and total, but it's almost more important diagnostically to look at the free testosterone because sex hormone binding globulin is actually oftentimes a lot higher in women, especially on oral contraceptive pulls it's very high. It binds up a large portion of that total testosterone.
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| | Looking at the free gives you a better picture of what's actually available for the body to use. Then thyroid, I do like to look at TSH initially, not that I obsess over that when I'm treating a patient, but a TSH and definitely said free T3 is very important. You can even add on thyroid antibodies. You don't have to do that, but if there's a family history of Hashimoto's or you want to know exactly what's the cause, antibodies can be added on.
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| | Those would be the main ones. Then like I mentioned in the beginning, if you really want to take a look at the full hormonal cascade and even adrenal functioning you could add on tests like DHEA pregnenolone, cortisol. I know pregnenolone can be pretty expensive, but if you really want that full picture you could include all of those. The basics like Nelson mentioned, estrogen, progesterone, testosterone free and total and then the thyroid including the free T3.
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Jay: | Go ahead Nelson. Go ahead.
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Nelson: | We have a few minutes. Do you want to expand on cortisol or is that ... Cortisol is so controversial on testing and treatment, Allison. Or is that something ...
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Allison : | I would say maybe that's something for another webinar. Even talking about thyroid with all this, that could be a whole webinar by itself, you know?
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Nelson: | Yeah.
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Jay: | I think it's a great idea, Nelson. By the way, Allison you've been phenomenal on this show. The information that's been coming out, I'm kind of blown away. That actually speak to my question, I know we're coming up on 5:00, so before I ask my question we've got about seven or eight people it looks like coming on and off watching this based on Google. If you guys have any questions please type in the group chat, any other questions for Allison before we end this.
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| | We're probably going to be on for another five or six minutes. My question is there's so many different hormones, obviously men and women are very similar, but for men it's usually a management of testosterone, estrogen and the process that it entails. Yes, we are looking at other hormones and yes, we are looking at other blood ranges and whatnot, but it seems like for women, and again, correct me if I'm wrong and then allow me to ask a deeper question, it seems like it's a lot harder to balance everything and get a woman dialed in from the perspective of let's say a woman comes to you, she's 40 years old. I'm giving you a hypothetical patient.
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| | She has never been on hormone replacement before and she wants to lose body fat. She most likely has, she's had two or three kids, she's most likely has a not optimal thyroid level or a dysfunctional thyroid level. How long on average would it take a woman to get "dialed in and balanced out" and have her hormones optimized if they work with say you or Prime Body? Then compare that to an average endocrinologist or general practitioner who's doing hormone optimization with women across let's say North America.
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Allison : | Yeah, that's a great question. I always explain to my new patients in their consultation that balancing hormones is really, it's a process that we cannot rush. If I try to rush it and give them excessively high doses or I'm too aggressive because I want to see that end result tomorrow, they're going to end up having side effects, having issues and probably stopping therapy.
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| | I always just tell them you need to be committed to this, work with me. I'll work with you. We're going to start moderate doses. We're going to increase some based on your response and your lab results. It's definitely a process. I would say average, probably around three months. Some patients up to six months to get them perfectly dialed in. They're going to start seeing initial benefits for sure in the first month, but to get them perfectly dialed in I would tell them give it the full three to six months to get you perfectly balanced.
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| | Then you asked to compare it to other specialists like family practice or endocrinology. They may never get someone balanced. Looking at a three month process to someone that's never going to get you balanced, that's, you just really can't rush it. You can't be too aggressive with it. Every woman is different. Everyone responds differently.
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| | You just have to take it slow. You can always increase the dose with time. It's not a race. We're not in a rush. We have time, but most often women start seeing some noticeable benefits within the first oftentimes three to four weeks of starting. That's just encouraging to see some improvement and then just know it's going to keep getting better as we get closer and closer to her perfect balance.
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| | It changes over time too as a woman who transitions later in life and gets closer to menopause or past menopause, we're changing the doses, so it's not like you're going to be on the same dose for the rest of your life. Maybe if you're post-menopausal yes, but most women it's sort of like re-evaluate and make adjustments based on her body and how she is responding. Definitely cannot rush the process.
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Jay: | Awesome, awesome. Great answer. Real quick, we're right up at 5:00. We haven't had any other questions come in. Nelson, if you have some questions that you want to get answered real quick.
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Nelson: | Let's talk a little bit about logistics. This video obviously is being uploaded right now to YouTube. It will also be available on ExcelMale.com, PrimeBody.com and FabFitOver40.com
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Jay: | Awesome. Yeah, so Allison, that's what I was going to say. Tell us a little bit about how people who will be eventually watching this video, I'll of course link to it, Nelson will link to it, but how can people work with you and Prime Body?
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Allison : | Yeah, I would say the best way would be to check out our website. It's really easy to remember. It's PrimeBody.com. Then that will have our phone number and email so patients can get in touch with our administrative team. They'll definitely go through the administrative team and then they'll let them know, okay, where do you live? They'll let them know which provider is closest to them and then get them setup to get blood work done and their initial consult.
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| | Definitely going to the website would have all of that information on how to get in touch. The email is pretty easy too. It's just [email protected]. That's pretty easy to remember.
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Jay: | Awesome. Then for a lot of the ladies that will be watching this too, you know Nelson started an awesome discussion group on ******** for women's hormonal replacement therapy and women's hormonal health. There's not enough women in that group. I don't know why we can't get more women to take advantage of it because there's some really strong thought leaders in there.
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| | We'll post a link to that. Is there Allison, any other books or resources? Obviously Nelson's site, Excel Male. I know he has some stuff in there about women's stuff, but is there any sites or books or resources that you would recommend that women check out?
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Allison : | I'm actually on Nelson's ******** group as well and I try to as often as I can go in there and look at the questions. There's great articles posted there. There are also some videos that I've done about what we just covered and they're posted on Prime Body's website. Definitely going to the website you can see some videos and then Nelson's ******** page is great. I would say definitely start there. There's much more detailed videos about the things that we just covered. There's one all about testosterone in women. There's one about physiologic estrogen, progesterone, synthetic versus natural hormones. Those would be worth checking out as well and they're on the website.
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Jay: | Awesome.
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Nelson: | My ******** group is called Women's Health and HRT. Women's Health and HRT. You can find it by just typing that on the search box on top of the ******** page.
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Monica: | I would encourage every woman out there, woman or man, to take responsibility for your own health. Seriously guys, if you don't take responsibility for it do not put it in the hands of a healthcare system because you'll just be a number. You will definitely, you'll regret it and you will wish that you took your health seriously because until you have sickness, you truly do not appreciate your great health.
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| | I've seen it firsthand, so please do what you can, do the research, know your body. Ask questions because when you ask questions you truly learn. That's why, you guys, Nelson is an amazing person. He has years of research involving all of this and he has a free ******** page out there to help people that people aren't even participating in. Wake up. Wake up.
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Nelson: | I don't promote well, so most women are not aware it exists.
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Jay: | No, that's definitely not true.
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Monica: | No, I'm just saying people, wake the F up before you have to pay attention. That's it. I'm out.
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Jay: | Okay. Listen, Allison, again, we really, really, truly appreciate you coming on this show. We're definitely going to have you back. I think that like you said the thyroid issue is paramount. Way too many women are suffering and not enough people are informed. Obviously you speak at an incredibly high level, so we'll set something up I'd say probably this summer. I'd like to have you back on again and we'll promote the living hell out of this hangout.
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| | Again, for everybody who's watching, we appreciate you guys watching. This will be live on Google or on YouTube and then we'll also post it on our blog which is FabFitOver40.com. Then Nelson, you have final words, but remember Nelson's site ExcelMale.com. There's tons of information and of course we encourage all the men out there and ladies too to buy both of our books because they're also very awesome resources on TRT and hormonal optimization.
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Monica: | Amen.
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Nelson: | Thank you Allison. You were great.
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Allison : | Thank you.
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Nelson: | There's a folder on Excel Male called Excel Female, so it's actually a part of Excel Male. I need to create one specifically for women, a whole website, but there is a section on Excel Male for females because a lot of the guys on my side are over 12,000 are getting on TRT, on testosterone replacement, feeling better and then obviously their women may or may not be interested in their higher sex drive. The conversation starts there.
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| | It's either one partner bringing the other one into this progressive, preventative field. That's what I see. Either the female, the woman gets it first. She feels better, she's losing weight. Then she talks to her partner and vice versa. That's why I think men and women should know about male and female health because we all obviously have partners that we can help change their lives. Thank you, Allison. Thank you, Monica. Thank you, Jay. Thank you everybody and look for our next hangout maybe in three weeks.
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Jay: | Yeah, so we're going to have Shaun Noorian the owner of Empower Pharmacy to talk about the compounding business, the compounding pharmacy industry and upcoming changes. It's going to be a really power packed, information packed event. We're excited to have it, so more marketing on that very soon. Again, thanks everybody for coming out. I'm going to go ahead and stop the broadcast.
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Monica: | Real quick, real quick. Nelson. Thank you for all you do. Allison, thank you so much. We appreciate it.
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Jay: | Awesome. Okay guys.
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