Hi All,
I'm a male, 32, with normal/solid levels of testosterone (650 ng/dl TT). I've been exercising on and off since I was a teenager but have only been on a proper weightlifting and diet protocol for the past 6 months with a professional bodybuilder with my main goal being to obtain a great body. I’ve seen some modest improvements in my physique, however, my genes are just not suited to gain fat free mass commensurately with the effort I put into my diet and exercise routine. To get the same results most people would, I’d have to work out twice as hard and with a perfect diet (weighing food, eliminating refined sugar, managing calories and fat intake to an extreme degree, etc.), essentially indefinitely.
I understand the importance of patience and I'm willing to wait to see results, but the point is that the sacrifice is just too great if it means doing this forever. Eating rice, broccoli, and chicken breast is no way to live, especially because I'm a huge foodie and amateur chef and enjoying unhealthy meals is a principal enjoyment of life for me. Thus, I’m exploring TRT to increase my TT to the 1,100 range ng/dl as a means of giving me the ability to get a great body while maintaining a somewhat normal diet. Of course, I’m no fool and understand that TRT is not a magic cure; I’ll still have to monitor my diet, consume proper amounts of protein, and maintain a consistent exercise routine regardless of any exogenous means of enhancement. But the hope is that TRT will obviously give me a solid edge so that the results are more commensurate with the sacrifices I’m making.
With that in mind, I’m trying to understand whether it is worth the risk to see the results. But most discussions on this forum are centered on older men who want to bring their T levels up to normal ranges (i.e. as a treatment for those who are medically indicated for it) rather than people like me who are pursuing it mainly for aesthetic reasons. So I’m not really sure what the risks are… So the main overarching question is:
Is taking TRT at a relatively young age when my levels are normal and bringing them to supraphysiological levels (1,100-1,200 ng/dl TT) for an extended period of time (many years) risky to my health assuming I am following the monitoring and management targets set by Nelson (hematocrit, blood pressure, etc.) to ensure there are no signs of cardiovascular or other issues? Essentially, what I’m asking is: what are the risks of increasing testosterone to supraphysiological levels over the long term?
[Same question for HCG]
[Same question for HGH, specifically Ipamorelin + CJC-1295]
Most of the studies I’ve seen show that TRT improves nearly all-cause mortality when increased from pathologically low levels up to normal levels, but I haven’t been able to find any data on supraphysiological levels. @madman shared a great post that showed that there are risks to neurological health with supraphysiological doses (Androgen abuse and the brain) but he used the catchall term of ‘androgens’ and the studies he referenced mentioned ‘AAS’, so I wasn’t able to determine if this was limited specifically to TRT or if it included synthetics (i.e. steroid abuse) as well.
By the way, I didn’t mean to bore everyone with a full background on my life story and reasoning; I’m just trying to pre-empt the inevitable responses that are some iteration of “it ain’t broke, don’t fix it”, which is what most doctors would say; that is, that I shouldn’t increase my T levels when they are already in healthy ranges purely for aesthetic reasons. I respectfully disagree. According to that logic, nobody should get nose jobs or breast implants. There’s nothing “wrong” with using modern technology to improve your appearance. It’s just a question of risk and reward, according to each individual’s risk tolerance and goals in life. For example, using anabolic steroids will provide immense improvements, but the pros are outweighed by the cons in this instance. It’s a personal decision, as I’m sure many of you would agree with.
Thank you all so much!
@Nelson Vergel
@Vince
I'm a male, 32, with normal/solid levels of testosterone (650 ng/dl TT). I've been exercising on and off since I was a teenager but have only been on a proper weightlifting and diet protocol for the past 6 months with a professional bodybuilder with my main goal being to obtain a great body. I’ve seen some modest improvements in my physique, however, my genes are just not suited to gain fat free mass commensurately with the effort I put into my diet and exercise routine. To get the same results most people would, I’d have to work out twice as hard and with a perfect diet (weighing food, eliminating refined sugar, managing calories and fat intake to an extreme degree, etc.), essentially indefinitely.
I understand the importance of patience and I'm willing to wait to see results, but the point is that the sacrifice is just too great if it means doing this forever. Eating rice, broccoli, and chicken breast is no way to live, especially because I'm a huge foodie and amateur chef and enjoying unhealthy meals is a principal enjoyment of life for me. Thus, I’m exploring TRT to increase my TT to the 1,100 range ng/dl as a means of giving me the ability to get a great body while maintaining a somewhat normal diet. Of course, I’m no fool and understand that TRT is not a magic cure; I’ll still have to monitor my diet, consume proper amounts of protein, and maintain a consistent exercise routine regardless of any exogenous means of enhancement. But the hope is that TRT will obviously give me a solid edge so that the results are more commensurate with the sacrifices I’m making.
With that in mind, I’m trying to understand whether it is worth the risk to see the results. But most discussions on this forum are centered on older men who want to bring their T levels up to normal ranges (i.e. as a treatment for those who are medically indicated for it) rather than people like me who are pursuing it mainly for aesthetic reasons. So I’m not really sure what the risks are… So the main overarching question is:
Is taking TRT at a relatively young age when my levels are normal and bringing them to supraphysiological levels (1,100-1,200 ng/dl TT) for an extended period of time (many years) risky to my health assuming I am following the monitoring and management targets set by Nelson (hematocrit, blood pressure, etc.) to ensure there are no signs of cardiovascular or other issues? Essentially, what I’m asking is: what are the risks of increasing testosterone to supraphysiological levels over the long term?
[Same question for HCG]
[Same question for HGH, specifically Ipamorelin + CJC-1295]
Most of the studies I’ve seen show that TRT improves nearly all-cause mortality when increased from pathologically low levels up to normal levels, but I haven’t been able to find any data on supraphysiological levels. @madman shared a great post that showed that there are risks to neurological health with supraphysiological doses (Androgen abuse and the brain) but he used the catchall term of ‘androgens’ and the studies he referenced mentioned ‘AAS’, so I wasn’t able to determine if this was limited specifically to TRT or if it included synthetics (i.e. steroid abuse) as well.
By the way, I didn’t mean to bore everyone with a full background on my life story and reasoning; I’m just trying to pre-empt the inevitable responses that are some iteration of “it ain’t broke, don’t fix it”, which is what most doctors would say; that is, that I shouldn’t increase my T levels when they are already in healthy ranges purely for aesthetic reasons. I respectfully disagree. According to that logic, nobody should get nose jobs or breast implants. There’s nothing “wrong” with using modern technology to improve your appearance. It’s just a question of risk and reward, according to each individual’s risk tolerance and goals in life. For example, using anabolic steroids will provide immense improvements, but the pros are outweighed by the cons in this instance. It’s a personal decision, as I’m sure many of you would agree with.
Thank you all so much!
@Nelson Vergel
@Vince
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