Defy -My pre consult bloods

[EhEhRon]

Hey guys, my first post but I’ve been a lurker for a few months now. I just got my blood test results and I’m a bit concerned. Here’s the story ...

I’m 29. I’ve been having severe low test symptoms for a round a year now. I decided to check out my options and saw TRT May help me. I went to a doctor here locally who tested my TT and FT, SHBG and albumin. This was on 7/10. Here’s the results:

TT: 76L with range of 280-1,100

FT: 1.68L with range of 1.9-27

SHBG: 23 with range of 14.55-94.64

Albumin: 4.3 with range of 3.2-4.8

LH 2.7 range of 1.7-8.6

FSH 3.5 range of 1.5-12.4

Estradiol 16.7 range of 11.3-43.2

Prolactin 7.7 range of 4.1-18.4

TSH 2.63 range of 0.27-4.2

He immediately wanted to give me a full panel of blood tests and likely put me on TRT. I would have done that but he was too expensive. Then I found Defy Medical. Price is good so I got the test results you see attached here. The test was taken on 8/15.

Since my first test on 7/10 I’ve had some serious family stuff going on. I’ve been overly stressed and I’ve never eaten so poorly in my life. Lots of sugar and carbs, ya know, stuff that makes you feel less terrible in the now, but worse in the future.

Here’s the out-of-range with my most recent test, with the ranges for testosterone and SHBG being the same as the first. The rest of my bloods were all within normal ranges, including glucose. I also took the SARM Ostarine for about three weeks then stopped it because I was having bouts of hypoglycemia, which I’ve never had before. I shouldn’t have tried SARMs, I just wanted a little help with all of my symptoms but I was afraid I couldn’t afford TRT.

TT: 121L

SHBG: 7L

Triglycerides: 156 with normal being less that 150

HDL: 26 with normal being at least 40

Every test I’ve ever had has been healthy cholesterol, healthy sugar, healthy liver.

The cholesterol doesn’t worry me too much as I was recently tested and it was fine. I’m most concerned with the SHBG. I’ve been reading that the lower it is the less effective TRT is. Besides that there’s the health problems associated with low SHBG.

Should I spend the money to get my consultation with Dr. Saya, Or should I wait and get tested again in a month or so. I really want to get this taken care of but I don’t want this most recent test to alter a regular protocol for me with such low TT. I would like his in depth review but, again, I want it to be true to my normal levels. And I don’t want him to simply tell me to wait and try the tests again now that I’m back on my normal diet and back to the gym. I can’t afford two consultations.

 

[MarkM]

Welcome to ExcelMale!

Okay...a couple of things here..........the first consult with Defy is a free consultation. You have nothing to lose so you should go forward.

Your labs are screwed up because you have been taking Ostarine, MK-2866. Based on what I have read, Ostarine can shut down your natural testosterone production if taken in cycles of 4 weeks or more. Just a 3 mg dose daily can reduce SHBG levels 60 to 80%. Ostarine also can decrease your HDL.

This could be why your testosterone is so low and is very likely why your SHBG has fallen to a lonely 7. Your LH and FSH are on the low end but I really don't know if that is because of the Ostarine or if you have secondary hypogonadism. You said you took Ostarine because of all the low T symptoms you were having but Ostarine does not alleviate low T symptoms.

Your TSH at 2.63, while within range, is too high. You need a full thyroid panel which would include: TSH, Free T3, Free T4, Reverse T3, and the two thyroid antibodies. An under perfroming thyorid can give you low T symptoms.

I did not see Estradiol on your labs but you said it was 16.7. Was that the Roche ECLIA test or the Estradiol Sensitive, LC/MS/MS assay? The Roche ECLIA is for women and only the LC/MS/MS is accurate for me. Either way, at 16.7 it is low and probably due to the Ostarine. It shut down your natural testosterone production and the estradiol is formulated in men from testosterone through an aromatse enzyme. So you shutdown your testosterone and therefore basically shutting down the production of estradiol.

I would talk to Defy because you need an intelligent medical professional coaching you right now so you can stop guessing how to self medicate yourself.

If you weren't on the Ostarine much more than a month or so things will get back to normal before too long but if you have been taking the Ostarine for a longer period of time it will take longer.

 

[EhEhRon]

Thank you, Mark. Seriously, thank you for your detailed comment. The Ostarine was taken for just over three weeks. I began it shortly after my first tests taken on 7/10, so those levels are legit as well. I took the Ostarine because it took me days to recover from minor work in the gym, and I just wanted some help with keeping what little muscle I have now while I was dieting. I didn’t take it to boost testosterone; I just wanted something to help get my body back to what I use to be. It’s been a strange month. Ostarine shouldn’t have shut down my test that much, especially since I was taking an otc test booster (not sure that works), and I hadn’t even taken it for a full month.

The Estradiol at 16.7 was from before I began Ostarine. The blood tests that are in the images attached are all from about a week after I dropped the Ostarine. The results that I typed from 7/10 (the first set of typed results) are all from before Ostarine. Sorry that it’s confusing.

The Estradiol Sensitive is in the results that are in the attached images.

Also, I had the initial consult with Jesse from Defy; I’m talking about the consultation with Dr. after these tests. That cost is $250. I am willing to pay that, of course.

 

[MarkM]

I don't think those OTC test boosters work at all. But they sure sell a lot of that stuff. I can't see the Estradiol results. Might have been cut off the page but I believe you that it was 16.7, which is very low.

You know your financial situation better than anyone of course so if you feel like you need to wait on your consult then that is your call and I respect that. Poor health and a poor well being has its cost and takes it toll too. They may want to wait until you get the Ostarine out of your system and restest after that.

I would call Jesse at Defy and explain what happened and he may tell you to wait until your system is cleared up.

 

[EhEhRon]

Yeah ... it worked on me. They got my money, but I knew something was off. When I went to the first doctor and found out how low my testosterone was (76 without Ostarine) I knew something had to be done, but $275 a month for TRT is not feasible, so I figured try a testosterone booster and see if it helps.

I will pay that initial fee of $250, absolutely. But I don’t want to pay it twice, as nobody would. I’m not saying that I’d have to do that, I just don’t want them to simply tell me to retest and come back. I don’t want to wait at all; I want to talk to them now. I feel like I need TRT, but from what I’ve seen on this forum, Dr. Saya knows what he’s doing and will help me on the right path.

I am set on getting actual help from a doctor that knows what they’re doing, and I’m done trying to take care of it myself. The only thing that is really off from the Ostarine compared to tests I’ve had in the past is the HDL and the SHBG. The testosterone has been very low each test.

Thanks again.

 

[MarkM]

I think you will be pleased with Dr Saya. Just explain like you did here and all will be fine. With a low SHBG even before the Ostarine you will likely be on an every other day injection (EOD) and not less than every 3 to 3.5 days. When people have low SHBG multiple injections per week normally give them the highest success. I am sure Dr Saya will discuss that with you.

Keep us updated on how it goes. Best wishes!

 

[Jesse-Defy]

Keep in mind that the initial consult is $250, but that is only the first consult, you'll never pay that for a consult again. A follow up with a doctor is $120, with a mid level it's $90 and with an RN it's $50.

 

[Vince Carter]

An E2 of 16.7 is NOT low, given his SHBG. If he had a Free Estradiol lab test it would probably be at over the lab range.

We need to remember this when making remarks about someone's E2 numbers.

 

[MarkM]

An E2 of 16.7 is NOT low, given his SHBG. If he had a Free Estradiol lab test it would probably be at over the lab range.

We need to remember this when making remarks about someone's E2 numbers.

Okay then, I guess you would also say his TT of 121 is NOT low, given his SHBG? Low is low. If his E2 was 10 and he felt good, his E2 is still technically low. Regardless of the number, it boils down to how the individual feels.

 

[EhEhRon]

Thank you, Jesse.

My latest E2 is at 23.7. The 16.7 was on 7/10.

16.7 was when my SHBG was in normal range. 23.7 was when my SHBG was well below normal.

76 TT was when my SHBG was normal.
121 TT was when my SHBG was well below normal.

1.68 FT was with normal SHBG.
4.02 FT was with SHBG was well below normal.

 

[MarkM]

Ron,

I believe Defy will help you get things worked out! Good luck.

 

[Vince Carter]

Okay then, I guess you would also say his TT of 121 is NOT low, given his SHBG? Low is low. If his E2 was 10 and he felt good, his E2 is still technically low. Regardless of the number, it boils down to how the individual feels.

Try it again:
An E2 of 16.7 is NOT low, given his SHBG. If he had a Free Estradiol lab test it would probably be at over the lab range.

We need to remember this when making remarks about someone's E2 numbers.

 

[MarkM]

Let's not hijack Ron's thread because we disagree. He is working with Defy, who is more knowledgeable than either one of us, and I am sure they will point him in the right direction and give him better advice than, at least, I, possibly could. I'm just here to try to assist others with my limited knowledge.

 

[Nelson Vergel]

I agree. Low is low. E2 under 20 pg/ml can be associated with bone density issues. His E2 will go up when his T goes up.

I have no idea why people take SARMS. They are not anabolic but they cause side effects similar to anabolics (HPTA shut down, decreased HDL, etc)

 

[EhEhRon]

I agree. Low is low. E2 under 20 pg/ml can be associated with bone density issues. His E2 will go up when his T goes up.

I have no idea why people take SARMS. They are not anabolic but they cause side effects similar to anabolics (HPTA shut down, decreased HDL, etc)

I agree on the SARMs. Ya live and ya learn.