Daily injections - Timing

[Krocco]

Hi gyus!
Been on trt about 4 years of now. I startes with local doctors standard failure: 1000mg nebido inkection every 12 weeks. Well suprise surprise it didn't really work... I changed doctor and got him to prescribe sustanon25. Starting from 250mg every 3 weeks (hooray) anf after bloods he prescribed it every 2 weeks.. then the estradiol rise too high and he pressed the panic button and stopped my trt at once. Well I didn't panic, I went to see an specialist to our contrys capital and he put me on sustanon 250mg every 10 days and anastrozole. After bloods he told me to inject 125mg every 5 days to control etradiol better and eventually it changed to 83mg e3.5d protocol..
Estradiol is damn big problem for me.. so after trial and error I'm now going to go with enanthate 25mg ED and a tiny drop of scrotal tostran-gel to up DHT wich is low on me with just injections protocol. Goal is to eliminate anastrozol usage complitely. Just one thing makes me wonder and I'd like to hear more opinnions:
Wich is better? To inject TestE in the morning when it peaks at night (and gel at the morning ofcourse) or should I pin testE at the eavening to make it peak in the morning when the gel peak also occurs? The later option would better mimic the natural circadian rhytm.. or does it really matter at this point at all??

 

[Vince]

I would think 16mg of testosterone enanthate every day would be a better starting dose. You need a lot less testosterone daily then you would weekly. I would inject in the morning, I'm sure it will work fine and it'd be a lot easier than doing it at night.

 

[Krocco]

I would think 16mg of testosterone enanthate every day would be a better starting dose. You need a lot less testosterone daily then you would weekly. I would inject in the morning, I'm sure it will work fine and it'd be a lot easier than doing it at night.

I'm and hypermetabolizer, forgot to mention this.. if I would do 240mg at a time me prescription is 250mg every week. 25mg a day should keep me somewhere around 1000-1200 ng/dl what seems to be optimal for me.. At my home country is hard to get to trt, and eaven harder to find a good doctor who knows what he is doing.. but once you manage to find that the prescription dosages are hell lot higher than in the USA.. 175mg a week is where our trt-specialists star and up the dosage if needed. "A man must have mans levels" said my doc...

 

[Vince]

My protocol is 16 mg of testosterone cypionate daily, 500 iu of HCG twice a week, 25 mg of DHEA and no AI.

testosterone serum 1117 ng/dL range 264 - 916
Free T 30.3 pg/mL range 6.6 - 18.1
DHEA - Sulfate 347.3 range 48.9 - 344.2
Estradiol, Sensitive 29.5 range 8.0 - 35.0
SHBG 48.8 range 19.3 - 76.4
HCT 47.9 range 37.5 - 51.0

Reply

 

[Krocco]

My protocol is 16 mg of testosterone cypionate daily, 500 iu of HCG twice a week, 25 mg of DHEA and no AI.

testosterone serum 1117 ng/dL range 264 - 916
Free T 30.3 pg/mL range 6.6 - 18.1
DHEA - Sulfate 347.3 range 48.9 - 344.2
Estradiol, Sensitive 29.5 range 8.0 - 35.0
SHBG 48.8 range 19.3 - 76.4
HCT 47.9 range 37.5 - 51.0

I don't have HCG or anything else but test in my regime.. tried HCG once, took it 100IU a day and it blow-up my e2, range is <0.15 pmol/l for men in the scale we use here.. and with 175mg test per week, 100IU hcg ED, and eventually upped anastrozole to 1mg ed. And STILL; my e2 was 0.51 pmol, more than 3x the upper range for male... wonder would I still be "he" without anastrozole

But yeah, with 125mg e5D my labs were down to 550 mg/dl three days after injection, so I need more than an average gyu. And I start to lost my libido and intrest in life, continous tiredness and easy argument, crumpy mood when I go under 600ng/dl.. I gues I'm build to function with higher levels and I metabolize me test super fast.. it's been four years.. I know it by now.

 

[Vince]

I don't know if you can have your shbg tested? But it sounds like you're a low shbg guy, most with low SHBG do much better with ED injections.

 

[Krocco]

I don't know if you can have your shbg tested? But it sounds like you're a low shbg guy, most with low SHBG do much better with ED injections.

No its not low.. 21 nmol was pulled this may..
Daily injectig would propably be unneccessary just because of that. But, it seems to be that I get e2 problems too easily so I want to balance that out. Anastrozole is really difficuld med for me. I need it because e2 symptoms jump in really agressivly and numbers jump very high really quickly. And then vice versa, a small amount of zole (0.125 to .25 mg) crashes my e2 for day or two. So anything to minimize the need of AI is very welcome here. Lowering dosage of T is not an good option cause I don't get my T levels high eunogh with lower dosage.

 

[Airborne Warrior]

21 n/mol is pretty low considering SHBG range is roughly between 19 - 83 n/mol.

 

[madman]

Hi gyus!
Been on trt about 4 years of now. I startes with local doctors standard failure: 1000mg nebido inkection every 12 weeks. Well suprise surprise it didn't really work... I changed doctor and got him to prescribe sustanon25. Starting from 250mg every 3 weeks (hooray) anf after bloods he prescribed it every 2 weeks.. then the estradiol rise too high and he pressed the panic button and stopped my trt at once. Well I didn't panic, I went to see an specialist to our contrys capital and he put me on sustanon 250mg every 10 days and anastrozole. After bloods he told me to inject 125mg every 5 days to control etradiol better and eventually it changed to 83mg e3.5d protocol..
Estradiol is damn big problem for me.. so after trial and error I'm now going to go with enanthate 25mg ED and a tiny drop of scrotal tostran-gel to up DHT wich is low on me with just injections protocol. Goal is to eliminate anastrozol usage complitely. Just one thing makes me wonder and I'd like to hear more opinnions:
Wich is better? To inject TestE in the morning when it peaks at night (and gel at the morning ofcourse) or should I pin testE at the eavening to make it peak in the morning when the gel peak also occurs? The later option would better mimic the natural circadian rhytm.. or does it really matter at this point at all??

Exogenous injectable testosterone regardless of the ester used whether (propionate/cypionate/enanthate) will in no way no how mimic the natural circadian rhythm even when injecting daily.

The closest one could get is from use of the patch or transdermal.

As others have stated you need to know your SHBG as it will dictate ones dose/injection frequency and is critical to the effectiveness of ones trt protocol.

Testosterone enanthate/cypionate peak 24-48 hrs after injection as oppose to propionate which peaks 12-14 hrs after injection.

 

[madman]

I don't have HCG or anything else but test in my regime.. tried HCG once, took it 100IU a day and it blow-up my e2, range is <0.15 pmol/l for men in the scale we use here.. and with 175mg test per week, 100IU hcg ED, and eventually upped anastrozole to 1mg ed. And STILL; my e2 was 0.51 pmol, more than 3x the upper range for male... wonder would I still be "he" without anastrozole

But yeah, with 125mg e5D my labs were down to 550 mg/dl three days after injection, so I need more than an average gyu. And I start to lost my libido and intrest in life, continous tiredness and easy argument, crumpy mood when I go under 600ng/dl.. I gues I'm build to function with higher levels and I metabolize me test super fast.. it's been four years.. I know it by now.

As others have stated.....low SHBG?

 

[madman]

No its not low.. 21 nmol was pulled this may..
Daily injectig would propably be unneccessary just because of that. But, it seems to be that I get e2 problems too easily so I want to balance that out. Anastrozole is really difficuld med for me. I need it because e2 symptoms jump in really agressivly and numbers jump very high really quickly. And then vice versa, a small amount of zole (0.125 to .25 mg) crashes my e2 for day or two. So anything to minimize the need of AI is very welcome here. Lowering dosage of T is not an good option cause I don't get my T levels high eunogh with lower dosage.

As Airborne Warrior stated an SHBG level of 21 nmol/L is definitely low!

You said your are a hypermetabolizer, TT levels drop quickly after injections, high e2 issues.....anything starting to ring a bell?

You need to stop worrying about where your TT sits as sure it is good to know but FT is what really matters as it is the unbound active fraction of testosterone.

You never mention once what your FT levels are?

 

[Vince]

No its not low.. 21 nmol was pulled this may..
Daily injectig would propably be unneccessary just because of that. But, it seems to be that I get e2 problems too easily so I want to balance that out. Anastrozole is really difficuld med for me. I need it because e2 symptoms jump in really agressivly and numbers jump very high really quickly. And then vice versa, a small amount of zole (0.125 to .25 mg) crashes my e2 for day or two. So anything to minimize the need of AI is very welcome here. Lowering dosage of T is not an good option cause I don't get my T levels high eunogh with lower dosage.

I also like to do daily injection to eliminate the Peaks and valleys, even though I'm not a low shpg guy. I did it to lower my HCT, I don't know if that's the reason I no longer have to donate blood or I just it's stabilized because of long term trt.

 

[Bryan]

Exogenous injectable testosterone regardless of the ester used whether (propionate/cypionate/enanthate) will in no way no how mimic the natural circadian rhythm even when injecting daily.

The closest one could get is from use of the patch or transdermal.

As others have stated you need to know your SHBG as it will dictate ones dose/injection frequency and is critical to the effectiveness of ones trt protocol.

Testosterone enanthate/cypionate peak 24-48 hrs after injection as oppose to propionate which peaks 12-14 hrs after injection.

Madman, My protocol is 50MG every 4 days, 150 IU of HCG every 4 days, and no AI.. My last blood work showed 763TT, 16FT, 43 Estradiol, and 46 SHBG.. My question is this, my 1st day or two after injection, I feel like crap..Tired, bags under the eyes, etc..After that, I feel good. Do you think this has to do with injection frequency? Do you think with my SHBG being on the high side, I should inject larger doses, less frequently?

 

[Krocco]

As Airborne Warrior stated an SHBG level of 21 nmol/L is definitely low!

You said your are a hypermetabolizer, TT levels drop quickly after injections, high e2 issues.....anything starting to ring a bell?

You need to stop worrying about where your TT sits as sure it is good to know but FT is what really matters as it is the unbound active fraction of testosterone.

You never mention once what your FT levels are?

No when thinking that way, well yes some bells are ringing.. my SHBG was something 36-38nmol/l pre trt.. and they have come down roughly 5 nmol per year while on trt...
FreeT is improved.. atleast free calculated T, cause SHBG is dropping.. my freeT was (last time i cheked) 350 pmol/l (ref: 155-800) before next injection but that was 125mg of sust e5d so it should be higher now when going daily shots.

 

[Jay555]

My protocol is 16 mg of testosterone cypionate daily, 500 iu of HCG twice a week, 25 mg of DHEA and no AI.

testosterone serum 1117 ng/dL range 264 - 916
Free T 30.3 pg/mL range 6.6 - 18.1
DHEA - Sulfate 347.3 range 48.9 - 344.2
Estradiol, Sensitive 29.5 range 8.0 - 35.0
SHBG 48.8 range 19.3 - 76.4
HCT 47.9 range 37.5 - 51.0

Reply

Are u doing subQ injections?

 

[Vince]

Are u doing subQ injections?

I use for both testosterone and HCG Easy Touch 29g 1/2" syringe for a shallow IM. I inject in my shoulders and VG.


https://www.excelmale.com/community...-no-aspiration-needed-avoids-all-nerves.7671/

 

[Jay555]

I use for both testosterone and HCG Easy Touch 29g 1/2" syringe for a shallow IM. I inject in my shoulders and VG.


https://www.excelmale.com/community...-no-aspiration-needed-avoids-all-nerves.7671/

I’m on week 4 don’t feel good yet feel the same I was using the 25g 5/8” needle how would I know if I’m hitting the muscle If I’m doing IM? Delts and quads and I just switch to 25g 1” now testosterone cyp every other day 0.2ml thank you

 

[Vince]

I’m on week 4 don’t feel good yet feel the same I was using the 25g 5/8” needle how would I know if I’m hitting the muscle If I’m doing IM? Delts and quads and I just switch to 25g 1” now testosterone cyp every other day 0.2ml thank you

I never think about it too much, if I'm hitting a muscle or if I'm injecting fat. The only thing I know is that it works, I believe I'm injecting in a muscle but if I'm doing a Sub-Q it's working for me.

 

[Jay555]

I never think about it too much, if I'm hitting a muscle or if I'm injecting fat. The only thing I know is that it works, I believe I'm injecting in a muscle but if I'm doing a Sub-Q it's working for me.

How long did it take for u to start feeling good ?

 

[MarkM]

.... I was using the 25g 5/8” needle how would I know if I’m hitting the muscle If I’m doing IM? Delts and quads and I just switch to 25g 1” now testosterone cyp every other day 0.2ml thank you

If you poke your deltoid or quad with your index finger and it is solid then you are going to hit muscle when you inject with a 5/8 needle. If you poke those same areas with your index finger and your finger sinks into the skin past the depth of your fingernail then you are going to be injecting SubQ (into the fat). At least that's my rule of thumb.

I use a 28 gauge 1/2" and inject IM in the deltoid, vastus lateralis (outer thigh) and in the VG (ventrogluteal).

Whether IM or SubQ, ether will work for you.