Vegan Diets: The Raw Truth

[Will Brink]

There are many controversies regarding the vegan nutritional approach. For those who want the facts on vegan diets, those considering being a vegan, as well as those who are vegans, here is the authoritative article on that topic. In this new article, I have taken on the big task of addressing the major claims of vegan diet proponents to set the record straight. Hint: most of what people think they know is wrong....I think many will find it helpful, be they considering being a vegan, as well as those looking for a single article that addresses claims made by vegans when in a debate over the topic. That's right, I'm taking on the Vegan Industrial Complex...

Vegan Diets, The Raw Truth

 

[Guided_by_Voices]

Lot's of good points so thanks for posting this.

You touched on one of my pet peeves however and that is how people in the mediterranean actually eat in comparison to the westernized version you included. I have yet to see any significant amount of whole grains being sold or eaten, and pasta in Italy is much less of the diet than generally assumed. Breakfast is minimal, people usually walk to and from many meals, and people get some quality sunshine on a regular basis ( a feature of all the blue zones that is never emphasized). The grocery stores I have been to have almost no breakfast foods as westerners would think of them and there are almost no oils other than olive oil. People reading this who want to see what the med diet actually looks like can start by searching on images of the central market in Cadiz Spain, for example. Almost no breads of any kind.

Also a typo, I think you meant to say "one does [not] need to be a scientist" in the nutrients section.

 

[mooseman109]

My lin eof reasoning is we have canine teeth, designed for eating meat, and eyes in the front of our heads. Only predators have fromt set eyes, prey has eyes on sides for better wide vision.
The world i smade up of prey versus predators. We are a predator pire and simple.
Nice artilce, thnaks for posting

 

[Will Brink]

Lot's of good points so thanks for posting this.

You touched on one of my pet peeves however and that is how people in the mediterranean actually eat in comparison to the westernized version you included. I have yet to see any significant amount of whole grains being sold or eaten, and pasta in Italy is much less of the diet than generally assumed. Breakfast is minimal, people usually walk to and from many meals, and people get some quality sunshine on a regular basis ( a feature of all the blue zones that is never emphasized). The grocery stores I have been to have almost no breakfast foods as westerners would think of them and there are almost no oils other than olive oil. People reading this who want to see what the med diet actually looks like can start by searching on images of the central market in Cadiz Spain, for example. Almost no breads of any kind.

Also a typo, I think you meant to say "one does [not] need to be a scientist" in the nutrients section.

Thanx. I think I got that typo.

 

[Gianluca]

nice article, to add to it there are actually no long term studies on the safety of Vegans diet, although we could assume there is if diet is well designed

 

[Vince]

Plant-based diet increases secretion of insulin, incretin hormones in people with type 2 diabetes | News-Medical

 

[Gianluca]

Plant-based diet increases secretion of insulin, incretin hormones in people with type 2 diabetes | News-Medical

I have studying some material for the past 6 months on plant base diets, studies do show improvement in blood glucose reading on plant base diet, still it sounds controversial to me, and I know more than one person who adopted Plant Base but had to switch to higher fats/animal protein later in life due to insulin resistance due to aging

I learned years ago that combining wholegrains with the good fats and some animal protein noticeably decrees insulin secretion Fiber/fats/protein stick in the stomach long, but we can see the effect of plant base (lower fat/no animal protein) on beta cell and insulin seems to enter the cells more efficiently as well.

if I remember correctly @Vince you opted for lower carbs more fat

I do best, I believe, with mt fats around 30 and some animal protein in the diet

 

[Vince]

I have studying some material for the past 6 months on plant base diets, studies do show improvement in blood glucose reading on plant base diet, still it sounds controversial to me, and I know more than one person who adopted Plant Base but had to switch to higher fats/animal protein later in life due to insulin resistance due to aging

I learned years ago that combining wholegrains with the good fats and some animal protein noticeably decrees insulin secretion Fiber/fats/protein stick in the stomach long, but we can see the effect of plant base (lower fat/no animal protein) on beta cell and insulin seems to enter the cells more efficiently as well.

if I remember correctly @Vince you opted for lower carbs more fat

I do best, I believe, with mt fats around 30 and some animal protein in the diet

Yes I follow low carb diet. I do eat vegetables, but only non-starchy vegetables. I gave up fruit a long time ago.
I always enjoy eating vegetables even before I went on a healthy low carb diet.

 

[Nelson Vergel]

Substitution of animal-based with plant-based foods on cardiometabolic health and all-cause mortality: a systematic review and meta-analysis of prospective studies - BMC Medicine

Background There is growing evidence that substituting animal-based with plant-based foods is associated with a lower risk of cardiovascular diseases (CVD), type 2 diabetes (T2D), and all-cause mortality. Our aim was to summarize and evaluate the evidence for the substitution of any animal-based...

bmcmedicine.biomedcentral.com

 

[Deleted member 43589]

Will Brink? Holy crap, there is a name from the past. Will Brink was a member of a USENET mail group I had back in the early 90's...good article Will.

In the early 90's I had a discussion with a nutrition researcher at the Shriner's Burn Hospital in Galveston, Texas about "what is the optimal diet." To sum it up he told me the fact that humans have existed for so long tells us they we are able to adapt to ay nutrient ratio or foods. We still don't know what optimal is.

One thing we have to consider is humans don't have is a rumen, the large first compartment of the stomach of a cud-chewing mammal (as a cow) in which cellulose is broken down by the action of microorganisms and in which food is stored prior to chewing.

One thing I am very leery of at the present is this sudden push to plant based foods and the sudden release of research telling us it is better that meat. caveat emptor! Humans do not have the enzymes needed to break down cellulose.

What are the side effects of too much cellulose in the diet......gas, bloating and diarrhea

 

[Deleted member 43589]

Well, vegans, this surely ain't such good news.....the long term effects of veganism and its association with risks of ischaemic heart disease and stroke.

Risks of ischaemic heart disease and stroke in meat eaters, fish eaters, and vegetarians over 18 years of follow-up: results from the prospective EPIC-Oxford study

Objective To examine the associations of vegetarianism with risks of ischaemic heart disease and stroke. Design Prospective cohort study. Setting The EPIC-Oxford study, a cohort in the United Kingdom with a large proportion of non-meat eaters, recruited across the country between 1993 and...

www.bmj.com

https://www.bmj.com/content/366/bmj.l4897#

​

Abstract
Objective To examine the associations of vegetarianism with risks of ischaemic heart disease and stroke.
Design Prospective cohort study.
Setting The EPIC-Oxford study, a cohort in the United Kingdom with a large proportion of non-meat eaters, recruited across the country between 1993 and 2001.
Participants 48 188 participants with no history of ischaemic heart disease, stroke, or angina (or cardiovascular disease) were classified into three distinct diet groups: meat eaters (participants who consumed meat, regardless of whether they consumed fish, dairy, or eggs; n=24 428), fish eaters (consumed fish but no meat; n=7506), and vegetarians including vegans (n=16 254), based on dietary information collected at baseline, and subsequently around 2010 (n=28 364).
Main outcome measures Incident cases of ischaemic heart disease and stroke (including ischaemic and haemorrhagic types) identified through record linkage until 2016.

Results Over 18.1 years of follow-up, 2820 cases of ischaemic heart disease and 1072 cases of total stroke (519 ischaemic stroke and 300 haemorrhagic stroke) were recorded. After adjusting for sociodemographic and lifestyle confounders, fish eaters and vegetarians had 13% (hazard ratio 0.87, 95% confidence interval 0.77 to 0.99) and 22% (0.78, 0.70 to 0.87) lower rates of ischaemic heart disease than meat eaters, respectively (P<0.001 for heterogeneity). This difference was equivalent to 10 fewer cases of ischaemic heart disease (95% confidence interval 6.7 to 13.1 fewer) in vegetarians than in meat eaters per 1000 population over 10 years. The associations for ischaemic heart disease were partly attenuated after adjustment for self reported high blood cholesterol, high blood pressure, diabetes, and body mass index (hazard ratio 0.90, 95% confidence interval 0.81 to 1.00 in vegetarians with all adjustments). By contrast, vegetarians had 20% higher rates of total stroke (hazard ratio 1.20, 95% confidence interval 1.02 to 1.40) than meat eaters, equivalent to three more cases of total stroke (95% confidence interval 0.8 to 5.4 more) per 1000 population over 10 years, mostly due to a higher rate of haemorrhagic stroke. The associations for stroke did not attenuate after further adjustment of disease risk factors.

Conclusions In this prospective cohort in the UK, fish eaters and vegetarians had lower rates of ischaemic heart disease than meat eaters, although vegetarians had higher rates of haemorrhagic and total stroke.

Again, I am very leery of all the recent studies proving to us one and for all that people who eat meat are going to die. Especially now that these fake meats and bugs are being pushed over real meat. Am I saying don't eat vegetables? Absolutely not, stop eating these highly restrictive diets and instead consume a balanced diet. Humans are not cows.

 

[TLR]

I eat some fruits and vegetables, however the bulk of my diet is meat, eggs, nuts and cheese…if there ever came a time I had nothing but vegetables to eat I would do it…but I wouldn’t be happy about it!!