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I post this occasionally to remind people to be careful with making inferences from LH measurements. Overall there's going to be a correlation with testosterone. But with any single measurement you don't know where you are with respect to the pulses. Endogenous testosterone is going to be like a...

They are, but that should read "high starting dose". You added a "majority of men" qualifier. I'm not claiming to have quantified the rate at which men have problems at this dose. My point is that a midrange dose, say 50-80 mg TC/week, is less likely to cause side effects. While the general...

https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/nda/2019/209863Orig1s000SumR.pdf Nonetheless, it makes sense to titrate to the center of the healthy normal distribution for initial dosing. That's not a claim I have made, though it would undoubtedly be true if out-of-range free testosterone...

That's patently false. I called the 60-70% figure a rough guess initially and then provided the statistics to back it up, showing a more accurate number was only 5% outside of my estimated range. And speaking of prevarication, as long as we're letting AI do the heavy lifting for us: - However...

Some interesting stuff there, but I suspect it's far from complete. More discussion of testosterone's link to antisocial effects is needed. A small point, but I have to somewhat question the statement that "even modest increases in lethal cancer late in life would select against chronically...

Cite at least three of the "numerous studies" showing people doing "really well" long-term at these doses. A few months of dose-response testing doesn't count. What is really telling is the high churn rates for the standard forms of TRT, including injections, which at least prior to Xyosted were...

I do recognize that my preferred strategy of starting at the lower end is unlikely to be adopted. If you read my posts you'll see that my actual recommendations are for starting with mid levels, 60-70 mg TC/week or so. Anything to get away from the stupidity of starting at 100+ mg. If you insist...

We could debate ad nauseam where such a cutoff should be. But you're just trying to evade my main argument, which is that there's no justification for starting TRT at high-end doses. You haven't even attempted to refute this in any serious, science-based fashion. Using excessive amounts of...

I noted that one reference range for daily testosterone production is about 3-9 mg. That translates to 30-90 mg TC per week. If you want to go by anecdotes then there are a "TON" of guys who suffer from supraphysiological and even high-normal dosing. I've already linked to the list twice in...

No, according to me, 50 mg TC/week (5 mg T/day) is a mid-level physiological dose. This is in the context of typical production for healthy young men of 6-7 mg/day, and an overall reference range of something like 3-9 mg/day. I have used as little as 3.7 mg T/day in the form of a TP/TE blend and...

The main problem I have with this is that you have no idea what physiological doses are like. What you haven't demonstrated is that one can compensate for the differences between endogenous and exogenous testosterone simply by giving more exogenous testosterone. I would argue that such...

Stop to think about this. There's no reasonable basis for ruling out most of the physiological range for dosing. Don't succumb to pressure from those who are simply rationalizing their excessive doses. Suppose you would feel the best at 60-70 mg per week in divided doses? We haven't emphasized...

The usual more-is-better thinking that leads to a total loss of objectivity and harms many. Not sure why you say this when: the dose is more testosterone than all but a small fraction of men could produce naturally; it's probably on the order of double what the OP would have produced at his...

There's minimal, if any, research on this. I asked Grok to speculate on the time frame, assuming the effect exists. It was guessing from a few days to a week for any significant effects, with full equilibrium returning within two weeks.

You already know the answer. https://www.excelmale.com/threads/starting-trt-soon.32170/post-296946

This isn't necessarily relevant and could get people into trouble. Some of these products contain 450 mg of lithium carbonate per tablet. Lithium carbonate is about 19% lithium, so you're talking about 85 mg of lithium. In contrast, this thread is talking about doses ranging from around 0.3 mg...

I've been getting about a milligram daily of elemental lithium via lithium orotate for some years now. I can't claim any very noticeable effects, but it seems worthwhile to take due to the positive associations and claimed protective effects.

Wrong on both counts. Follow the links. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8631164/ https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC11070513/

Coincidentally the main forum page currently has threads by @madman highlighting research with cautionary statements about the effects of androgens on the brain. It might be argued that a lot of this applies only to doses well in excess of the 100-200 mg TC per week that I complain about...

I'd say it's better to use them concurrently, at least as adjuncts to TRT; they should be strictly complementary. The reasoning is that kisspeptin provides both kisspeptin and GnRH signaling. Negative HPTA feedback affects kisspeptin production more than its action, meaning exogenous kisspeptin...

The Androgel experience ended up being poor, primarily due to absorption issues. After that decent TT measurement the next one was 160 ng/dL. Even as a trough value that's not viable. Injections were an improvement, yet far from "the answer". Admittedly one of the few things I've haven't tried...

That smoking analogy is only meant to highlight that a possible risk factor should not be dismissed just because causality is not yet established. Testosterone levels are associated with a U-shaped mortality curve in some studies, particularly in men. Research indicates that both low and high...

A one-size-fits-all approach is a doctor who gives all his patients 140 mg TC per week right from the start. And from there his plan is bloodletting to control cases of high hematocrit and AIs to address symptoms of high estradiol. This results in unnecessary suffering by many of his patients...

There's this complexity, and probably even more. I have dabbled with anastrozole when my TRT dose was higher, and I also had a period with very low estradiol for some other reason. I don't recall that these had much effect on motivation. The anastrozole would dampen excessive emotionalism. Very...

Is the "one size" my counsel for moderation when starting out? If so you're acting as though the low-and-slow approach to hormone replacement—and often to meds/supplements in general—is some weird idea I came up with at random. Do you remember John Crisler?

It's absurd to characterize a normal range that encompasses at least 95% of the population as "one size". Furthermore, as a long-time resident here you should be well aware that being an outlier is problematic, and is associated with reduced longevity and other problems. You've convinced...

The usual straw-man nonsense. Let me fix that for you: "Physiological testosterone levels equal better health."

Actions speak louder than words. Even Defy Medical seems to routinely start guys with well over 100 mg TC/week. Yet the available evidence does not support this approach when overall good health is the goal. It's easily inferred that this is a result of more-is-better thinking specific to...

I think compared to hypogonadism even dated TRT protocols would provide some relief. But you must be aware that nobody around here is going to recommend taking 200 mg TC once every two weeks. It's not an assumption, but standard medical practice for just about any hormone other than...

That's a bit of a hit-and-run. I'm prepared to defend my hypotheses, particularly the one saying that a starting dose of 100 mg TC/week is excessive. The main caveat is that these high doses came about due to the assumption of infrequent injections—once or twice a month to once a week. Under...

For quite some time I was using 18 mg TE EOD, which resulted in TT of ~800 ng/dL, SHBG ~30 nMol/L. Vermeulen calculated free T was around 20 ng/dL, which puts it in the mid to lower part of the top quartile for healthy younger men. The worst symptom I'd link to this was a persistent headache. It...