Trt and suboxone (specifically)

[Zooulie12]

So I made sure to look if anyone has posted about this before, was unable to find anything about suboxone. I saw people post about opioids but not suboxone. I actually couldn’t find a lot on the internet either. I’m just wondering if there are people on here who are on testosterone therapy and suboxone as well and it’s going well for them. Like no major issues. Or if you were on suboxone went on trt then got off the suboxone. I’ve been on it for 4 years. Pain issues (I get it legally). But I do know it’s probably what tanked my testosterone in the first place. And yes I asked this awhile ago. I am just re asking because I am literally driving 3 states over to see a trt doctor who nationally known. My luck of doctors here has been bad. So I guess I am just wondering if it’s the suboxone that is giving me bad luck or is it the doctors in Minnesota. There have been multiple occasions where the T works great. Other times I feel like crap and loose my libido completely.

 

[Sean Mosher]

if you're seeing a well known optimization doctor then you should be fine.
As far as staying on suboxone with TRT...........I can't imagine why there would be a problem with that.
I work for a pain doc and we have 2 patients i can think of who are on TRT and suboxone.
The goal should be to eventually wean off the suboxone though, even if it's a super long taper if that's what's needed.
We also see tons of men with opiate addictions or who have been on opiates for a long period of time and it absolutely is a major androgen suppressor.

 

[swoops36]

I’m actually taking Suboxone (6mg/day) and on TRT (200mg/week). I started the TRT before starting the Subs, and haven’t noticed any difference in how I feel. I read a study a while back that showed Sub has less endocrine supression than Methadone or other opiates. I’ll search and see if I can find it, but if you want to look for it, I just typed in Suboxone testosterone suppression and it was one of the hits.

 

[swoops36]

Here’s the study. It’s an animal study, but references other studies of Bupe and testosterone. It might be helpful.

Hypogonadism and Low Testosterone Levels as a Side Effect of Methadone and Buprenorphine

 

[30005Gator]

Opioids essentially shut down the pituitary and will tank your T.

I also believe that low testosterone is a catalyst to addiction. There is plenty of research on opioids causing low T, but I STRONGLY believe that low T makes a genetically addiction-prone male more susceptible to addiction.

 

[swoops36]

I agree completely. Stopping opiates and starting a Sub program was a big part of my overall health reboot.

 

[Zooulie12]

I agree completely. Stopping opiates and starting a Sub program was a big part of my overall health reboot.

Yeah what I am asking more so, is can you still have the benefits of trt even if you are on a low dose of suboxone. I am on the suboxone to keep me away from opiates obviously.

 

[Zooulie12]

Here’s the study. It’s an animal study, but references other studies of Bupe and testosterone. It might be helpful.

Hypogonadism and Low Testosterone Levels as a Side Effect of Methadone and Buprenorphine

Interesting study. It sounds like methadone is way worse.

 

[swoops36]

It’s been 9 months doing both for me, and I have all the benefits I expected to have starting TRT. I’m tapering off the Subs, slowly, but I feel great.

 

[Zooulie12]

I’m actually taking Suboxone (6mg/day) and on TRT (200mg/week). I started the TRT before starting the Subs, and haven’t noticed any difference in how I feel. I read a study a while back that showed Sub has less endocrine supression than Methadone or other opiates. I’ll search and see if I can find it, but if you want to look for it, I just typed in Suboxone testosterone suppression and it was one of the hits.

Have you felt your libido come back (if you lost it) has your energy picked up at all since doing the trt with suboxone?

 

[Zooulie12]

Have you felt your libido come back (if you lost it) has your energy picked up at all since doing the trt with suboxone?

Are you currently at 6mg or is that what you have tapered down too?

 

[swoops36]

Yes to both. At first I didn’t feel great, still low libido and sluggish, and thought it was the Subs. But bloodwork showed e2 <5 (non-sensitive method), and once I cleared that up all is great

 

[swoops36]

I started at 8mg, did 6 months of that, then dropped 1mg a month, now at 6mg. Next month I go to 5mg, etc.

 

[Zooulie12]

I started at 8mg, did 6 months of that, then dropped 1mg a month, now at 6mg. Next month I go to 5mg, etc.

So you have been on trt for 9 months? I am tapering off suboxone as well. I heard it gets tough when get below that 1mg mark.

 

[swoops36]

I’ve been on TRT for 12 months, about, and Subs for 9, but I was still dialing in my program when I started the Subs, so it was hard to say what impact, if any, they have had. But I know I feel great now, and when I corrected my low e2, I started feeling good & forgetting my afternoon Sub dose, so that’s when we decided to start the looooong, slow taper. I’ve heard it gets hard at that point too, so when I get to 2mg I will start lowering by .5mg instead of 1.

 

[Zooulie12]

I’ve been on TRT for 12 months, about, and Subs for 9, but I was still dialing in my program when I started the Subs, so it was hard to say what impact, if any, they have had. But I know I feel great now, and when I corrected my low e2, I started feeling good & forgetting my afternoon Sub dose, so that’s when we decided to start the looooong, slow taper. I’ve heard it gets hard at that point too, so when I get to 2mg I will start lowering by .5mg instead of 1.

Do you steer clear of an AI? Yeah and my sub doc was telling me. Are dopamine receptors only can really handle no more then 3mg of suboxone per day. So like yeah it’s not dangerous to be on 8mg. That’s what I was on until I started tampering down. But she did say that 3mg a day will get most people by. How do you break your suboxone up? I do 4mgs a day and just do a 1/4th every 4 hrs.

 

[swoops36]

No, I Aromatize a lot, actually, and was taking 3mg A a week, on 200mg T. My first labs on that, e2 was 11.6 and I felt ok. 8 weeks later I felt like shit and it was at < 5, so backed off to no AI for about 10 days and felt my e2 come back, libido returned, no more sugar cravings, could get out of bed, etc. So now I take .5mg A with each shot, and if I feel I need another .5mg, I’ll take it. I feel like I’m high-normal e2 now, and will get labs end of the month.

As for the Subs, I didn’t know about the 3mg thing, but from reading around and watching YouTube, there’s 101 ways to use Suboxone, and there’s no consensus on what’s right or wrong. I wasn’t on hard drugs, just painkillers, and at a low dose, so my doc started me on 8mg daily, and I never went over that. But when e2 is low, you can take 3 strips and not feel it, because lack of estrogen downgrades dopamine receptors. Had me very confused for weeks, trying to find the right balance.

So I started doing 4mg when I woke up, 2mg 3p and 2mg at bedtime. That kinda mirrored my pill routine, so it was easy for me. And I’m cutting those doses down, but keeping the 3-times a day schedule. Eventually, I figure I’ll be taking 1-2mg in the AM and that’s it. Watching those “Suboxone withdrawal is Hell” videos on YouTube makes me nervous tho.

 

[swoops36]

Oh, and I like your dosing plan too. I figured taking smaller doses throughout the day, like I did with pills, is a good way to integrate the Subs into your daily routine and keep cravings down

 

[Tpaulr1]

It’s been 9 months doing both for me, and I have all the benefits I expected to have starting TRT. I’m tapering off the Subs, slowly, but I feel great.

What clinic are you using? I’ve been on Suboxone for 2 years. I started trt 3 months ago. The first month I was on 200mg/week and felt like I had my life back. Then they lowered me to 140mg/week and all the benefits have left and I feel like crap again but they won’t put me back at 200mg. It’s very frustrating. I’ve been trying to research this topic.

 

[Jerry33]

What were your testosterone blood levels before you started trt and what were they after you started 200mgs of testosterone and what are they on 140mgs of testosterone? Thanks man!