DIM + Calcium D-Glucarate VS AI

[Powerdome]

Firstly, thanks to all who take the time to respond to these posts

1. Dr Crisler recommended taking 200mg and 1000mg respectively per day of each above mentioned supplements. What have members felt as a result of including these supplements into their HRT protocol?

2. For someone who has E2 problems, will this combination be of benefit or will an AI be needed. Last E2 result was 92.00pg/ml (note: not sensitive )

I ask as I have been trying to lower the anxiousness I sometimes get (usually in the morning) from my HRT. I take 25mg EOD SQ.

I wonder whether I need to look at adding HCG or pregnenolone to enhance my mood? Back pathways etc

 

[Vince]

The first thing I would do, get the proper estradiol test. If you can't get through your doctor, use discount labs.
https://www.discountedlabs.com/

ESTRADIOL , Sensitive (LC/MS/MS)

SKU estradiol-sensitive-b


Special Price$52.92was$73.50

Review and Add to Cart

I do inject HCG 500iu every 3 1/2 days, but is not for everyone.
​

 

[CoastWatcher]

Firstly, thanks to all who take the time to respond to these posts

1. Dr Crisler recommended taking 200mg and 1000mg respectively per day of each above mentioned supplements. What have members felt as a result of including these supplements into their HRT protocol?

2. For someone who has E2 problems, will this combination be of benefit or will an AI be needed. Last E2 result was 92.00pg/ml (note: not sensitive )

I ask as I have been trying to lower the anxiousness I sometimes get (usually in the morning) from my HRT. I take 25mg EOD SQ.

I wonder whether I need to look at adding HCG or pregnenolone to enhance my mood? Back pathways etc

If you confirm, via the sensitive estradiol test, that your levels are really as elevated as your bloodwork suggests they might be, you will not lower them to an appreciable degree with DIM or Calcium D Glucarate. If that was possible, every man working to manage out of control e2 would be using these OTC supplements rather than turning to a prescription AI.

 

[HealthMan]

I recently lowered my testosterone dosage and stopped taking Anastrozole. I have added DIM + Calcium D Glucarate + Zinc. DIM really boosts my libido. I believe if your estradiol is just marginally elevated these supplements can really help you avoid an AI. DIM in theory can change the ratio of estrogen metabolites to more beneficial level. Calcium D Glucarate is suppose to diminish reabsorption of estradiol. And Zinc seems to act as a weak aromatase inhibitor.
Also a lot of users (including myself) had luck lowering estradiol levels by increasing injection frequency (however for me this negatively impacted my HCT levels).
So I believe that a combination of all these should be enough for most people to avoid an AI. However a lot of TRT users chase numbers and aim for high FT and TT levels which makes impossible TRT without an AI. A lot of them would be surprised how well they might feel on lower dosages.

 

[CoastWatcher]

I recently lowered my testosterone dosage and stopped taking Anastrozole. I have added DIM + Calcium D Glucarate + Zinc. DIM really boosts my libido. I believe if your estradiol is just marginally elevated these supplements can really help you avoid an AI. DIM in theory can change the ratio of estrogen metabolites to more beneficial level. Calcium D Glucarate is suppose to diminish reabsorption of estradiol. And Zinc seems to act as a weak aromatase inhibitor.
Also a lot of users (including myself) had luck lowering estradiol levels by increasing injection frequency (however for me this negatively impacted my HCT levels).
So I believe that a combination of all these should be enough for most people to avoid an AI. However a lot of TRT users chase numbers and aim for high FT and TT levels which makes impossible TRT without an AI. A lot of them would be surprised how well they might feel on lower dosages.

All excellent points. I achieved stable estradiol levels via doseage manipulation, too. Remind us of your protocol?

 

[HealthMan]

All excellent points. I achieved stable estradiol levels via doseage manipulation, too. Remind us of your protocol?

Testosterone cypionate 55mg E3.5 days
HCG 500IU E3.5 days
FSH 50IU E3.5 days
10mg DHEA per day
10mg Pregnenolone per day

DIM Plus Natures Way - 2 caps in the morning
NOW Calcium D Glucarate 500mg - 1 cap in the morning
NOW OptiZinc - 1 cap at night

I stopped daily injections because my HCT went too high (despite lower testosterone levels) and because I saw no benefits that would justify the daily poking.
I think that maybe more frequent injections might be detrimental to HCT. For instance a of people seems to have HCT issues when moving from once weekly to twice weekly. That might be because more frequent peaks or more time above physiological levels not sure.

 

[galaxy]

Not too hijack this thread. But how what's the purpose of you taking the FSH HealthMan? Is it to do more of the backfilling idea? I know it's been used sucessfully to increase spermatogenesis is it to retain fertility? How much are you paying for it and were you able to notice any subjective or quantitative differences?

I'm currently taking Androgel and HCG 500 IU E3.5 days in order to maintain fertility and backfill pathways.

 

[Vince]

Not too hijack this thread. But how what's the purpose of you taking the FSH HealthMan? Is it to do more of the backfilling idea? I know it's been used sucessfully to increase spermatogenesis is it to retain fertility? How much are you paying for it and were you able to notice any subjective or quantitative differences?

I'm currently taking Androgel and HCG 500 IU E3.5 days in order to maintain fertility and backfill pathways.

Semen analysis results after adding FSH to TRT and hCG

https://www.excelmale.com/forum/sho...lysis-results-after-adding-FSH-to-TRT-and-hCG

 

[HealthMan]

Not too hijack this thread. But how what's the purpose of you taking the FSH HealthMan? Is it to do more of the backfilling idea? I know it's been used sucessfully to increase spermatogenesis is it to retain fertility? How much are you paying for it and were you able to notice any subjective or quantitative differences?

I'm currently taking Androgel and HCG 500 IU E3.5 days in order to maintain fertility and backfill pathways.

Fertility. HCG didnt work for me to keep fertility and it doesn’t work for a lot of guys on TRT.
It costs me ~ 1500 a year. Fuller testicles and i think i feel better but it can be all in my mind (so def not worth the cost to improve how i feel). It is just insurance in case I decide to have another child in the future

 

[galaxy]

Right thanks HealthMan. I read your post that Vince referenced. I know people often use HCG to backfill the pathways and upstream hormones. Outside of cost is there any reason people don't do the same with FSH?

Also are you injecting all 3 out of the same syringe similar to Nelson's combined HCG/Test protocol?

 

[HR_Watson]

I've tried the DIM and C-D-G, and it caused an unreal amount of depression and anxiety for me. This was after about a week daily usage. As soon as I went off, things felt better a few days later.

I didn't have any bloodwork happening, so I can't say for sure what it was doing to me...but boy did I feel terrible.

 

[HealthMan]

Right thanks HealthMan. I read your post that Vince referenced. I know people often use HCG to backfill the pathways and upstream hormones. Outside of cost is there any reason people don't do the same with FSH?

Also are you injecting all 3 out of the same syringe similar to Nelson's combined HCG/Test protocol?

I am no expert but I dont see any other benefit from FSH other than fertility in men. I inject HCG and FSH together using a 30G insulin syringe and testosterone using a testosterone 28G insulin syringe.

 

[Will Brink]

Firstly, thanks to all who take the time to respond to these posts

1. Dr Crisler recommended taking 200mg and 1000mg respectively per day of each above mentioned supplements. What have members felt as a result of including these supplements into their HRT protocol?

2. For someone who has E2 problems, will this combination be of benefit or will an AI be needed. Last E2 result was 92.00pg/ml (note: not sensitive )

I ask as I have been trying to lower the anxiousness I sometimes get (usually in the morning) from my HRT. I take 25mg EOD SQ.

I wonder whether I need to look at adding HCG or pregnenolone to enhance my mood? Back pathways etc

Only way to find out is to try it, but I don't find they really do much if anything at all. What are your other numbers like? What's your bodyfat %?

 

[Vince Carter]

Firstly, thanks to all who take the time to respond to these posts

1. Dr Crisler recommended taking 200mg and 1000mg respectively per day of each above mentioned supplements. What have members felt as a result of including these supplements into their HRT protocol?

2. For someone who has E2 problems, will this combination be of benefit or will an AI be needed. Last E2 result was 92.00pg/ml (note: not sensitive )

I ask as I have been trying to lower the anxiousness I sometimes get (usually in the morning) from my HRT. I take 25mg EOD SQ.

I wonder whether I need to look at adding HCG or pregnenolone to enhance my mood? Back pathways etc

May help with some symptoms of high E but will not substitute or reduce E as an AI will. I think both are junk supplements, having tried them multiple times.

 

[Powerdome]

Only way to find out is to try it, but I don't find they really do much if anything at all. What are your other numbers like? What's your bodyfat %?

My BF is around 11-12% TT 575 FT 11

 

[Powerdome]

I was listening to the TRT podcast with Dr Crisler last night and he is almost against ED or EOD shots. He thinks twice per week shots are good enough.
I only tried EOD low does shots of 25mg because of another guest on the TRT podcast (Dr Nikos Sakkas) advised this would lower the amount of E2 conversion (which is what I am aiming for. Anything to avoid an AI.)
Its a process to be sure!

 

[Powerdome]

The first thing I would do, get the proper estradiol test. If you can't get through your doctor, use discount labs.
https://www.discountedlabs.com/

ESTRADIOL , Sensitive (LC/MS/MS)

SKU estradiol-sensitive-b


Special Price$52.92was$73.50

Review and Add to Cart

I do inject HCG 500iu every 3 1/2 days, but is not for everyone.
​

I live in Korea Vince, still trying to see if that test is even possible!

 

[Mountain Man]

Anybody got suggestions on a good brand of DIM that they have had success with?

 

[Vince]

Anybody got suggestions on a good brand of DIM that they have had success with?

After reading this thread, I probably would order Nature's Way.

Huge increase in libido with DIM​

https://www.excelmale.com/forum/showthread.php?13585-Huge-increase-in-libido-with-DIM

 

[Vince Carter]

I was listening to the TRT podcast with Dr Crisler last night and he is almost against ED or EOD shots. He thinks twice per week shots are good enough.
I only tried EOD low does shots of 25mg because of another guest on the TRT podcast (Dr Nikos Sakkas) advised this would lower the amount of E2 conversion (which is what I am aiming for. Anything to avoid an AI.)
Its a process to be sure!

Actually his and I wont presume to read between the lines on that subject but I believe some of his stance there is guys not staying compliant with daily injections as you have to have the right attitude towards it for sticking yourself everyday. Yet in contrary the current HCG protocol he likes is 100iu...daily.