Not sure where to go from here

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kmarcetjr

New Member
Well here is my story.
Two months ago I saw my Dr (primary care) for my annnual checkup, he ordered some blood work as usual, but doesn't normally check for low t, even though most of the patients I see in his waiting room might be suffering from low t just from their age. Anyway he said all my bloods were fine and I am very healthy for my age, just take levrothyroxine for my hypothyroidism, been taking it for about 5 years now. So I said well why am I so worn out all the time? No sex drive? Fatigue? Seriously I feel like I need a nap 3 hours after I wake up from a normal nights sleep. I had in the back of my mind suspected low t, knowing some of the symptoms. So he agreed to check my testosterone levels. Two weeks later I went back for a follow up visit. I have good total t 685, low free t 49.0 and high shbg levels 70. So thats why I have low t symptoms. No obvious reason for the high shbg levels. My thyroid meds are right on the money, I haven't had a drink of alcohol in 3 months, I only drink 2 cups of coffee a day, no other sources of caffiene or other stimulants. So my Dr gave me a referal for an endocronologist. When I got to see her two week later, she said I am suffering from all the classic symptoms of low t from the high shbg levels. She said I am a candidate for TRT, but wants me to try some OTC supps and lifestyle changes first. She gave me a few supps to try, vitamin d, zinc and stinging nettle root. I'm due back to see her in a few months. I did a little more research and found some more supps that might help, or might do nothing at all. So here is what I am taking:
vitamin d, zinc, boron, magnesium, stinging nettle root, horny goat weed, tongkat ali, ashwaganhda root, ginseng, tribulus and fenugreek.

So know I've been taking all this stuff for a little over a month and I feel a little better, man parts seem to be working a little better, morning erections 2 or 3 days a week, more ejaculate matter, not feeling as fatigued as I was more muscle strength, not so run down all the time. But the supps are a little on the expensive side, about $90 per month from online store. I'm about 2 weeks away from ordering some blood tests to see where I stand, if the supps and diet changes have made any difference. I'm tired of all the supps though, all those tablets and capsules, even splitting them up morning and night is a hassle. Honestly at this point I might just do self administered TRT, Start injecting 200mg of test e every week to get my t levels nice and high and drive down the shbg levels, get blood work done in 3 months and see where I stand.

Thoughts?
 
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CoastWatcher

Moderator
Well here is my story.
Two months ago I saw my Dr (primary care) for my annnual checkup, he ordered some blood work as usual, but doesn't normally check for low t, even though most of the patients I see in his waiting room might be suffering from low t just from their age. Anyway he said all my bloods were fine and I am very healthy for my age, just take levrothyroxine for my hypothyroidism, been taking it for about 5 years now. So I said well why am I so worn out all the time? No sex drive? Fatigue? Seriously I feel like I need a nap 3 hours after I wake up from a normal nights sleep. I had in the back of my mind suspected low t, knowing some of the symptoms. So he agreed to check my testosterone levels. Two weeks later I went back for a follow up visit. I have good total t 685, low free t 49.0 and high shbg levels 70. So thats why I have low t symptoms. No obvious reason for the high shbg levels. My thyroid meds are right on the money, I haven't had a drink of alcohol in 3 months, I only drink 2 cups of coffee a day, no other sources of caffiene or other stimulants. So my Dr gave me a referal for an endocronologist. When I got to see her two week later, she said I am suffering from all the classic symptoms of low t from the high shbg levels. She said I am a candidate for TRT, but wants me to try some OTC supps and lifestyle changes first. She gave me a few supps to try, vitamin d, zinc and stinging nettle root. I'm due back to see her in a few months. I did a little more research and found some more supps that might help, or might do nothing at all. So here is what I am taking:
vitamin d, zinc, boron, magnesium, stinging nettle root, horny goat weed, tongkat ali, ashwaganhda root, ginseng, tribulus and fenugreek.

So know I've been taking all this stuff for a little over a month and I feel a little better, man parts seem to be working a little better, morning erections 2 or 3 days a week, more ejaculate matter, not feeling as fatigued as I was more muscle strength, not so run down all the time. But the supps are a little on the expensive side, about $90 per month from online store. I'm about 2 weeks away from ordering some blood tests to see where I stand, if the supps and diet changes have made any difference. I'm tired of all the supps though, all those tablets and capsules, even splitting them up morning and night is a hassle. Honestly at this point I might just do self administered TRT, Start injecting 200mg of test e every week to get my t levels nice and high and drive down the shbg levels, get blood work done in 3 months and see where I stand.

Thoughts?

If you are genuinely hypogonadal, with oddly reasonable total testosterone but low free testosterone and high SHBG, these supplements are not going to turn you around and raise your overall levels; it simply isn't going to happen. Your levels present certain challenges, and what you really need is capable care. Where do you live? Do you need a referral for good care?
 

Vince

Super Moderator
To lower shbg, vitamin D3 will help, I supplement with 6000iu for good levels of D. Some doctors prescribe Danazol to lower shbg and increase free testosterone in men.
 

kmarcetjr

New Member
If you are genuinely hypogonadal, with oddly reasonable total testosterone but low free testosterone and high SHBG, these supplements are not going to turn you around and raise your overall levels; it simply isn't going to happen. Your levels present certain challenges, and what you really need is capable care. Where do you live? Do you need a referral for good care?

I live in Venice Florida, small town, close to Sarasota, bigger city. Yeah that is what I'm afraid of in reference to the supps, honestly I feel better on them, but not like my normal self. My endo, has already stated that under her care, I'm a candidate for TRT, I'm due back to see her in a few more months. I just want to feel better, and get through a whole week without needing to take a nap in the middle of the afternoon.
 

FatGoat

New Member
Sounds like you are taking initiative and control of your own health. From what I've read on this board, TRT therapy requires commitment and lifestyle changes. It may be possible your doctor is testing the waters with your commitment levels rather than expecting the supps to change your outcomes.
 

ratbag

Member
I've never seen an endocrinologist do anything right with TRT. Your in Florida... go see Defy they are a site sponsor here and they don't charge a lot and they are local to you. The MD's at Defy have forgotten more about TRT than your endo has ever learned about it. Seriously, go see the MD's who understand this. It's not as simple as endo's think.
 

kmarcetjr

New Member
To lower shbg, vitamin D3 will help, I supplement with 6000iu for good levels of D. Some doctors prescribe Danazol to lower shbg and increase free testosterone in men.

Well I'm already taking 10,000 Iu's of D3. Along with stinging nettle root extract.
 

kmarcetjr

New Member
Sounds like you are taking initiative and control of your own health. From what I've read on this board, TRT therapy requires commitment and lifestyle changes. It may be possible your doctor is testing the waters with your commitment levels rather than expecting the supps to change your outcomes.

Well from what I have read on this forum and a few others shbg is a regulator that is hard to lower and even harder raise if you have very low shbg levels. I have read that raising testosterone helps, my total t was 685 when I was tested almost 2 months ago, so I could go higher with TRT to the upper limit of the normal range 1000-1100 and hopefully that would drive down the shbg level.
 

kmarcetjr

New Member
I've never seen an endocrinologist do anything right with TRT. Your in Florida... go see Defy they are a site sponsor here and they don't charge a lot and they are local to you. The MD's at Defy have forgotten more about TRT than your endo has ever learned about it. Seriously, go see the MD's who understand this. It's not as simple as endo's think.

Well I filled out the form on Defy's website and recieved an email from them explaining their services. I might go that route, I just don't know what to do.
 

captain

Active Member
I recall that T4 increases SHBG so I would be looking at that a little harder. What did you go on Thyroid for to start with?
 

kmarcetjr

New Member
I recall that T4 increases SHBG so I would be looking at that a little harder. What did you go on Thyroid for to start with?

I started on levrothroxine about 5 years ago to treat my hypothyroidism, my new (at the time Dr) cought in in his new patient blood work. He said my levels were levels he would have expected to see in a patient in their 70's. But my last annual checkup back in April, my throid numbers were fine, I don't remember the actual numbers.
 

CoastWatcher

Moderator
Well I filled out the form on Defy's website and recieved an email from them explaining their services. I might go that route, I just don't know what to do.
That's exactly right - you don't know what to do, yet you are discussing engaging in various courses of self treatment. I suggest that in following that route you'd quickly find yourself in deep water. It's an unfortunate reality that most of us struggle to find competent medical care. However, it does exist, Defy provides care that is second to none. Spend some money and some time and discuss your challenges with people who can guide you through the challenges you face.
 

kmarcetjr

New Member
That's exactly right - you don't know what to do, yet you are discussing engaging in various courses of self treatment. I suggest that in following that route you'd quickly find yourself in deep water. It's an unfortunate reality that most of us struggle to find competent medical care. However, it does exist, Defy provides care that is second to none. Spend some money and some time and discuss your challenges with people who can guide you through the challenges you face.

Yes, that's right, I'm taking supps now, may or may not be working, but probably not too harmful.
It would be good if someone who was admittingly self administering TRT would chime in with some actual personal experience.
I may to to Defy, I just don't know yet.
If I did decide to self administer I'm sure I wouldn't be the first or the last. Yes there is a possiblity that it could make me worse or there is the possibility that it could make me better.

Y
 

captain

Active Member
I started on levrothroxine about 5 years ago to treat my hypothyroidism, my new (at the time Dr) cought in in his new patient blood work. He said my levels were levels he would have expected to see in a patient in their 70's. But my last annual checkup back in April, my throid numbers were fine, I don't remember the actual numbers.
I would keep an open mind as fine is only ones opinion. Your T is 685 so your probably not primary or secondary hypo. I would look into other things before going on TRT for life. There is a range of normal thyroid level for you to be in so its adjustable.
 

kmarcetjr

New Member
I would keep an open mind as fine is only ones opinion. Your T is 685 so your probably not primary or secondary hypo. I would look into other things before going on TRT for life. There is a range of normal thyroid level for you to be in so its adjustable.

Well I guess I could get it checked again, but as how my Dr said it's ok, I don't think I want to mess with the dosage much, I've been at the same prescription level for about 3 years now, long before the symptoms of high shbg came along.
 

ratbag

Member
You have a shbg problem and a thyroid problem. Thyroid if mis-treated can cause all the bad symptoms you are having and most endocrinologists only treat thyroid with levrothroxine because they only look at the TSH. Defy looks at all the thyroid labs and they don't just treat with levrothroxine. I had a similar problem my endo used levrothroxine only and none of my symptoms changed. When I got fed up with it all and saw a TRT specialist he said I needed cytomel as well as levrothroxine. So I went on it and the difference was huge. Bottom line is it's very unlikely your endocrinologist will improve your symptoms. This is why there are hormone specialists that are not part of the hospital system and why they do not take insurance because it limits what they can do. If your FT3 is low and you do need cytomel like so many do with thyroid problems then that alone could improve your shbg. But you will never know that if you self-treat.
 

kmarcetjr

New Member
You have a shbg problem and a thyroid problem. Thyroid if mis-treated can cause all the bad symptoms you are having and most endocrinologists only treat thyroid with levrothroxine because they only look at the TSH. Defy looks at all the thyroid labs and they don't just treat with levrothroxine. I had a similar problem my endo used levrothroxine only and none of my symptoms changed. When I got fed up with it all and saw a TRT specialist he said I needed cytomel as well as levrothroxine. So I went on it and the difference was huge. Bottom line is it's very unlikely your endocrinologist will improve your symptoms. This is why there are hormone specialists that are not part of the hospital system and why they do not take insurance because it limits what they can do. If your FT3 is low and you do need cytomel like so many do with thyroid problems then that alone could improve your shbg. But you will never know that if you self-treat.

Well maybe it's worth a shot with defy, seems pretty pricey and I'm not too sure I can afford it. But maybe I'll give them a call this week.
 

ratbag

Member
Your spending what $90. per month on supps that most of us know won't change your long term health. You obviously have the $$, just spend it effectively and you'll be way ahead in your health.
 

kmarcetjr

New Member
Your spending what $90. per month on supps that most of us know won't change your long term health. You obviously have the $$, just spend it effectively and you'll be way ahead in your health.

Well, vitamin d and zinc are well documented for free testosterone. But I have started the process of becoming a Defy patient. I talked to a guy there think his name was Adam, he told me more about what they do and how to start the process. I called my primary care Dr and requested all my lab work from my annual exam and my total t, free t, shbg and bio available t all be sent to Defy. I may or may not need additional tests. He told me I can have all my labs done locally and talk to the staff at their office by telephone. He gave me the run down of the costs. So now I just have to wait for them to get my labs from my Dr.
 
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